ZDoom

by **Zippy** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 12:12 pm

Graf Zahl wrote:For that you have to change your graphic driver's quality settings. For some reason ATI's drivers completely screw up the title pic when the quality is set to low.

Yeah, if it I set it to maximum it works correctly. I'm going to leave it on it's balanced level though, as I've found that works best for me.

by **TheDarkArchon** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 8:43 am

Jim wrote: Is there really anyone here who doesn't have a 3D card?

My laptop doesn't have a 3D card.

by **Graf Zahl** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 2:35 am

For that you have to change your graphic driver's quality settings. For some reason ATI's drivers completely screw up the title pic when the quality is set to low.

by **Zippy** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 12:33 am

Graf Zahl wrote:Here's some other reasons why I don't like the software renderer and they are just as ugly

Which is pretty much why it's subjective. The clipping and palette limitations hardly bother me. Just as I'm sure in the same way it doesn't bother you so much seeing the sprites in that cardboard standup kind of way. The whole thing makes the co-existance of a software renderer and hardware renderer all the more desirable though. Everybody gets to pick their trade-offs then.

Bio Hazard wrote:Huh, works for me.

Spoiler:

by **Graf Zahl** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 4:00 pm

Blade Nightflame wrote:@Graf:

Then why actually have the damn models, if you do not prefer a better implentation of 3d models in the first place?

Because I can't do a better implementation before custom state labels are added. DECORATE actors can be so complex that it is impossible to define a usable definition format without them.

Furthermore I added the model support because I wanted to play Silent Steel properly which used a few vehicle models.

by **Nmn** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 3:34 pm

Blade Nightflame wrote:Until 3d models are implented atleast BETTER than we have it now, we'll stick to software rendering.

Speak for yourself.

I like software rendering for good ol' doom (for nostalgia's sake I prefer chocolate doom over risen 3d) but I must admit I very much appreciate the addition of open gl, 3d floors, dynamic lights and ofcourse 32 bit graphics, and the biggest addition-models, to gzdoom, as they open up great horizons of creativity, at least for me.

That said, I eagerly await a better model implementation, so they are at least lit by dynamic lighting properly. I can't request, in my modesty, for anything more. Eye candy aside, using models to create architectual meshes is something I've always been looking forward to, in (g)zdoom.

by **Ryan Cordell** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 2:32 pm

@Graf:

Then why actually have the damn models, if you do not prefer a better implentation of 3d models in the first place?

by **Graf Zahl** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 2:30 pm

Bio Hazard wrote:I kinda wished GZD would eventually get a CVAR to make it do that "sliding window" thing the software renderer does, that would solve #2 but would limit the vertical viewing angle.

Good luck waiting. Rest assured that this will never happen as IMO it looks even more ugly than paper-thin sprites. It's one of the biggest reasons why I don't like software rendering.

Here's some other reasons why I don't like the software renderer and they are just as ugly:

- Sprite clipping errors in highly detailed areas. There's nothing worse than a sprite that is chopped in parts by the floor beneath it.
- Palette limitations greatly affect the use of certain colors and they look bad by default (e.g. purple and blue - and please don't even mention cyan!)

So please don't tell me that one minor distraction is so bad that all the glitches of the software renderer are preferable.

@Blade Nightflame: If OpenGL is only acceptable to you with all the eye candy available, play Doomsday or Risen3D. Rest assured that GZDoom will never go in that direction so don't bother waiting.

by **Ryan Cordell** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 2:06 pm

Until 3d models are implented atleast BETTER than we have it now, we'll stick to software rendering.

by **Grubber** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 1:59 pm

Doom doesn't look good with all that fancy OpenGL stuff. At least for me.

by **Phobus** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 12:54 pm

I still prefer the software look TBH. For all of GZDooms fancy looks and stuff, the way Zdoom looks still does it for me.

by **Jim** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 12:25 pm

Graf Zahl wrote:
Blade Nightflame wrote:Can't wait till Polymost engine is in. The more I more I see features declined, the more I know how much Doom's code fucking sucks.

Good luck waiting. Randy already said that he doesn't want to write software texturing code for it.

Isn't there an easy solution: forget writing the software texturing code and do it in hardware. Is there really anyone here who doesn't have a 3D card?

by **Bio Hazard** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 11:54 am

I kinda wished GZD would eventually get a CVAR to make it do that "sliding window" thing the software renderer does, that would solve #2 but would limit the vertical viewing angle.

It's moot now that I use Linux though.

Zippy wrote:Another minor thing which I don't care about so much is that the title screen never ever shows up properly. It's always garbage.

Huh, works for me.

by **Zippy** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 11:49 am

Graf Zahl wrote:@Zippy: This sounds more like you are using incorrect settings. In what way does it look worse?

It's largely subjective. For me, the big things are:

1. Texture filtering. This is a setting though, so I have this disabled on any map that is mostly low res textures.
2. Wafer thin sprites. It always bothers me how that looks. I haven't found any settings which change this.
3. Sprites feet in the ground. This also always bothers me. I haven't found any setting for this either.

As I understand though, #2 and #3 are side effects to the OpenGL rendering which really cannot be helped. Or rather, they can't be helped in a sufficient enough way (e.g. if you made the sprites always face the player, then things STILL look unsual when looking at extreme angles.)

Another minor thing which I don't care about so much is that the title screen never ever shows up properly. It's always garbage.

by **Bio Hazard** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 11:27 am

Odd, I always found that GZD looked way better in every way once you configure the filtering to your liking.

ZDoom

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