The First ZDoom Community Map Project is Finished!

Biff · Post by **Biff** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 3:18 pm

Probably in the listing of editors used? If Enjay mapped.....
Just looking at the wad now, you guys have done a great job here, congrats to all!

HotWax · Post by **HotWax** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 3:34 pm

Hmm.. Perhaps the heading for that section should be changed to "Free Editors Used". Then it would be truthful.

Post by **Enjay** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 3:48 pm

Well, if we are talking about the text file (and I'm not sure that we are), then I hadn't actually noticed, but DeePsea is missing from the editors used section, as is HellMaker which Pablo used.

I have no idea if HellMaker is free or not, but WadAuthor isn't and it is mentioned so it can't be a "Free editors used" section.

The in game credits fly by certainly mention both DeePsea and HellMaker though (and WA for that matter).

Post by **randi** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 4:33 pm

Arr, I see none of my compressed sounds made their way into the final wad. How'd that happen? You could have made the wad (and zip) a bit smaller had those been used. Same goes for a zero-sized BLOCKMAP. But at least the REJECT isn't present, so semi-yay!

randomlag · Post by **randomlag** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 5:55 pm

Yes the text file is missing credits

The issue isn't detail though is it? The issue is the claim that this is the largest level, which it's not. Pretty simple to be objective. Just use exactly the same objective facts used to make the claim Graf. All this stuff about "detail" is merely avoiding the obvious!

This reminds me of a preacher a few weeks ago who claimed that "only 5 people objected" - when confronted with a decision his church made that affected a whole bunch of neighbors. Later I found out only 6 people were asked. In his mind, he thought he was telling the truth. Was he?

Post by **Graf Zahl** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 6:20 pm

[pedantic]
No, it's not. I don't think anybody ever denied that RTC-3057 Map02 contains more sidedefs etc. But when defining 'large' in map terms there are other factors as well. The community map covers twice the area of that map and contains a lot less redundancy. And if we want to become really picky what about the binary size of the file? For example, stripped of all nodes and with compressed sidedefs it *IS* larger than RTC-3057 Map02 ! And for me that value is the true defining factor of map size.

[/pedantic]

Risen · Post by **Risen** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 6:45 pm

Sorry, but uh... who cares?

taco · Post by **taco** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 7:29 pm

randomlag, obviously.

Risen · Post by **Risen** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 7:55 pm

That's an awesome avatar.

randomlag · Post by **randomlag** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 9:32 pm

Graf Zahl wrote:[pedantic]
No, it's not. I don't think anybody ever denied that RTC-3057 Map02 contains more sidedefs etc. But when defining 'large' in map terms there are other factors as well. The community map covers twice the area of that map and contains a lot less redundancy. And if we want to become really picky what about the binary size of the file? For example, stripped of all nodes and with compressed sidedefs it *IS* larger than RTC-3057 Map02 ! And for me that value is the true defining factor of map size.

[/pedantic]

Sure Graf, you sound just like that preacher.. PURE bull shit. Nobody every denied re: RTC-3057 because nobody realized it and it never came up.

It's very simple: The claim is that this is "the biggest map ever". Says so RIGHT IN THE FRIGGEN LEVEL in BIG letters. And it was repeated over and over in the thread. Or do you want to argue about even this?

I suggest you learn to accept the objective facts for what they are. It was important enough to make those "letters" in the level. And it was important enough to have that claim made repeatedly. There were no qualifying conditions in that claim. Hell, if this became a subjective thing (which is what you are trying desperately to do), then water is fire and shit doesn't stink. Just draw a big friggen square, load the pwad with 1 gig of music and now you have your "biggest level ever".

Nobody has ever given a rat's ass about the "area" or binary size or blah blah. That's NEVER been a way to judge the "size" of a level - PERIOD. But if you insist, then RTC3057 level geometry for map02 is 2,283,666 vs 2,155,094 (including junk lines + THINGS don't count).

Compressed sidedefs means absolutely nothing. All that says is how many areas contain the same sort of sectors and textures, but says nothing about the level size. 10-Sector makes that point obvious to anyone. IOW, an even more ridiculous claim.

Do I care? NO. That's a pretty funny statement and reflects more on the group than on me. Graf cares enough to call white black. And YOU guys cared enough to make that claim over and over.

It's not a big deal - I was merely making an observation that someone else may also notice. Just be honest, it's not too much to ask is it?

Giest118 · Post by **Giest118** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 10:17 pm

To anyone who likes RandomLag: THIS is why everyone (well, alot of people, anyway) hates him.

HotWax · Post by **HotWax** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 10:24 pm

God dammit, somebody give him his pills and send him back to his cage.

giest: well said.

cccp_leha · Post by **cccp_leha** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 10:29 pm

It really isn't as much about what RandomLag says, it's how he says it. If his monologues weren't brought forward in such a cynical and mocking manner, they would not be met with such strong dislike. And I just have to throw this in: "what I told you was true... from a certain point of view".

Post by **NiGHTMARE** » Fri Sep 03, 2004 2:40 am

HotWax wrote:Hmm.. Perhaps the heading for that section should be changed to "Free Editors Used". Then it would be truthful.

Na, more like "Crap Editors Used"

.

Post by **Graf Zahl** » Fri Sep 03, 2004 2:41 am

I didn't expect anything but that particular response...