Ashes Afterglow TC - closing the vault

[LaputanMachine]

I have a few comments about the weapons. Some are questions, others are concerns.

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- Does the Heavy Rifle upgrade do anything? It claims to enable automatic fire, but I thought this was already the case with the normal military rifle. The only thing I think it does is decrease recoil somewhat.
- I think the silenced machine pistol in DMW is broken. I've tried it in both the original and patched versions of Enriched, and both times it immediately alerted the enemies like nothing had changed. However, it does appear to give a bonus to accuracy, but that's not exactly why I bought the upgrade.
-The second upgrade for the lazer gun costs 300 junk, and claims so in the upgrade description, but the menu option to upgrade it still says 150 junk.
-The reload sound for the Desert Pump is far too loud, in my opinion. It's even louder than the actual gun firing! It should definitely be lowered to the same level as the other sounds of the weapon.
- Would it be practical to add upgrades to the pipebombs? I know why they don't have them right now because they're supposed to be used up and not kept like a normal weapon, but I think some interesting things could be done with them, like a remote mode or a incendiary charge.

[AmissaAnima]

Speaking of weapons i think that the basic crowbar that you use deserves to have upgrades as well. I find myself using it quite often when dealing with common goon type enemies like the basic Mutant enemy. I personally think an upgrade that either increased it's range so you can hit further enemies away and or increased damage could be useful (like having a one hit kill heavy attack for the for the crowbar but the alternative fire becomes slower to counter the major benefit One hit kill for the Basic Mutants not other enemies)

I honestly don't like how the

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Pile bunker now uses Fuel despite not being that amazing of an weapon outside of stun locking enemies such as ghosts. I've found myself seeing the Pile bunker more as an disadvantage trap item basically meaning that it's a pretty item but using it has more downsides than upsides. The fuel ammo for it really nerfed the weapon making it a shadow of it's former self. You can't even upgrade it to hold more fuel or do more damage or have a longer stun rate. Which is just sad in all honesty.

[Sebrw]

Hi Vostyok!

Thanks for your awesome work! It was worthy to wait, episode 2 is gorgeous and super exiting!
My only concern so far (but that's just to be picky!): I found that all weapons sprites are a bit "up" (don't know how to describe, like pointing toward the crosshair too much hence disturbing sight). Too late for Afterglow but if you're thinking in to make an episode 3 (yeah !!!) and change some sprites, I found that the good old Ashes2063 sprite set were better positioned (angle more toward south east).

And a question: When do you think the weapon-only and monsta-only (and sterilized map) could be done? For people like me that don't have much time to play unfortunately, the RPG style of Ashes is difficult to follow while I do enjoy A LOT to be able to play your beautiful maps like I would play another wad. Also, is there any way to make the weapon upgrade available even in a non-RPG style gameplay?

Thanks again for your fantastic work, your game has more personality that most of what have been done for doom so far

PS: Oh and any idea whether John S. Weekley plan to release the afterglow album any soon?

[Serathis]

I have a few comments about the weapons. Some are questions, others are concerns.

---

- Does the Heavy Rifle upgrade do anything? It claims to enable automatic fire, but I thought this was already the case with the normal military rifle. The only thing I think it does is decrease recoil somewhat.
- I think the silenced machine pistol in DMW is broken. I've tried it in both the original and patched versions of Enriched, and both times it immediately alerted the enemies like nothing had changed. However, it does appear to give a bonus to accuracy, but that's not exactly why I bought the upgrade.
-The second upgrade for the lazer gun costs 300 junk, and claims so in the upgrade description, but the menu option to upgrade it still says 150 junk.
-The reload sound for the Desert Pump is far too loud, in my opinion. It's even louder than the actual gun firing! It should definitely be lowered to the same level as the other sounds of the weapon.
- Would it be practical to add upgrades to the pipebombs? I know why they don't have them right now because they're supposed to be used up and not kept like a normal weapon, but I think some interesting things could be done with them, like a remote mode or a incendiary charge.

I had this problem too, you have to set comp level to default. Something about sound alert being different with other settings.

[ZikShadow]

Speaking of weapons i think that the basic crowbar that you use deserves to have upgrades as well.

I feel like upgrading the crowbar, while very nice for people who like to use melee combat, might end up making the guns completely useless.
As it is right now, you can finish a good chunk of the mod using literally just the crowbar and the shotgun bayonet. I know I did. Vos can vouch. I actually completely forgot about the bootknife since I kept using the crowbar, so that's three options.
All of them are strong enough to handle low tier enemies in one or two hits, and even on the later tier ones like the Matango, you can kill them with 4 solid altfire crowbar hits (on Survival atleast, I haven't checked other difficulties yet).

[Toberone]

There's a golden crowbar sprite in the files, so I have to imagine that it was a scrapped idea due to balance reasons like mentioned.

[ZikShadow]

You can get the golden crowbar ingame though a sidequest. It's just a skin however, no mechanical changes.

[Kroc]

Finished. Although I have to admit that I had to cheese the final boss with godmode; that really was impossible. It's way, way too hard and it's not clear if you're having any effect. Definitely needs more feedback. When she begins circling like crazy you can't get a strong enough hit in to do anything.

I got the best ending, but there's no way to tell; I suppose that's how it's meant to be. I had to check the script code to verify it all added up.
I was expecting some kind of final stats / report screen to give an idea of how well I'd done. Time spent, rounds spent, secrets found etc.

What I liked:

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• Afterglow felt much, much more like STALKER than 2063 (which was more like Fallout), this is a good thing; breaking into [supposedly] abandoned places with a super creepy atmosphere. Pipeworks definitely hit this note
• I love submarine levels, and that was a submarine level!
• The Dome was Vostyok firing on all cylinders; one hell of a 'what-if' setup -- an irradiated biodome kept separate from the outside world; creepy but beautiful; the thematic enemies; mazey, but never confusingly so (each place is visually unique enough and when you open shortcuts it's clear where you are and how it all joins up). The map has a strong sense of realistic purpose throughout. The only other things I would like to have seen, and I can't say it would even have been possible to include them without affecting the perfect flow of the level, is 1.) the ability to get outside for a moment to see the building from that perspective and 2.) to walk on the dome, either over gangways on top or suspended gangways on the inside
• The various set-pieces that have been all executed very well without being obnoxious or outstaying their welcome. The laser tag, the gas run (reminiscent of Total Chaos IMO). I even found the bike handling to be fine, although I personally believe that steering should be tighter at lower speeds. Despite handling of Lucy being good, I found the pitfiend racing to be obnoxious and difficult; there's not enough control flexibility there; keep to the race line, hope for good luck

What I disliked:

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• So. Many. Bugdogs. The lack of enemy variety gets tiresome by the time you reach Prosperity hub and the game is only saved by the Dome and the snipers in the nuke site
• Not all weapon upgrades were useful or something I ever used. There were just enough upgrades to not be overwhelming and I would not like to see a third tier, but I did get all upgrades by the time I had left Prosperity
• The plot isn't quite tight enough in some places. The Scav's motivation to head North from Michone is fairly vague. Sure there's a monster hoard heading North, but why should the Scav care? Yes, there's a bunch of mysterious stuff going on but why should that interest the Scav, whose motivation up to this point has been finding good scavenging grounds and dishing out various form of payback? The Athena link is still tenuous before leaving Michone; If anything, once his wheels have been restored, the Scav has more personal motivation to head back to The Wall to find out what happened. I think an extra level here would probably help build a link between what happened at The Wall, and why the Scav needs to head North

What I would like to see:

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• Something set in the UK or Europe. It doesn't have to be Ashes, it could be something else, or could be written in by including teleportation, time-travel or just some kind of extended flash-back related to the plot
• As well as submarine levels, I love train levels. Another player mentioned a moving train level, this too I would like to see

Questions:

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• Outside Walker's church there's a single plant that belongs to the Dome; what is this supposed to signify?
• Where did the smaller nuke come from that got our favourite trader? Is it implied that Athena or the Scav had a hand in this?

Bugs:
A couple of remaining bugs:

• I got all five spores, but I could give the last one to the doctor infinitely; it never left my inventory
• The North gate key remained in my inventory until the end of the game. This seems a little redundant; it should have been consumed once the door was opened

[ZikShadow]

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The submarine explosion.

[Kroc]

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The submarine explosion.

Aha! Thanks, I didn't put two and two together; I didn't think of them being in the same location

[Ihavequestions]

Speaking of weapons i think that the basic crowbar that you use deserves to have upgrades as well.

I'd rather see an option for using the crowbar together with a rope or chain as a kind of grappling hook.

[CyberneticPhantom]

Finished. Although I have to admit that I had to cheese the final boss with godmode; that really was impossible. It's way, way too hard and it's not clear if you're having any effect. Definitely needs more feedback. When she begins circling like crazy you can't get a strong enough hit in to do anything.

I got the best ending, but there's no way to tell; I suppose that's how it's meant to be. I had to check the script code to verify it all added up.
I was expecting some kind of final stats / report screen to give an idea of how well I'd done. Time spent, rounds spent, secrets found etc.

What I liked:

---

• Afterglow felt much, much more like STALKER than 2063 (which was more like Fallout), this is a good thing; breaking into [supposedly] abandoned places with a super creepy atmosphere. Pipeworks definitely hit this note
• I love submarine levels, and that was a submarine level!
• The Dome was Vostyok firing on all cylinders; one hell of a 'what-if' setup -- an irradiated biodome kept separate from the outside world; creepy but beautiful; the thematic enemies; mazey, but never confusingly so (each place is visually unique enough and when you open shortcuts it's clear where you are and how it all joins up). The map has a strong sense of realistic purpose throughout. The only other things I would like to have seen, and I can't say it would even have been possible to include them without affecting the perfect flow of the level, is 1.) the ability to get outside for a moment to see the building from that perspective and 2.) to walk on the dome, either over gangways on top or suspended gangways on the inside
• The various set-pieces that have been all executed very well without being obnoxious or outstaying their welcome. The laser tag, the gas run (reminiscent of Total Chaos IMO). I even found the bike handling to be fine, although I personally believe that steering should be tighter at lower speeds. Despite handling of Lucy being good, I found the pitfiend racing to be obnoxious and difficult; there's not enough control flexibility there; keep to the race line, hope for good luck

What I disliked:

---

• So. Many. Bugdogs. The lack of enemy variety gets tiresome by the time you reach Prosperity hub and the game is only saved by the Dome and the snipers in the nuke site
• Not all weapon upgrades were useful or something I ever used. There were just enough upgrades to not be overwhelming and I would not like to see a third tier, but I did get all upgrades by the time I had left Prosperity
• The plot isn't quite tight enough in some places. The Scav's motivation to head North from Michone is fairly vague. Sure there's a monster hoard heading North, but why should the Scav care? Yes, there's a bunch of mysterious stuff going on but why should that interest the Scav, whose motivation up to this point has been finding good scavenging grounds and dishing out various form of payback? The Athena link is still tenuous before leaving Michone; If anything, once his wheels have been restored, the Scav has more personal motivation to head back to The Wall to find out what happened. I think an extra level here would probably help build a link between what happened at The Wall, and why the Scav needs to head North

What I would like to see:

---

• Something set in the UK or Europe. It doesn't have to be Ashes, it could be something else, or could be written in by including teleportation, time-travel or just some kind of extended flash-back related to the plot
• As well as submarine levels, I love train levels. Another player mentioned a moving train level, this too I would like to see

Questions:

---

• Outside Walker's church there's a single plant that belongs to the Dome; what is this supposed to signify?
• Where did the smaller nuke come from that got our favourite trader? Is it implied that Athena or the Scav had a hand in this?

Bugs:
A couple of remaining bugs:

• I got all five spores, but I could give the last one to the doctor infinitely; it never left my inventory
• The North gate key remained in my inventory until the end of the game. This seems a little redundant; it should have been consumed once the door was opened

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In regards to the Scav's motivation I thought his motivation once he left Michonne Circle was getting more information on the briefcase like Rigs asked up in Prosperity. Once he's captured by the mutants he's just trying to find out what happened and get it and his bike back. Once he learns that the mutants are in the immediate area around Prosperity he's still trying to get it back and find out what's going on because it was important enough to capture and torture him for it and he's learned there's an entire mutant army that seems pretty organized and if there's something important enough to the mutant's in that briefcase then he'd want to investigate that. By now he's already too tangled up in this. If the mutants didn't capture him and steal the briefcase I might be more inclined to agree with you but his motivations seem pretty clear to me; he's not doing it to like save humanity or something like Athena he's just trying to find out what's happening like us which leads him to following the mutant army plus everywhere else in the game he's heard about site Sigma and this 'New Guard' and stuff so he's obviously curious which is something I'd say is probably pretty standard with scavenger's.

[Kroc]

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In regards to the Scav's motivation I thought his motivation once he left Michonne Circle was getting more information on the briefcase like Rigs asked up in Prosperity...

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Personally, I don't think it's air-tight enough; the briefcase was just a job from Smiley -- once delivered it wasn't his problem any more. Any link between Athena and the briefcase is tenuous at best at that point. The briefcase was obviously valuable simply as a piece of scrap, regardless of any bigger picture; the Scav getting robbed for it would not be inconspicuous. He could simply get on his bike and ride off and not poke his head in any more and it wouldn't matter. Remember that as far as he's concerned Athena is dead and buried and all he got out of it was a nice statue and a headache.

Granted, one can find the necessary motivations because the game simply requires so but it's not like STALKER, which has a crystal clear motivation that drives the player onward. In that game you start knowing that you *must* reach the centre of the zone even though the prospect of doing so appears near impossible at the beginning. I just feel like Afterglow is a little weak in that regard. I'm not saying the plot is bad, just not amazing in the same way the atmosphere and overall game design is.

[CyberneticPhantom]

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In regards to the Scav's motivation I thought his motivation once he left Michonne Circle was getting more information on the briefcase like Rigs asked up in Prosperity...

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Personally, I don't think it's air-tight enough; the briefcase was just a job from Smiley -- once delivered it wasn't his problem any more. Any link between Athena and the briefcase is tenuous at best at that point. The briefcase was obviously valuable simply as a piece of scrap, regardless of any bigger picture; the Scav getting robbed for it would not be inconspicuous. He could simply get on his bike and ride off and not poke his head in any more and it wouldn't matter. Remember that as far as he's concerned Athena is dead and buried and all he got out of it was a nice statue and a headache.

Granted, one can find the necessary motivations because the game simply requires so but it's not like STALKER which has a crystal clear motivation that drives the player onward. You start the game knowing that you *must* reach the centre of the zone even though the prospect of doing so appears near impossible at the beginning. I just feel like Afterglow is a little weak in that regard. I'm not saying the plot is bad, just not amazing in the same way the atmosphere and overall game design is.

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See but I think you're forgetting that Rigs tells you before you leave Michonne that it's a computer so in the Scav's mind I would think something pre war would be pretty important and by then while I don't think the Scav would consider him a close friend he's at least someone he can trust and Riggs is worried about it. It's a pre war computer so even though by that point Athena is assumed dead who knows what a pre war computer that activated (seemingly) upon her death is capable of? He's doing it as a favor to Rigs but once it's taken from him it gets more personal add that with his knack for getting revenge on those who've wronged him (see Dead Man Walking) and natural Scavenger curiosity and I think it's still pretty air tight. He didn't have to take the job to bring it north but he does it as a favor for how Rigs has helped him.

[AmissaAnima]

Speaking of weapons i think that the basic crowbar that you use deserves to have upgrades as well.

I feel like upgrading the crowbar, while very nice for people who like to use melee combat, might end up making the guns completely useless.
As it is right now, you can finish a good chunk of the mod using literally just the crowbar and the shotgun bayonet. I know I did. Vos can vouch. I actually completely forgot about the bootknife since I kept using the crowbar, so that's three options.
All of them are strong enough to handle low tier enemies in one or two hits, and even on the later tier ones like the Matango, you can kill them with 4 solid altfire crowbar hits (on Survival atleast, I haven't checked other difficulties yet).

I am grateful for your level head response on my suggestion Zikshadow not a lot of people that I know of knows how to remain calm in a situation that conflicts with what they believe is correct.

I am plenty satisfied with your response so I'm not gonna argue against your Critism as I agree with you. And respect that you respected me.