[RELEASE] DN3DooM - update v.1.08b

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kadkad14
Posts: 37
Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2020 9:39 am

Re: [RELEASE] DN3DooM

Post by kadkad14 »

I see.

Here are some possible alternatives for health bonus and armor shard Captain J was talking about.
There is one sprite from Alien Armageddon. So all credits go to mod devs. But I am not sure about these variants.

I edited some .txt files in order to make sounds match Duke3D. So AMRSHRD.ogg becomes obsolete.
Also, there is a blank sound file from .grp that could replace secrets revealing sound.
Because you don't hear any sound/music when you reveal secrets in Duke3D.
And I think backpack sound needs to be changed to DSITEMUP.wav as well.

Suggestion:
Make Duke say "Where is it?" with a small chance when he gets stuck in a wall.
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Last edited by kadkad14 on Thu Apr 02, 2020 6:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
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RikohZX
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Re: [RELEASE] DN3DooM

Post by RikohZX »

I know the green blood had the acid burn in the original, but the original didn't exactly have it fly all over the place and burn you the instant you stepped on it, so it kind of makes Lost Soul zones an absolute acidic nightmare where I don't think the burn ever goes away.
kadkad14
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Re: [RELEASE] DN3DooM

Post by kadkad14 »

Also, here are some fixes from .grp file (landing sound, rpg smoke) along with Zero X. Diamond's rip of Lame Duke resources:
Spoiler:
Maybe it would be useful.

I've got few suggestions:
1. Can you make delay between Duke quotes? So he won't interrupt himself when he picks items up.
2. Flares should be disabled for rpg, devastator, cycloid rockets and overlord rockets in order to stick to Duke3D.
3. Duke3D devastator rockets don't have smoke at all.

Edit:
I played some oblige-v0.97 maps and noticed one thing:
Duke loses hp faster than heals. It appears that he lacks additional firepower.
Maybe it has something to do with pipe bombs/laser mines.
You can't find them when you need them and vice versa because you will probably get rpg with lots of rockets at that time.
Maybe changing health bonus/armor shard to pipe bomb/laser mine can work.
It will make it more balanced since you can turn health items into portable medkits and get free armor from pig cops.
Not to mention that cola/plasma sprites look a bit silly.

I forgot to say that I post edited txts and other content because I want to save your time in order to not bother you too much.
And I also try to provide content when I ask for something.
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kipo
Posts: 133
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Re: [RELEASE] DN3DooM

Post by kipo »

Ok I'm uploading a quick test version with some of the things that have been discussed, the changes are:
- fixed main menu pic and added loading screen/bar (kadkad14)
- fixed menu sounds (kadkad14)
- added intermission end sounds (kadkad14)
- (removed for now) added beheaded battlelord animation (kadkad14)
- fixed main menu logo (kadkad14)
- added duke 3d menu cursor (kadkad14)
- blood gore in doors/crushers (based on evp)
- added "where is it" sound in use-fail (kadkad14)
- muted "secret found" sound
- changed some pickup items sounds (kadkad14)
- changed health and armor bonus sprites (idea captain j, sprites kadkad14)
- changed duke casings for pistol and shotgun (captain j)
- added boots dropitem for the slimer eggs
- replaced duke landing sound (kadkad14)
- adjusted devastator firing rate
Download: https://sharemods.com/a11d2qqt86hs/DN3D ... 2.zip.html
Note that this is not a proper release, it's just to test the changes.


I'll try to answer about some other stuff later.

RikohZX wrote:I know the green blood had the acid burn in the original, but the original didn't exactly have it fly all over the place and burn you the instant you stepped on it, so it kind of makes Lost Soul zones an absolute acidic nightmare where I don't think the burn ever goes away.
I somehow mitigated this by making the aliens drop boots from time to time, once you get a hold of the boots you are fine. But you are right I totally forgot about the slimer eggs, so I'm adding a chance for them to drop boots too.
kadkad14
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Re: [RELEASE] DN3DooM

Post by kadkad14 »

Thank you for paying attention to this.

Found few bugs:
1. Duke gets full health when he restores his original size that occurs after drone orb attack.
2. Flying enemies still have weird animation sometimes:
Spoiler:
Here is my attempt to edit Cobra. I am not sure about the quality.

Edit:
-reported another bug
-added beheaded cobra

Edit2:
Talking about red blood decals for green-blooded enemies.
Maybe mods like nash gore or BD can help solve the problem.

Edit3:
-removed redundant suggestion

P.S.
It's not easy for me to write things in English.
So I can unintentionally write a sentence that may have completely different meaning.
This is why I often edit my messages.
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Last edited by kadkad14 on Fri Apr 03, 2020 9:38 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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RastaManGames
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Re: [RELEASE] DN3DooM

Post by RastaManGames »

This mod contains old bug from V6 of main mod: Dead players sprites are standing like living beings.
kadkad14
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Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2020 9:39 am

Re: [RELEASE] DN3DooM

Post by kadkad14 »

Here is my attempt to edit Gorilla.

A few suggestions:
1. I noticed that "alien" type of enemies (octabrains, drones, queen etc) can't damage each other in Duke3D, at least by projectiles.
2. Enemies in Duke3D have faster animations.
Look at speed of its fangs:
Spoiler:
How hard would it be to increase animation speed?

There is a mod called Wolf3D TC. It replicates Wolfenstein3D with impressive accuracy.
It has proper startup, intros, level loading bar, animated intermission screen etc.
Maybe information from this mod can be useful.
Spoiler:
Also, there is a new headshot mod. Maybe that could be useful as well.
Spoiler:
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kipo
Posts: 133
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Re: [RELEASE] DN3DooM

Post by kipo »

I'm uploading another test file, with the following added changes from the last one:
- Added intro
- Improved rocket smoke
- Fixed duke unshrink to keep health and armor.
- Improved duke talk so it won't cut off
- Lowered floatbob strengh to prevent floor clipping on floating enemies
- Adjusted commander health, rocket and devastator damages, alien drone explosion factor
- Adjusted octabrains animations
_ Improved red letters
Download: https://sharemods.com/vj4vef0dd3rp/DN3D ... 3.zip.html




Now on to answer some questions:
2. Flares should be disabled for rpg, devastator, cycloid rockets and overlord rockets in order to stick to Duke3D.
3. Duke3D devastator rockets don't have smoke at all.
1. I noticed that "alien" type of enemies (octabrains, drones, queen etc) can't damage each other in Duke3D, at least by projectiles.
As you can probably tell, I'm not really aiming for a full vanilla experience, more like vanilla + cool enhancements like duke plus & others I might like.
Dukeplus has flares in rockets, and rockets are supposed to have smokes.
Dukeplus also has damage to other enemies and infighting.
I made a mix: they can all damage each other, but only infight other species, to make it fun like doom, and keep it closer to duke's behaviour, also inspired on trooper dan's last post here:
https://forums.duke4.net/topic/9933-why ... n-1-enemy/
Maybe changing health bonus/armor shard to pipe bomb/laser mine can work.
What do you think of the new sprites?
I forgot to say that I post edited txts and other content because I want to save your time in order to not bother you too much.
That's cool, makes it much easier to replace stuff
Here is my attempt to edit Cobra. I am not sure about the quality.
Here is my attempt to edit Gorilla.
I couldn't test these yet. I'll get to it next (thanks!)
Talking about red blood decals for green-blooded enemies.
Maybe mods like nash gore or BD can help solve the problem.
I have seen those mods but my attempts were not succesful. I'll take another look.
There is a mod called Wolf3D TC. It replicates Wolfenstein3D with impressive accuracy.
It has proper startup, intros, level loading bar, animated intermission screen etc.
Maybe information from this mod can be useful.
I've seen that mod, and another one with cool custom intermissions is zombies ate my neighbors tc.
The problem with custom intermissions now is that you kinda have to create another level for it, and recreate the whole logic there (with some acs magic), and then redirect all your levels there.
This approach only works if your mod is a TC (with its own levels). If you want to use other mapsets, you'll be in trouble.
Unless gzdoom manages intermission differently, like creating one single animated intermission that can replace the custom one with ease, then I'm afraid this won't be possible.
Also, there is a new headshot mod. Maybe that could be useful as well.
My implementation is based on a mod from the same guy. I see he still recommends the other mod on some cases. Don't know what is the difference.
This mod contains old bug from V6 of main mod: Dead players sprites are standing like living beings.
I have seen this bug in rare instances in coop, I'm not sure yet what triggers it.
kadkad14
Posts: 37
Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2020 9:39 am

Re: [RELEASE] DN3DooM

Post by kadkad14 »

Thanks for a detailed response.
I made a mix: they can all damage each other, but only infight other species, to make it fun like doom, and keep it closer to duke's behaviour
It's a good choice.
What do you think of the new sprites?
Better than other alternatives.
I couldn't test these yet.
I will try to rework some unsatisfied sprites. So that's not final attempt.
Right now, I am trying to edit Cycoild and then Incinerator.
I'll take another look.
Thanks for giving further attention to this.
If this is too complex then maybe its not worth it.
I see he still recommends the other mod on some cases.
I see.

Just tested new test version of the mod. This is just amazing!

A few suggestions:
1. Secret revealing message needs to be changed to blue colored "A secret place!".
2. In original game Duke reacts to monsters exploded by other monsters, barrels, environment etc. Maybe that's not crucial.
3. Background logo have a bit different positioning:
Spoiler:
4. Duke3D has this level loading screen. Can you add this as well?
Spoiler:
Also, added DukeBlue and DukeRed font colors using original Duke3D color range. Blue one could be used for "card required" string.
Maybe it requires further polishing or something. Can you test it please?
Edit: It appears that you already did something like this. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Here is a list of detailed monster data:
Almost every page contains tables and information about enemy speed, hp, damage, immunity, sounds, sprites etc.
Spoiler:
There is strange correlation between message size and background logo size:
Spoiler:
Edit2:
-reported possible bug

Edit3:
Talking about animated intermission screen.
Maybe this could help:
Spoiler:
Edit4:
-added another suggestion
It seems that Wolf3D TC has universal loading bar and intermission screen.
I tried to load various maps like doom 1/2, tnt, plutonia, oblige and noticed that these things are present everytime.
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kipo
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Re: [RELEASE] DN3DooM

Post by kipo »

Thx for the font colors, I added the blue one and tweaked it a little.
There is strange correlation between message size and background logo size
mmm must be in the way I'm doing the animation. If anything, that setting should also be breaking the slimer in the face, and the scuba gear.
It seems that Wolf3D TC has universal loading bar and intermission screen.
I tried to load various maps like doom 1/2, tnt, plutonia, oblige and noticed that these things are present everytime.
I cannot replicate this. If I load other maps I see all in wrong colors and the regular intermission.
Did you modify anything to make it work?
Note: Even obaddon generated maps replace the regular intermission.
kadkad14
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Re: [RELEASE] DN3DooM

Post by kadkad14 »

Sorry for a late reply.
I didn't think that it would require so much time.

Here is my attempt to edit Cycloid and Incinerator.
Spoiler:
And I am not sure about quality of this work as well. Maybe it needs further polishing.
Also, there is possible alternative for 3DRealms logo.

I forgot to mention that Duke it Out TC has animated intermission screen as well.

Suggestion:
Can you add swimming sprites, please?
Re-Blood as example mod (it has test map):
Spoiler:
Edit:
-added a suggestion
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kipo
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Re: [RELEASE] DN3DooM

Post by kipo »

Thanks kadkad14! That's awesome. I'm uploading a new test version with the following main changes (from the last test version):
- Fixed trooper's drop ammo amount (and reduced the drop % a bit)
- Reduced shrinker/expander enemy animation time
- Improved acid/flame damage (now if you pass quickly you may not get hurt)
- Improved pipebomb's deselect animation
- Added headshot death animations for: battlelord, cycloid emperor, cycloid incinerator, king cobra, gorilla captain.
Download: https://sharemods.com/rl91ysyog6z2/DN3D ... 4.zip.html

I don't know about that 3drealms logo, maybe if it has some black borders or something (I included yours in this test version).

About the swimming sprites, I'll have to take a look (the player code is a mess right now).

And the Duke it out TC is not a good example because it's for another engine (EDGE), so it may work differently.
kadkad14
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Re: [RELEASE] DN3DooM

Post by kadkad14 »

Thank you for a new test version.
It becomes better and better.

Right now I am trying to edit Alien Queen and then Nether Queen.
Here is my next "to do" list:
- redo some other sprites like headshot frames of pigcop, protector drone and cycloid.
- add missing incinerated enemy sprites.

I think I found some bugs:
1. Gore doesn't appear in doors:
Spoiler:
It visible only if you summon enemy via console.
2. Ripper animation is a bit different:
Spoiler:
3. Some enemies in Duke3D have different pain chance values:
Spoiler:
I added proper pickup sounds for some items and randomized menu activation sound in order to match Duke3D (I hope I did it without making duplicates).

Also, I found this video, it looks amazing:
Spoiler:
And there is a mod called NukemTown. It's a good example mod.
Spoiler:
I got a question. How do you convert Duke3D speed values into Doom?
Assault Trooper has 72 walking and 108 running speed.
So it walks if it near you and it runs if you are far away.
Every enemy in Duke3D have additional values.
I don't know about that 3drealms logo, maybe if it has some black borders or something (I included yours in this test version).
Hmm, I didn't think about that. I see this:
Spoiler:
Added possible fix.
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MentzWolf
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Re: [RELEASE] DN3DooM

Post by MentzWolf »

Wasn't really satisfied with the SSG sprites in this mod (seemed hacked together and not really unique looking from the other shotty), so I found these Duke-styled SSG sprites from LossForWords and decided to make a mini cosmetic mod.
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
Some minor sprite edits as well as the pickup sprite were done by myself, hope you guys like it!

Download: https://www.moddb.com/games/doom/addons ... or-dn3doom
kipo
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Re: [RELEASE] DN3DooM

Post by kipo »

MentzWolf wrote:Wasn't really satisfied with the SSG sprites in this mod (seemed hacked together and not really unique looking from the other shotty), so I found these Duke-styled SSG sprites from LossForWords and decided to make a mini cosmetic mod.
That's great! Can I add it to the main mod? LossForWords sent me the pickup sprites too via PM. Adding this SSG was on my todo list, but your implementation is spot on.


kadkad14, some answers:
Right now I am trying to edit Alien Queen and then Nether Queen.
Here is my next "to do" list:
- redo some other sprites like headshot frames of pigcop, protector drone and cycloid.
- add missing incinerated enemy sprites.
Thanks man, I really appreciate your work.
1. Gore doesn't appear in doors
2. Ripper animation is a bit different
3. Some enemies in Duke3D have different pain chance values
4. Also, I found this video, it looks amazing
5. And there is a mod called NukemTown. It's a good example mod.
1. Not really a bug, sometimes the doors just smash the corpses, depending on the position. At first I had to always generate that gore, but when the body was further away it seemed silly, like it was floating in the air.
2. I know, it bothers me a little, but that's just the default base mod (v6) ripper animation, and I was lazy to change it (since it's close enough).
3. I know! And I hate the fact that enforcers don't twitch in pain when I shoot them in duke3d. In my mod I went for the fun factor, and tested different values in the enemies so that it feels fun when shooting them.
4. I've seen that one. I tested many approaches for the laser beam, but using models lagged the game when there were many tripbombs, and using continous sprites to simulate a perfect line was laggy and there was also a sprite limit. So that's the best I could come up with for performance and visuals (a somewhat flickering dotted line). Of course my skills are limited and there are most likely much better approaches.
5. It sure is a good example mod, that's where I got the kick logic and ice smokes from. About the duke talk getting cut when picking items, it seems like it's an engine limitation (viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1563&p=18409). I think NukeTown counters this alternating the pickup sounds with generic short ones, but I'm not sure (haven't checked that one). The current somke effects don't bother me so much, and the bycicle kick is so funny (I know I have to fix it eventually, but in the meantime it's funny to have it).
I got a question. How do you convert Duke3D speed values into Doom?
Assault Trooper has 72 walking and 108 running speed.
So it walks if it near you and it runs if you are far away.
Every enemy in Duke3D have additional values.
It's just a hack. I've shorten the animation tick duration if they are further away from you, so it seems like they are running, and since the Chase function gets called more often, they are also moving faster. The speed atribute is not ideal for this since it doesn't change the frame's duration, and many checks would be required to return it to the original value. I don't think the doom engine is capable of having another running speed attribute, but the good thing about my hack is that it is correlated to their defined moving duration (minus 1 tick), so they'll be running according to their own pace, so to speak.
I added proper pickup sounds for some items and randomized menu activation sound in order to match Duke3D (I hope I did it without making duplicates).
Thanks, I'll check it out.

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