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by **Anakin S.** » Sat Feb 05, 2005 1:40 pm

Why wouldn't it move? I would think that the chicken would only need some speed and A_Chase in its walking frames. And if you had a few frames in dehacked set aside for the chicken, then you would only need to change the sprite family to rkey.

by **HotWax** » Sat Feb 05, 2005 1:32 pm

And would move just as fast.

by **Anakin S.** » Sat Feb 05, 2005 1:06 pm

Make sprite lumps named rkeya1, rkeya2a8, rkeya3a7, rkeya4a6, rkeya5, and so on in your wadfile and load the chicken images to those frames. It's only the sprite family names that matter in picking up items, so rkeyc, rkeyd, rkeye, and so on would work just as well as pickups as would rkeya and rkeyb.

by **Cutmanmike** » Sat Feb 05, 2005 6:49 am

Yes, this is the problem me and hotwax had with CTC. It took us ages to figure out how to make the red key.... err... I mean chicken move

by **Killo Zapit** » Sat Feb 05, 2005 6:04 am

Oops, I guess your right. Well it worked in the original at least.

by **EarthQuake** » Sat Feb 05, 2005 1:16 am

Nope

by **Killo Zapit** » Thu Feb 03, 2005 8:06 pm

If changing the offsets doesn't work try altering the actual text it's self. I know for sure that that does work.

by **EarthQuake** » Thu Feb 03, 2005 7:30 pm

Killo Zapit wrote:What you can do in DEHACKED is edit the text for the associated sprite number to point to another graphic though. I did that once a long time ago to remap the blue armor sprite (ARM2) to the green armor sprite (ARM1) (that way I could translate it and the green armor into brown leather armor and the blue armor into gray metal armor instead). You could do that to turn the blur sphere spite (PINS) to any sprite you want, just go in the sprites menu in dehacked and change the text offset, or failing that, the text menu and change the text that references the sprite its self. I have no idea how well this works with ZDoom, but it worked in vanilla doom great. It may be easier to use decorate subclass the blur sphere and replace its frames though.

I just tried both of what you suggested. WhackEd doesn't allow you to change sprite offsets, so I started up dehacked on my other computer and made me a patch, but when I ran it in zdoom, nothing happened at all. The blur sphere was just that, a blur sphere. Also, when I changed the text offset to point to the armor, the behavior is the same as my first two attempts.

So... this means the only way to do what I want is to replace the blur sphere sprites with green armor sprites. It's the only way.

I just had a scary thought.. what if some demonic force wanted to torture me by not letting my sprite replacements work?

by **Killo Zapit** » Thu Feb 03, 2005 12:04 pm

What you can do in DEHACKED is edit the text for the associated sprite number to point to another graphic though. I did that once a long time ago to remap the blue armor sprite (ARM2) to the green armor sprite (ARM1) (that way I could translate it and the green armor into brown leather armor and the blue armor into gray metal armor instead). You could do that to turn the blur sphere spite (PINS) to any sprite you want, just go in the sprites menu in dehacked and change the text offset, or failing that, the text menu and change the text that references the sprite its self. I have no idea how well this works with ZDoom, but it worked in vanilla doom great. It may be easier to use decorate subclass the blur sphere and replace its frames though.

by **Enjay** » Thu Feb 03, 2005 11:34 am

OK, for a final update on what happens with my 2 scenarios:

1. Graf was quite correct. Mapping the soul sphere to the pain elemental respawn frames and leaving them using PE sprites causes Doom2.exe to crash with this message:

P_SpecialThing: Unknown gettable thing

In Zdoom, you just walk through the object, as if it wasn't there. No crash, but no pickup either.

2. Doing the above, but then getting the PE frames to use the soul sphere sprites (any of them) makes the item work normally in both doom2.exe and zdoom.

In addition, changing the PE frames to use the blue armour frames does indeed make the pickup behave like a blue armour object.

I'm glad this came up because it cleared up something that I had obviously assumed incorrectly about how Doom/Zdoom works. I'm just amazed that, despite having done loads of hacks to Doom pickups, I've never actually caused this problem or done anything to make me realise it wasn't working as I had assumed.

by **Graf Zahl** » Thu Feb 03, 2005 11:03 am

EarthQuake wrote:Okay, I've accepted this, but IMO it's probably the stupidest thing I've ever heard.

Don't worry. You are not alone. This totally smells like development garbage that was never changed in the later stages. And for a game that is released commercially without any serious plans to allow this kind of modification it makes sense to leave it in. Don't forget that back then nobody could even imagine DEHACKED.
It's regrettable that ZDoom has to emulate this crap but then, DEHACKED should be obsolete soon (hopefully) so it will only remain as a backwards compatibility option.

by **randi** » Thu Feb 03, 2005 10:53 am

EarthQuake wrote:Why do my patches behave exactly the way I wanted them to in ZDaemon adn older versions of ZDoom?

Because 1.22 is wrong. It changed item handling to be class-based instead of sprite-based, but it did not have any compatibility code in Dehacked to make it look like it was still sprite-based. If you go even older than 1.22 (like 1.17c), your patch would behave as it does with 2.0.96.

by **EarthQuake** » Thu Feb 03, 2005 10:42 am

Okay, I've accepted this, but IMO it's probably the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Thanks and sorry, this may have been a blow to me, but at least I'll know now. Still, one thing is unanswered:

Why do my patches behave exactly the way I wanted them to in ZDaemon adn older versions of ZDoom?

by **Enjay** » Thu Feb 03, 2005 9:49 am

OK, thanks. I'll check the second thing out when I get a chance and report back.

by **Graf Zahl** » Thu Feb 03, 2005 8:00 am

Enjay wrote:
OK, so if I make a pickup, say the soul sphere, use the pain elemental respawn frames (final frame altered to go back to the sequence start), but then allocate the blue armour sprite to those frames, the soul sphere will now behave as a blue armour pickup despite the fact that the frames being used are neither from the soul sphere or the blue armour? Is that correct?

correct

And what would happen if I didn't change the sprites for those frames? - ie I made the soul sphere use the PE respawn frames, but left those frames using the PE sprites. Would the item behave as a soul sphere?

Doom would abort with an error message. I have no idea what ZDoom would do in such a case.

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[Not a bug] Dehacked: Blur spheres give me green armor

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