Vulkan - Doom 2 episode (in progress)

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Vulkan - Doom 2 episode (in progress)

Postby DavidN » Fri Jan 08, 2016 10:24 pm

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Late last year, I suddenly got back into Doom after having messed about with WADding about 20 years ago. After poking around and discovering what you can do with ZDoom, an experiment is starting to turn into an episode. It centres around Vulkan, a subsidiary of the UAC that runs a geothermal power station that's accidentally drilled into Hell.

Latest version (2 maps): http://www.teamouse.net/games/vulkan/vu ... -01-18.pk3

Screenshots under spoiler:
Spoiler:


- Uses the DOOM2 IWAD
- Designed with the level of firepower of Brutal Doom in mind (which I enjoyed a lot before I knew anything about its creator), but works without it as well
- Adds Rise of the Triad-style coins, largely because I ran out of ideas for secret rewards - collecting all 100 in a level grants a supercharge
- Uses humanoid monsters from scalliano and Tormentor667
- Also featuring new monsters (obviously edited from scalliano's scientists):

Plasma Zombie Scientist
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Coming out of the need to have another human-type enemy with a projectile attack, this zombie is armed with a plasma pistol. He's a bit like a more lightweight, faster Imp (sort of taking its place in this mod as Brutal Doom has made the imp so much more potent).

Headless Scientist
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This zombie is missing something, but he doesn't let it slow him down. He's armed with a submachine gun, which he isn't afraid to use even though he's not a great shot for reasons that are excusable in the circumstances. Don't let him get up close, or he'll sense you and fire a devastating point-blank attack.
Last edited by DavidN on Mon Jan 18, 2016 8:50 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Vulkan - requesting feedback on newbie map!

Postby Valken » Sat Jan 09, 2016 7:48 am

I love it with Brutal Doom and will test with Project Brutality. Looked great with freedom and I will try it with regular Doom 2 wad.

I only wish the scientists were "brutalized" so it would fit better with the zombies and monsters.
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Re: Vulkan - requesting feedback on newbie map!

Postby mumblemumble » Sat Jan 09, 2016 11:56 am

Neat map, well done in style, short but enjoyable.

Exit could be more clearly marked as I hit the lift without realizing that was what it was (thought it was a puzzle button) so an exit sign would be great

Despite mentioning it was made for brutal doom, I played with hideous destructor, and had no real hard times. only times things got difficult was the monster closet (fired my grenade launcher, dove into cover, finished survivors) and the part right before getting to the main buildings with the bottleneck : But those are with a mod that makes me die very easily, the rest was incredibly easy. The large amount of scientist zombies are like cannon fodder, and go down in 1 4.26 round, can be meleed to death with little risk, and don't hit hard. Generally they are nothing but target practice unlelsss you box the player in with a bunch, since they are like slow, weak pinkies. TL;DR, level was piss easy.

As for how to make it harder, keep in mind melee enemies threats are as proporional as the inability to get away.

Having tons of room makes them a non threat. Little room (narrow hallways, tight spaces, crowded rooms) make them much more dangerous. Having them corner you makes them gaurentee damage.

zombies with guns weren't much of an issue either, just so long as im careful (enough health to ignore most damage) and those 2 times I mentioned being threatening was the monster closet past the door, and the narrow bottleneck before reaching the buildings, the second of which only being because of the mod, and the first of which is easily resolved by either blasting away (not enough enemies to stop the brutal doom rifle / shotgun from clearing them in a few seconds) or dive behind the pillar. This might be of been far more interesting if you could arrange a squad of zombies firing on the player as a hoard of ax zombies comes from the other side, forced to take cover and evade the hoard at the same time.

BUT difficulty, and exit confusion aside, well done level with enjoyable, if light presentation. I wouldn't mind more maps though, and its always fun mowing down custom enemies with HD
Last edited by mumblemumble on Mon Jan 18, 2016 11:29 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Vulkan - requesting feedback on newbie map!

Postby AD_79 » Sat Jan 09, 2016 1:29 pm

Well, it's not terrible for a newbie map. I'd say you have some potential! Gameplay was basically non-existent though (I should point out that I was playing with vanilla Doom gameplay because I'm such a boring fuck). A lot of pistol-ing and punching zombies early on which was not very exciting, could have used a shotgun earlier on with some slightly harsher opposition! Now, about that: approx. 99% of the monsters were placed in a way that they were right in front of you all the time; this is bad and no fun. The surplus of slow as hell melee enemies only added to this. I never once felt like I was in danger because there were nothing to keep me on my toes. I know this is a MAP01, but still, you can do better than what boils down to a corridor with zombies : >

A couple visual things I noticed:

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Particularly bad cut-off here. Either raising the GRAY border quite a bit or using a 3D floor and then putting SKY or the rockwall depending on how you want it (imo the second option) above to replace it could probably fix this. You're using (G)ZDoom, after all!

Image

This looks bad. Replacing it with some more "natural" out-of-bounds scenery would look waaaay better than this.

Image

looks bad++

EDIT: for some reason the map crashes when I try to save.
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Re: Vulkan - requesting feedback on newbie map!

Postby DavidN » Sat Jan 09, 2016 10:34 pm

Thanks a lot for the feedback, this is exceptional advice :) I definitely had trouble with the difficulty, realizing that the map was massively simple even though it had a ton of monsters... perhaps I will dig into DECORATE and arm some of those scientists! Combining melee and ranged monsters sounds a good idea, I'll experiment with that - and with arranging some of them so that they don't come from right in front of you. I have a half-finished second map in the works too and will apply these ideas there :)

I'll take another look at the outdoor scenery as well, I had some trouble with getting the walls to line up right and sort of hoped nobody would notice! Are there any good tutorials for doing more natural terrain like that, or maps you'd recommend to pull apart and look at? I've been playing through the original games and Knee Deep in ZDoom and taking notes...

I haven't been able to replicate the saving issue, though I'm on version 1.8... are you on the 2.0 branch?
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Re: Vulkan - requesting feedback on newbie map!

Postby mumblemumble » Sat Jan 09, 2016 11:40 pm

Yeah, pretty sure I could pass your map using the extreme weapons pack if you are familiar with that.

But keep in mind for melee enemies its essential you get trapped, unless you want them to be cannon fodder.

Theres many ways to achieve this, locking doors, getting surrounded, using ranged enemies to "push" a player towards the melee enemies (for instance, having doors come up to reveal chain-gunners / revenants, and cover back by where pinkies / ax zombies are, so they are forced to either dodge attacks, or jump behind cover next to all the melee sources.) i also think a few beefier enemies would be good, at least imos, because, at least with hd, every single enemy died in no more than 2-3 rounds. And because of this, once you get a shotgun you can easily thrwart almost all attacks, in vanilla killing 2-3 enemies a shot, when they barely scratch the player while ignored.
Last edited by mumblemumble on Mon Jan 18, 2016 11:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Vulkan - requesting feedback on newbie map!

Postby AD_79 » Sat Jan 09, 2016 11:52 pm

DavidN wrote: I haven't been able to replicate the saving issue, though I'm on version 1.8... are you on the 2.0 branch?


Yes, using 2.0.03.

Also, here's my stance towards melee monsters: They need to feel somewhat useful. Demons are fast (this is vital to their usefulness) and function primarily as blockers; monsters that serve to get in your way while dodging other attacks. I do recommend limiting use of melee monsters in general and making more of a shift towards hitscanners and, most importantly, projectile-based monsters!
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Re: Vulkan - requesting feedback on newbie map!

Postby Captain J » Sun Jan 10, 2016 11:19 pm

it looks really good, can't wait until it's finished!

also i have a question, the silver vulkoins worth more than golden ones, intentional?
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Re: Vulkan - requesting feedback on newbie map!

Postby DavidN » Mon Jan 11, 2016 9:02 am

Hah, they're meant to be bronze... but I'm colourblind so they might not be :) There are two gold ones to find in the map as well!
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Re: Vulkan - requesting feedback on newbie map!

Postby Captain J » Mon Jan 11, 2016 9:20 am

I see, but the bronze i know has darker color. But in this mod, it's very bright like gold.
EDIT:
ZioMcCall wrote:ignore my descritption,I hate a certain kind of furries,not you.
i think it was uncalled for, but since you said ignore it, okay then!
Last edited by Captain J on Wed Jan 13, 2016 11:16 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Vulkan - requesting feedback on newbie map!

Postby ZioMcCall » Wed Jan 13, 2016 12:45 pm

I think that this mod must be play with Complex Doom and not with Brutal Doom.
P.S. ignore my descritption,I hate a certain kind of furries,not you.
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Re: Vulkan - requesting feedback on newbie map!

Postby DavidN » Thu Jan 14, 2016 11:09 am

Oh - er, thanks?

I'll take a look with Complex Doom, as well - I've missed out on something like 15 years of Doom editing evolution, so I'm really discovering a lot :)
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Re: Vulkan - Doom 2 episode (in progress)

Postby DavidN » Mon Jan 18, 2016 8:54 pm

I've updated the original post with a new PK3 that contains a tweaked MAP01 and an indoor MAP02, trying to take the advice above on board (and it adds a heap more customization to things like level intermissions). Once again, I'd really appreciate any pointers on my design and detailing, and so on!
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Re: Vulkan - Doom 2 episode (in progress)

Postby grouchbag » Tue Jan 19, 2016 8:28 am

Very beautiful, I enjoyed playing.Looking forward to when it's done. :D :D :D
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