ZDoom vs Zandronum discussion [split]

[edward850]

P.S: Zandronum is better of zdoom.

I disagree.
I'm not entirely sure why you posted this non sequitur.

[Hellser]

P.S: Zandronum is better of zdoom.

I disagree.
I'm not entirely sure why you posted this non sequitur.

Because Zandronum has multiplayer? I don't know, don't see the appeal to Zandronum - considering ZDoom has a much solid modding capability than Zandronum can ever have.

[edward850]

Because Zandronum has multiplayer?

Oh you.

[TehRealSalt]

I think Hellser meant that it has easy-to-set-up multiplayer. ZDoom requires quite a little bit of work (not that much, but more than what some people would like to do) to get it to function properly, Zandronum is much more simple.

The only reason I ever boot it up anymore is to play WhoDunIt (and that's if anyone hosts it; too many people playing MM8BDM and Brutal Doom coop).

[edward850]

I think Hellser meant that it has easy-to-set-up multiplayer. ZDoom requires quite a little bit of work (not that much, but more than what some people would like to do) to get it to function properly, Zandronum is much more simple.

Aside from the fact that I already know what he means (we were talking on the IRC at the time, and he was saying it as a query, not a statement), it seems kind of irrelevant which one is easier if you have to use the command prompt (or some frontend) to run a multiplayer game for either port.

And if you are going to call that complicated...

[TehRealSalt]

I'm not saying that I find command lines complicated (I actually think the opposite), I'm just saying that some may find it simpler to find a game through Doomseeker.

EDIT: Also thought I should mention that I'd take ZDoom multiplayer over Zandro any day.

[HexaDoken]

Zandronum multiplayer wins by default on account of having ability to join a game mid-way and disallowing you to start up games with wrong file versions(and pointing you to the issue) instead of running just fine until moment X where everyone desyncs for apparently no reason, leaving everyone in a state of confusion.

There are absolutely zero counter-arguments to that. Fin.
also we might probably want to stop/move

[edward850]

instead of running just fine until moment X where everyone desyncs for apparently no reason, leaving everyone in a state of confusion.

There are absolutely zero counter-arguments to that. Fin.

Counter argument: Desyncs are user errors only, now. I pretty much fixed all of the engine critical ones. And, you know, it's kind of useless when Zandronum can't even decided where mobj's should actually be.

also we might probably want to stop/move

Then stop bringing up lies. :V

[TerminusEst13]

also we might probably want to stop/move

Considering discussing the relationship between Zandronum/ZDoom with Edward is like hammering your head against a rock, I both agree and highly suggest this discussion get moved to a different topic.

[wildweasel]

I both agree and highly suggest this discussion get moved to a different topic.

Done.

[Siberian Tiger]

I think Hellser meant that it has easy-to-set-up multiplayer. ZDoom requires quite a little bit of work (not that much, but more than what some people would like to do) to get it to function properly, Zandronum is much more simple.

The only problem with ZDoom in regards to 'easy-to-set-up' multiplayer, is mainly the front-end tools. Sure, we have ZDoom Launcher and some 'bare basic' setup in Internet Doom Explorer, but it's nothing in comparison to how Zandronum's Client\Server architecture setup in regards to clients joining into the gameserver and how easy it is to create a new gameserver with Internet Doom Explorer (or Doomseeker, for those that prefer it). A way to completely fix this issue, is by means of a much more powerful frontend tool. Imagine - as you will looking at the IDE main outlook, all that anyone has to do - is click and go. Besides on relying on clients to setup ZDL, enter commands through the Character User Interface, or various other programming\setup techniques, all that the user has todo - is click and forget -- Just that simple. However, as ZDoom doesn't rely on a master-server - as Zandronum does, the front-end must have an additional component to query its own dedicated master server. Meaning, that the front-end tool will 'itself' communicate to its own master (phone home) and retrieve a list of active gameservers in which is waiting for players. In a nutshell, this should be the core that should ever be needed. Of course, additional features can be added, such as retrieving PWAD's, filtering, maybe an integrated IRC client, etc etc.

Furthermore, creating new gameservers (regardless of the NetMode), is merely just how intuitive the front-end program is. There's nothing really much more to say other than making sure that everyone can actually understand the options and variables that ZDoom has.

[Nash]

As awesome ZDoom multiplayer is, I'm going to have to agree with HexaDoken; Zandronum will always be perceived as "better" to the average user (who happens to be majority too) because of how easy it is to use, how easy it is to find and join games.

It's kind of like... Windows. You can argue all you want about why [Linux/whatever obscure OS] is technically superior - Windows is still the most popular OS and far more people are using Windows simply because it's just easier to get into. The majority amount of users just do not care about those other little things that make non-Windows OSes "better" or anything like that. To put it in perspective - they just want to get on the internet and play Doom multiplayer as fast as possible. They don't care about command lines, modding features, who desyncs less...

[Player701]

IMO, Zandronum is pretty much superior to ZDoom in terms of multiplayer: more game modes (both cooperative and competitive, plus several map packs designed specifically for them), the ability to set up dedicated servers and so on. Unfortunately, it is way behind in terms of modding capabilities compared to (G)ZDoom. If only Zandronum's codebase was kept in sync with ZDoom's like GZDoom's one is... or if the projects would be merged together. However, the latter will never happen, as stated by one of the developers in another thread in this forum, and the former is very unlikely to happen - seems like it will take an infinite amount of time to catch up with ZDoom's current codebase.

[Nash]

You know... imagine - if Zandronum has the same amount of modding features as (G)ZDoom... no one would use (G)ZDoom anymore. They would become obsolete. :P Maybe it's alright for things to be the way they are right now. :P

[GooberMan]

Comparing them based on game modes and maps is a bit of a cop out. What's being described there is a source port with a packed-in mod.

As far as providing a modern client/sever system goes though, that's basically indisputable. It wouldn't be "Doom" multiplayer though, as it was lock stepped multiplayer originally. That gets in to Doom preservation vs. modern usability though.