Did WWII allied soldiers make use of enemy firearms?

If it's not ZDoom, it goes here.
Post Reply
User avatar
Naniyue
Posts: 884
Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2009 8:06 pm

Did WWII allied soldiers make use of enemy firearms?

Post by Naniyue »

I've looked this up online, but have yet to find sufficient answers.

I've played several WWII themed FPS games, and have often found myself needing, or wanting, to use enemy small arms. For example, During MoH Pacific Assault, I was out of ammo for my main SMG, swapped it for a nearby Japanese sniper rifle, and made easier headway because of it. Did real soldiers do this kind of thing, if the need arose, or is this just another unrealistic aspect of such games?
User avatar
Reactor
Posts: 2091
Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2011 6:39 pm
Location: Island's Beauty, Hungary

Re: Did WWII allied soldiers make use of enemy firearms?

Post by Reactor »

It was very common for Allied soldiers on espionage missions, but that's understandable. An Allied soldier wearing Waffen-SS uniform and holding a Sten or Thompson would be a little suspicious.
Apart from this, it was not a common practice alright, but necessity is a powerful force - at trenchbattles, I believe many infantrymen obtained killed enemies' firearms, if their own ran out of ammo. One of my favourite books, "Skirmish line" tells the story of a Soviet sergeant during the Finnish winter war, and all the unspeakable horrors he encountered. It turned out that the cold was so unimaginibly bitter that the Soviets' firearms broke to shards much like glass when they wished to shoot or reload. On the other hand, the Finnish Suomi machineguns were in perfect condition, it didn't give a fuck about the minus forty, so in many occassions, they had to swap. Same goes for ammo - you can't have much use of a bullet if the gunpowder is frozen solid.

When searching medium bases for the FG42 paratroop rifle, I read on the Wiki that its concept lived on in Allied hand weapons, so the Allies actually made better use of that gun than the Germans.
User avatar
wildweasel
Posts: 21706
Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2003 7:33 pm
Preferred Pronouns: He/Him
Operating System Version (Optional): A lot of them
Graphics Processor: Not Listed
Contact:

Re: Did WWII allied soldiers make use of enemy firearms?

Post by wildweasel »

While I don't have any sources for this, I have heard stories of American troops being mistakenly attacked by other Americans because of the distinctive sound of the enemies' weapons. Though most of those stories were from later wars, like Vietnam (where dropping one's M-16 in favor of a far more reliable AK-47 was not unheard of), I wouldn't doubt that it might happen in World War II.
User avatar
kodi
 
 
Posts: 1355
Joined: Mon May 06, 2013 8:02 am

Re: Did WWII allied soldiers make use of enemy firearms?

Post by kodi »

So much so that they were sometimes given adopted and given official designations when enough of them were captured (german use of the russian PPSH-41 for example). For individual soldiers it wasn't as common as videogames would have you believe unless they were caught in outdrawn engagements or were otherwise under supplied.
User avatar
Matt
Posts: 9696
Joined: Sun Jan 04, 2004 5:37 pm
Preferred Pronouns: They/Them
Operating System Version (Optional): Debian Bullseye
Location: Gotham City SAR, Wyld-Lands of the Lotus People, Dominionist PetroConfederacy of Saudi Canadia
Contact:

Re: Did WWII allied soldiers make use of enemy firearms?

Post by Matt »

If I gotta shoot a guy and the only gun around is his, what's a little theft on top of murder? :twisted:

But I think given the opportunity most of us would rather go with what we're used to (assuming it's functional)... using stolen enemy gear is a lot less disorienting than using someone else's computer or driving their car without readjusting the seat and mirrors and possibly changing the station, but it's got to result in a few missed shots at least.
User avatar
Apothem
Posts: 2070
Joined: Sat Nov 29, 2003 7:13 pm
Location: Performing open heart surgery on an ACS compiler.

Re: Did WWII allied soldiers make use of enemy firearms?

Post by Apothem »

wildweasel wrote:While I don't have any sources for this, I have heard stories of American troops being mistakenly attacked by other Americans because of the distinctive sound of the enemies' weapons. Though most of those stories were from later wars, like Vietnam (where dropping one's M-16 in favor of a far more reliable AK-47 was not unheard of), I wouldn't doubt that it might happen in World War II.

From what I've learned about the topic, this rings very true. IT's more of an issue of the sound and presentation of what you've got in your hands than the uniform. Especially considering that you're fighting guys who generally dont wear uniforms to begin with.
User avatar
Matt
Posts: 9696
Joined: Sun Jan 04, 2004 5:37 pm
Preferred Pronouns: They/Them
Operating System Version (Optional): Debian Bullseye
Location: Gotham City SAR, Wyld-Lands of the Lotus People, Dominionist PetroConfederacy of Saudi Canadia
Contact:

Re: Did WWII allied soldiers make use of enemy firearms?

Post by Matt »

User avatar
Naniyue
Posts: 884
Joined: Fri Mar 13, 2009 8:06 pm

Re: Did WWII allied soldiers make use of enemy firearms?

Post by Naniyue »

Wow! That photo was definitely unexpected!

I may be wrong, but I seem to recall from a couple episodes of Tales of the Gun that one US soldier kept an AK-47 as a trophy during the Vietnam War, and that another US soldier in WWII did use the MP40 sometimes.
User avatar
NeuralStunner
 
 
Posts: 12328
Joined: Tue Jul 21, 2009 12:04 pm
Preferred Pronouns: No Preference
Operating System Version (Optional): Windows 11
Graphics Processor: nVidia with Vulkan support
Location: capital N, capital S, no space
Contact:

Re: Did WWII allied soldiers make use of enemy firearms?

Post by NeuralStunner »

wildweasel wrote:While I don't have any sources for this, I have heard stories of American troops being mistakenly attacked by other Americans because of the distinctive sound of the enemies' weapons.
This occasionally makes me worry about picking out gun sounds that "sound good" but aren't "authentic". With so many gun nuts around, I almost expect someone to yell at me for it. :P
User avatar
wildweasel
Posts: 21706
Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2003 7:33 pm
Preferred Pronouns: He/Him
Operating System Version (Optional): A lot of them
Graphics Processor: Not Listed
Contact:

Re: Did WWII allied soldiers make use of enemy firearms?

Post by wildweasel »

I feel like "authentic" and "sounds good" are almost mutually exclusive. "Authentic" gun sounds tend to just be sharp cracks, with most of the perceived sound actually being the pressure wave you feel (especially evident on things like higher-power rifles and shotguns). They don't record especially well, so a lot of after-touch gets applied to make up for the lack of pressure wave. So effective sound design more boils down to matching the right amount of "boom" to the right amount of actual in-game power. It's more an art than a science.
User avatar
Matt
Posts: 9696
Joined: Sun Jan 04, 2004 5:37 pm
Preferred Pronouns: They/Them
Operating System Version (Optional): Debian Bullseye
Location: Gotham City SAR, Wyld-Lands of the Lotus People, Dominionist PetroConfederacy of Saudi Canadia
Contact:

Re: Did WWII allied soldiers make use of enemy firearms?

Post by Matt »

One thing that's crossed my mind a few times was to just look up some news item about some terrorist attack, take the gunshots sounds from that, and just get rid of some noise and clipping, but keep feeling that's basically the sound equivalent of when Sgt Mark IV wanted to use real dead people pics for some gore sprites...
User avatar
wildweasel
Posts: 21706
Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2003 7:33 pm
Preferred Pronouns: He/Him
Operating System Version (Optional): A lot of them
Graphics Processor: Not Listed
Contact:

Re: Did WWII allied soldiers make use of enemy firearms?

Post by wildweasel »

Vaecrius wrote:One thing that's crossed my mind a few times was to just look up some news item about some terrorist attack, take the gunshots sounds from that, and just get rid of some noise and clipping, but keep feeling that's basically the sound equivalent of when Sgt Mark IV wanted to use real dead people pics for some gore sprites...
If you want real gunshot sounds from news reports, try looking up footage of military training exercises. In some cases, said footage may even be public domain.
Post Reply

Return to “Off-Topic”