6th gen discussion thread

[gabrieloup]

Last time, I made a topic called "GameCube or original Xbox" which, to my surprise, had a LOT of different responses, but sadly in the wrong place. I apologize if the thread is locked, but since I'm pretty sure that lots of ZDoomers around are DYING to tell their 6th gen stories, I decided to make a thread JUST about discussing the 6th gen and other retro gaming shenanigans.

To begin a topic, why do people say that BLACK is so... revolutionary? I mean, it's a really good game, but did anyone ever... play... RED FACTION? The first two games are a lot like BLACK (actually, it's the other way around), and yet it has a nice story (clearly ripped off Philip K. Dick's story "We Can Remember It for You Wholesale", a.k.a Total Recall). Red Faction 2 is basically BLACK, before it was even made, and yet better. Non-linear levels, lots of explosions, destructible environment, even enemy gibs ala-Half-Life. I really, really like BLACK, and when I'm completely bored, I either play BLACK or else Hexic on the 360 (a game made by the same guy who made Tetris, I suck at Hexic but I fuckin' love it). Even the HUD is EXACTLY like in BLACK! I can't help but think that BLACK is basically Red Faction 2 but with modern guns. But I really do think that it's extremely overrated. If there's one thing I really like about BLACK, it's the gun-play, which is no surprise since it's usually called a "gun porn" game, and in my opinion, it couldn't be better. It's EXACTLY like an 80's action movie. It FEELS like one. It completely nails everything. But the levels are pretty linear and the game is awfully short.

Different difficulty levels really, REALLY doesn't extend the value of a game, objectively that is. I play everything at the hardest difficulty, from racing games to sims to shooters, so if I compared the length of BLACK to, say, Perfect Dark on hard difficulties, Perfect Dark would still come out on top since it's a much harder and longer, and the levels of Perfect Dark were EXTREMELY entertaining, changing dramatically with each difficulty setting. If I compared BLACK by it's normal difficulty to Perfect Dark by it's normal difficulty, it would still be the same. Doesn't change the fact that it's hell-a-short.

If Criterion Games ever makes a BLACK sequel, I hope the levels are way more open than what it is right now (think Ghost Recon kind of levels, really non-linear), while continuing the story, keeping the exaggerated guns (really, an M16 with a 95 round mag and an infinite ammo grenade launcher), keep everything that made the original BLACK good (really awesome explosion effects, awesome GoldenEye 64-esque shooting, no stupid bullshit like sprinting, perks, focus on multiplayer or anything even remotely aching my ass), while adding some new stuff, like loadouts, aiming down sights, customizing guns (imagine, a golden, barbie shaped M249, that fires 400 explosive rounds, plus having tacticool shit EVERYWHERE) and even more cliché movie locales. BLACK was all about making fun of stupid fun B-movies and BLACK 2 should continue the trend. Oh and, co-op campaign, please, so I can get a chance to show my golden explosive-flamethrower-M134-machine-sniper-shotgun-rifle, while someone else shows his awesome silver custom BFG-displacer-WTF cannon that nukes the entire level and turns all enemies into chicken or sheep. That would be awesome.

Despite my criticism against BLACK, and even with all the monochrome levels all the time, it's still a better love story than Twilight, it's still a better game than any post-2008 Call of Duty game, and still more original than Dead Space. So that's good enough for me. Again, it's my opinion, even though I think the game is flawed in a lot of areas, objectively it's an awesome and solid game.

TL;DR : Forget what I said. https://youtu.be/4e0XyWnxmUc

[Jaxxoon R]

You need to learn when to split paragraphs.

[gabrieloup]

You need to learn when to split paragraphs.

*Sigh* Yet another module in by brain that's currently in work in progress.

[Nevander]

I feel like I'm responsible for this.

[XanderK9]

I don't think "revolutionary" is the right word here. It just happen that a bunch of people here liked it, that's all.

Actually, I'm more inclined to compare it to a Call of Duty (pre-COD4 because it was released a year after Black, anyway) because how it was presented, but Black had the extra stuff that made me replaying the levels again and again while I think I only played the single player of any Call of Duty only once. Except it doesn't have multiplayer, which was a shame (but a blessing in disguise?).

Actually, there was a spiritual successor named Bodycount, but was poorly received.

[gabrieloup]

I don't think "revolutionary" is the right word here. It just happen that a bunch of people here liked it, that's all.

Actually, I'm more inclined to compare it to a Call of Duty (pre-COD4 because it was released a year after Black, anyway) because how it was presented, but Black had the extra stuff that made me replaying the levels again and again while I think I only played the single player of any Call of Duty only once. Except it doesn't have multiplayer, which was a shame (but a blessing in disguise?).

Actually, there was a spiritual successor named Bodycount, but was poorly received.

Actually, I think I'll make a paragraph, actually.

Actually, no, I think I'll discuss the matter at hand, actually.

To put it bluntly, I played both games. Bodycount, in my opinion, just plain sucks. If anything, it's a poor version of BLACK mixed with some stuff from Crackdown. The gun-play is not NEAR as good as BLACK. I want to punch the guy who said it was a spiritual sequel to BLACK in the face. Alas, I'm not sure if there's another game like BLACK. Red Faction 2? LOLZ

RAED FAKSION 2 IZ DEH SPIRITUEL PEDESECOR TO BLEK CONFURMD!1!!111!

To be honest, if there's anything BLACK has that revolutionized gaming, it's the cliché storyline. While it was made in purpose of making fun of dumb thriller movies, Black Ops and Battlefield 3 basically have the exact same fucking story as BLACK! The interrogation cutscenes, the main character kills the main villain (sort of), the story being told from an interrogation, it's all the same fucking thing, yet BLACK did it better thanks to awesome FMV scenes, awesome voice acting and awesome real footage.

Who can forget when the interrogator in the first level of BLACK says "If I walk out that door, everything you did will be de-classified, you WILL be convicted, you WILL be discharged, you WILL spend the rest of your life, in prison"? The scene may seem cliché, but it's delivery is so fucking good! Good luck having good voice actors like that guy, Stephen Russell, Michael Ironside and David Hayter on next-gen bullshit.

Despite that I like some Call of Duty games, I ironically dislike Black Ops in general. A lot of people just LOVE the story of that game, but I thought it was a complete piece of shit. Aside of ripping scenes from other popular stuff (BLACK, The Deer Hunter, Apocalypse Now, you name it), the game is even more linear than it's predecessors. In some sections, it's an on-rails shooter. This is really funny considering that it's predecessor (Modern Warfare 2) was extremely open in some levels. I could give less of a damn for the zombies mode. People thought it was cool because of SOME badass scenes that were ripped from movies, but I thought it's... just... so... boring. The Deer Hunter, Jacob's Ladder and Apocalypse Now are phenomenal movies and all of them have really awesome stories. The revolver scene in The Deer Hunter still beats the Black Ops revolver scene by a mile.

On the other hand, Call of Duty 4 was an awesome game. It's no wonder it's still extremely popular on PC. It has modding capabilities, an awesome story, it's just amazing. The levels weren't so linear. Well, the first couple of ones are (the first act), but then the game REALLY takes you to the next level and it becomes a bit like Half-Life; a combat sandbox. It's still a bitch to finish on Veteran. I finished all levels on Veteran, with Mile High Club included. I completed that level 5 times in a row on Veteran. Awesome level, but I think that, again, the difficulty is not that hard and people who claim that it's the hardest level "EVUR" is either exaggerating, plain sucks on Veteran, or never played a game that's actually hard, such as DMC3, or Ninja Gaiden Black, or Halo 2, or Doom 2 No Rest for the Living, or Splinter Cell. It's still a hard level, never-the-less, and Veteran forces you to complete the level in a minute. You just need to be spot-on with the flashbangs or else the evil russians will gang bang you with their MP5's (what are russians doing with these?) and P90's (the fuck?). FUCKIN' RUSSIANS! BAN THEM VOLVO!

I feel like I'm responsible for this.

You're really, REALLY not responsible for this. Well, except the topic at hand. Haha.

[XanderK9]

I want to punch the guy who said it was a spiritual sequel to BLACK in the face.

You could do that to the devs of Black (if not most of them). Bodycount was made by the same developers, but under a different studio.

[Nevander]

To put it bluntly, I played both games. Bodycount, in my opinion, just plain sucks. If anything, it's a poor version of BLACK mixed with some stuff from Crackdown. The gun-play is not NEAR as good as BLACK. I want to punch the guy who said it was a spiritual sequel to BLACK in the face.

I played them both too and I'd mostly agree. There was something about Bodycount I did enjoy, but it still can't compare to BLACK. They may have tried to create a similar realm and feel between the two games but they only barely managed to get it close. I'd do anything for an actual BLACK 2.

All this talking about BLACK (thanks to me lol) makes me want to play it again. I might boot up my original Xbox later and beat the game... again. This will be like the 50th time or somewhere around there. I should still have my save with all my silver weapons and the M16A2. That gun is the perfect reward for beating Hard. I would say for beating Black Ops mode but let's face it: Black Ops mode is soooo easy. It's on Hard but it's basically like Normal when you have that gun in your hands. Infinite grenade launcher = rekt. Hard is the real challenge to be worthy to use it IMO.

yet BLACK did it better thanks to awesome FMV scenes, awesome voice acting and awesome real footage.

Who can forget when the interrogator in the first level of BLACK says "If I walk out that door, everything you did will be de-classified, you WILL be convicted, you WILL be discharged, you WILL spend the rest of your life, in prison"? The scene may seem cliché, but it's delivery is so fucking good!

I loved those scenes. The guy interrogating Kellar was shady right off the bat but at the same time you could tell he was Kellar's only hope. Those scenes were the perfect filler between levels. Forget in-game cutscenes, we just need something to explain each mission beforehand. I also liked how those scenes were all happening at the same time but the missions are the "memories" and explaining what happened to the interrogator, instead of being something like CoD where most of the missions are happening right now. One of the missions that does this in CoD is "All Ghilled Up" from CoD4 and what do you know? It's one of the better missions IMO.

On the other hand, Call of Duty 4 was an awesome game.

CoD4 is probably my favorite CoD game to date. The last one I played was Black Ops II and the first I ever played was CoD1 (the first one). After Ghosts came out, I stopped caring about CoD. I was done being another sheep to the CoD franchise. Shots fired!

[gabrieloup]

I want to punch the guy who said it was a spiritual sequel to BLACK in the face.

You could do that to the devs of Black (if not most of them). Bodycount was made by the same developers, but under a different studio.

Then they either didn't say that at all (and rather, the marketing department wanted to boost sales) or else they completely forgot what made BLACK so good. The gameplay of Bodycount feels... Like a crappy version of Call of Duty 3 with Crackdown orbs. That's the best they could actually come up with. Well, at least the game is aware that it's an arcade shooter, so it doesn't try too hard to impress you of it's bullshit. So I'll save my lack of remorse to something else. Regardless, I want to punch a kitten.

[gabrieloup]

Switching discussions, what games do you guys think that are extremely overrated in 6th gen/5th gen? To be honest, I'd LOVE to put Ocarina of Time up this list. Awesome game, but some would kill because someone argued that it's not the holy grail of gaming and that it's not the best thing ever created since hygienic paper. I confess though, I'd probably carbonize someone if they told me that Splinter Cell is bad and that **insert random generic stealth game** is better than it. Except some Metal Gear games though, like MGS1 and MGS3, and the Thief series in my opinion. Already replaying both Splinter Cell 1 and Pandora Tomorrow on the PS2. If there's something I dislike about the PS2 version of the first game, is that most lights cannot be destroyed due to memory limitations, there's frequent loading zones, and the PS2 version also comes with a really shitty bonus map. Pandora Tomorrow on the PS2 though, doesn't have any relevant problems, aside of SOME lights still being invincible, but at least it doesn't feature any shitty, arrogant bonus levels, or extra gimmicks--gimmicks--gimmicks--gimmicks--

Microsoft Windows
Chrome has stopped working
A problem caused the program to stop working correctly.
Sega will close to program and fuck you if a solution isn't available.

[XanderK9]

Then they either didn't say that at all (and rather, the marketing department wanted to boost sales) or else they completely forgot what made BLACK so good.

The co-creator and designer of Black, Stuart Black , actually said that, so it's the latter.

[gabrieloup]

Then they either didn't say that at all (and rather, the marketing department wanted to boost sales) or else they completely forgot what made BLACK so good.

The co-creator and designer of Black, Stuart Black , actually said that, so it's the latter.

AHHH ARSEHOLE! YOU'LL PAY FOR THIS! YOUR DECEPTIVE MARKETING TACTICS WILL NOT BE ENFORCED ANYMORE!!11!1!1!!

[Jeimuzu73]

AHHH ARSEHOLE! YOU'LL PAY FOR THIS! YOUR DECEPTIVE MARKETING TACTICS WILL NOT BE ENFORCED ANYMORE!!11!1!1!!

Simmer down, or you'll wake the weasel.

[wildweasel]

AHHH ARSEHOLE! YOU'LL PAY FOR THIS! YOUR DECEPTIVE MARKETING TACTICS WILL NOT BE ENFORCED ANYMORE!!11!1!1!!

Simmer down, or you'll wake the weasel.

*clears throat*

[enderkevin13]

AHHH ARSEHOLE! YOU'LL PAY FOR THIS! YOUR DECEPTIVE MARKETING TACTICS WILL NOT BE ENFORCED ANYMORE!!11!1!1!!

Simmer down, or you'll wake the weasel.

*clears throat*

Oh shit, you woke the inner demon! RUN!!! *Activates the alarm*