[Hexen] Serpent: Resurrection [New version 09/2017]

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Frozenwolf150
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Re: [Hexen] Serpent: Resurrection [New version 11/2012]

Post by Frozenwolf150 »

Ethril wrote:Aren't Air Elementals incorporeal (+GHOST) and therefore immune to certain weapons? Maybe that transfers over to the pig morph?
I did some more testing and you're absolutely right. At the time, I had run out of mana and had hoped to use the Porkalator plus my staff to kill them. My staff had no effect on them. However, I saw a stray shot from another Air Elemental hit a pig, and it died. I've tested the Porkalator on other enemies and the pigs are perfectly vulnerable there.
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Frozenwolf150
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Re: [Hexen] Serpent: Resurrection [New version 11/2012]

Post by Frozenwolf150 »

I have another question. Why were the ranged attack modes taken away from Quietus and the Purifier? I was testing out each of the characters by starting a new game and using the "give weapons" cheat, so that I could familiarize myself with their respective arsenals, and I noticed that these two weapons are now strictly melee. I can't toggle the modes like I can with Timon's Axe or the Hammer of Retribution. As melee-only weapons, Quietus and the Purifier are rather mediocre, with their only attributes being that the Quietus hits twice and the Purifier knocks enemies back. Do certain stats have to be at a certain level before I can use their ranged attacks, or something?

I was considering playing as Anvar next, but after seeing this, now I have my doubts.

ETA: Okay, I did some more testing with Anvar and I think I discovered the reason for this anomaly. I was playing through the Eastern Shore and came upon the site where I pick up the Hammer of Retribution. A scripted event gives you the non-mana version of the hammer, along with the author's note, while picking up the hammer item itself gives you the mana-using version of the hammer. I was able to determine this because by carefully positioning myself, I was able to pick up the mana and non-mana versions separately. Apparently the "give weapons" cheat does not give you both versions of the Quietus and Purifier, just the non-mana versions. (Is there a special console command to give you the mana-using versions, by the way?) Of course, I'll have to wait until I get the Quietus and Purifier assembled before I know this for certain, but I think this may be what was causing it.

I also found out that the game gives you the non-mana version of Anvar's 6th weapon as soon as you pick up a red mana crystal. You don't get a message indicating this, but you're able to equip it regardless.
Last edited by Frozenwolf150 on Mon Oct 20, 2014 2:48 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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krokots
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Re: [Hexen] Serpent: Resurrection [New version 11/2012]

Post by krokots »

I've played through original hexen wad with RPG+weapons version of this mod, cleric, on highest diff, and i have to say, it is pretty balanced.
All of weapons are useful:
Mace - vs ettins, and crap you don't want to waste mana on
Serpent Staff - without life stealing it's still very powerful and useful against bosses
Firestorm - best on crazy chaos serpents, weak against low "radius" monsters, like bishops
Raven Staff - pretty versatile, good on everything, sucks mana at fast rate
Freeze(?) Bow - excellent on bishops, 2 shots freezes one. Kind of sniper weapon, tho you must get used to arrow arcing.
Wraithverge - cc weapon, works best on afrits and centaurs, and when you just don't want to waste time.
Lightbringer - i did not use it much, tho it works well in tight situations (eg. Necropolis)
The playthrough also gave me hatered for chaos serpents. Bastards.
As for the stats, wisdom is key to victory. When it's maxed, possibly put points to constitution, and have at least 4 sorcery - to cast protection.
At first i didn't want to teleport to town, just to test is it possible to win the game without it, but i visited it 4 times. I think it is possible to beat this on hardest difficulty without using town. Just need to know well the game and waste much time using mace for mana conservation. I must say it was pretty entertaining, so maybe i'll play with another class soon.
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Frozenwolf150
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Re: [Hexen] Serpent: Resurrection [New version 11/2012]

Post by Frozenwolf150 »

I just beat this mod using Sallazar, and I have a ton of comments, which I'll model after evouga's post on the previous page:


Overall comments:

1. RPG system.

I like it, it reminds me of the Korax mod from the JDoom days. However, I hate it whenever an RPG has a level cap, as if to punish you for leveling up. I'm a fan of games like TES series, which let you become uber-powerful if you have the patience to invest the time and energy into building up your character. Obviously you can't do this in a game with a limited number of enemies, but it would create more incentive to fight them all, as opposed to running away.

I too think it would be a good idea to give an exp. bonus for things like completing quests and for finding secret areas (like in the Wrath of Cronos mod).


2. Magic system

As Sallazar, I had to rely on the magic system, as the two memorized spells kept me from dying every few steps I took. Though I can understand why it was removed, I really miss the Sapphire Wand. Maybe the staff can have an extended reach to compensate for this? It is a polearm after all. I also dislike the long delay after a spell has worn off before you can cast it again. I know this is for balance issues, but maybe the delay can depend on your Sorcery stat, as in a higher stat means less of a delay?

I actually found most of the spells to be useful, although due to their cost requirements, I didn't get much mileage out of high-end spells like Hellstorm until the Palace. The only spell I didn't like was Inferno, as it's a one-shot deal, doesn't hit enemies that aren't on your level, fizzles out after too short a distance, and is too expensive to justify its use. I would like it more if it sent out waves of fire over a certain duration, like Shrapnel.

Magic regeneration is useful, but too slow at lower levels IMO. If I'm going to just stand around waiting for points to regenerate anyway, why not at least make the points come back at a visible rate?


3. Weapons

The Scarab Staff is probably my least favorite weapon. It's underpowered, impractical, and inflicts physical rather than magical damage. I would rather it functioned more like it did in Hexen II, with a charged up shot that flies straight and passes through all enemies it hits. I hate the firing delay, the limited range that forces me to look up all the time, and the fact that the scarabs just sit there uselessly on the floor until an enemy is stupid enough to blunder into them. The fact that they can bounce off walls a short distance is useful though, and I did often use it to kill Wendigos.

I like the Lichbane, as it's useful for crowd control and killing non-flying enemies, but I think it's kind of pointless to have it damage you at close range. This can be easily remedied by using Protection, so why does this even happen at all?


4. Items

I would suggest increasing the carry values to 15 for all items. Forced inventory management should not be part of the challenge of the game, as it just adds needless frustration and backtracking to the store to sell excess items. I figure, if I'm just going to run back to the store anyway, why not simply allow me to carry 10 more of the given item?


5. Level scaling

I don't mind this in Wrath of Cronos and I don't mind it here. As long as the scaled enemies cough up more exp. when I destroy them, it makes it all worthwhile.


6. Monster spawning

I have to admit, the monsters that spawn when picking up certain quest items is pretty clever, and caught me off guard a few times. As for the random spawning of additional monsters, as in retail Hexen, I have mixed feelings about this. On one hand, it can get irritating, but on the other hand, you can get more exp.


Map by Map:

1. Lystern Harbour: I agree with what was already said about this map. There needs to be more stuff to do. I also think there should be a cheap way to heal yourself in town, since it's just the beginning of the game after all. Also, did you know it's totally possible to get permanently stuck if you try to re-enter the secret passage leading back to the palace? This happens in the endgame too. I had to use "noclip" to remedy this.

ETA: There's a typo in the dock master's dialogue. "I need all these barrels putting on board."

2. Barron Sea: I hate this part with a passion. On my previous low-end system, it ran like a slideshow. I couldn't play this mod at all until I got a new computer. A suggestion: Make the voyage path narrower, so GZDoom doesn't have to render the entire wide sea, but block view of the walls with fog or islands.

3. Eastern Shore: I like the music here, and the wilderness is fun to explore. However, it can still cause slowdowns on low-end systems. One issue I had when I could finally play it was that it's difficult to hunt down all the monsters, because it's not obvious where a lot of them are hiding.

4. Village of Gaea: I like this map, lots of goodies and plenty of detail. The boss fight against the Earth Lich in close quarters can be a pain though.

5. Village of Prometheus: A very clever map, even though it begs the question of who would be stupid enough to build a village on top of an active volcano. I agree with what was said about the Potions of Fire Protection. I kept getting roasted by fireballs more times than I'd like to count, and when you're wading through the lava, you can't exactly avoid fireballs spawning right underneath you.

6. Village of Uranus: I agree with what was said about this map. In the Doom engine, the sprite-based enemies turn into flat cutouts if you look too far up or down at them, making it nigh impossible to aim at them. The secret is very well hidden, maybe too well hidden.

7. Village of Oceanus: A good map, but the temple services are overpriced. There are cheaper ways to restore your health and magic. This applies to other maps that have temples as well.

8. Church of Selene: One of the few maps that didn't repeatedly kill me, very well designed. However, the boss fight against D'Sparil is relatively cramped compared to the one in Heretic. There isn't always enough room to run away and gain some distance, especially when he summons minions or casts that lightning trap.

9. Dauthi Marshes: I hate Stalkers, and I'm probably not the only one who finds this map frustrating as hell. I wish it were possible to make Stalkers visible if you submerge your head underwater, the way the killer fish and sharks are. That way you could kill them before they rise up and attack you, which usually carves off a good deal of HP if you're Sallazar.

10. Dauthi Volcano: A fun map to explore, with lots of treasure to be found. However, I hate platforming and jumping puzzles in general. It's like Super Mario from Hell. Or even worse, Ultima 8. And here's why I don't like being reminded of Ultima 8:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5QzComfZU4

11. Chasm of Fire: Great map, and a good place to restock your mana before continuing on. I think the hidden areas down in the lava should also be marked as secret areas, since they're just as hidden as the two official secret areas.

12. Monastery of Selene: Takes some patience to clear, but not bad at all. The boss fight against Korax is appropriately challenging.

13. Haunted Reaches: I hate the invisible enemies, especially the Nightmares, since you can only harm them when they come within melee range, which is a bad thing if you're Sallazar. The one thing I like about this map is that it's where you finally get your red mana weapon.

14. Meditation Chambers: The boss fights against the four grandmasters were memorable, and I like the way these were handled. Pretty easy as Sallazar too, as I could typically kill them within the duration of the Protection spell.

15. Storage Cellars: Not bad, although I wish I weren't inadvertently penalized if I accidentally blow up all the explosive barrels on the map, thus cutting off access to the Sky Sanctuary sidequest. It's also too easy to accidentally push a gunpowder barrel into a corner, making it impossible to move it any further. Maybe placing some closer to the wood panels that need to be destroyed would help. Also, I like the Doom 2 Easter Egg, but why do the exit switches punish you for touching them? Shouldn't you instead be rewarded for finding the Easter Egg?

16. Sky Sanctuary: Refer to what I said before about platform jumping puzzles. I particularly hate the slippery colored crystals; why not just give them flat tops? I do appreciate the generous amount of Jump Boots available though.

17. Icefields: I agree with what was already said about this map. There needs to be more landscape detail in the center of the map, so that it's not always the same strategy for dealing with the Wendigos. The glitch with the floating items that can't be grabbed appears here too, in the underground lake areas, specifically on the floating ice platforms. There also seems to be a sound latency glitch throughout this entire map, even on a high-end system. (Other large maps suffer the same problem.)

18. Dauthi Montain Pass: Catchy music, lots of room to maneuver, and judicious use of Summon makes this map a million times easier, especially when you get to the boss. I've heard from other players that this map is frustrating as hell as Anvar, since he can't cast Summon. Having more varied architecture and bottleneck points would help balance things out.

19. Palace Lower Level: Great architecture, tons of detail, lots of challenging enemies, and fun to explore. I like maps where you can go room to room, commando style, and systematically take everything out. I did run short on mana a few times, but given that the shops are right outside the palace, I can't complain. My one complaint is that it is possible to fall out the windows or off the walkways leading to the towers and land in the water. The fall won't kill you and you can skate on the surface of the water, but it's just weird to be able to access the blank areas of the map that you're not supposed to.

20. Palace Dungeons: Another good map, but somewhat cramped, which makes it hard to hit enemies around corners if you're Sallazar. The narrow walkways also make dodging their projectiles quite a challenge. I did get annoyed that there's no way out of the vats in the room in the southwest corner (the room with the Sabreclaws) if you fall in, without using Jump Boots. Also, the AI for the Acid Imps down here is a little glitched, in that they'll often get stuck behind the bridges instead of flying over or under them.

21. Frozen Fortress: I ran into a problem, in that if you slip and fall into the crumbled pits in the interior of the castle, there's no way out. You don't take any damage from the fall, so it won't kill you either. I did have Jump Boots, but I couldn't get high enough to escape the pits. Also, I quickly ran out of torches in the pitch black area, so it would help if there were more to pick up.

22. The Lost Temple: Very creative map, fun and rewarding to explore. My main complaint is that I quickly ran out of potions of Fire Protection and Water Breathing, and it's a LONG way back to the shops in the Dauthi Mountain Pass to restock, so it would help if there were more of these lying around the temple.

23. Middle Palace: Great map, but unfortunately prone to the same cabinet glitch with the floating items. Normally this isn't a game-breaking problem, since most cabinets contain items that can be bought at the shops, but on this particular level, you need the Axe Key. Said key is floating out of reach if your Dexterity is too low. The boss fight with the Heresiarch certainly kept me on my toes, but was a fair challenge, all things considered.

24. Upper Palace: I love the epic soundtrack here. I have to say it was especially satisfying to use the Annihilation spell in the large central room. The enemy swarm fight at the end is tough, but fair, and I got a lot of use out of my high level spells.

25. Outerworld: Remember what I said about Ultima 8? Yeah... At least the vertically-moving blocks aren't as unfair as the laterally-moving blocks. I just hope some day someone figures out how to implement 3D poly objs in GZDoom so that you don't have to walk to keep up with the laterally-moving blocks. The fight with Eidolon is pretty well balanced, and I never felt like I was struggling to keep up. Between the Protection spell and my strongest weapons, he went down pretty easily.

26. Race Home: Is there a time limit? If so, is there a way to display it? Like the poster who said it previously, I hate rushing through without killing everything.

27. Lystern Harbor 2: Okay, I was not prepared for the change here, where the enemies can actually bash open the gate and storm the castle. That makes the final battle even more intense. However, the time limit on this event is a bit illogical, as even if I clear the gate area of enemies (I used the Hellstorm spell) they still seem to be able to open it remotely. Though by that point, there weren't so many enemies left, and they were easy to take out since they were all ignoring me in favor of storming the castle.


General Suggestions:

Get rid of the limited stat rerolls and just allow infinite rerolls at the beginning. If I don't like the stats after using up the rerolls, I'm just going to start a new game again, so it's kind of pointless to have a limit.

Maybe implement the feature from Wrath of Cronos that shows you a readout of the enemy's level and HP, and the feature that shows numbers over a monster's head indicating how much damage you're inflicting.

It would be helpful if the HP, mana, and magic point displays were shown as current / maximum. That way you don't have to guess, and you're less likely to waste pickups and inventory items.

Just a consideration, since I know it's asking a lot, but having a secondary firing mode for each weapon like in other Hexen mods would be cool. This would eliminate the need to toggle the Fighter's weapon modes in the heat of battle.
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Frozenwolf150
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Re: [Hexen] Serpent: Resurrection [New version 11/2012]

Post by Frozenwolf150 »

I'm on my current playthrough as Qinefer, and while I like the new class, I'm running into some serious balance issues. Agile but fragile is how I'd describe the assassin. So far, I've blown a ton of gold on Potions of Life. I've also had a lot of problems with running out of mana in later maps, especially in the Palace, as by that point it feels like I'm firing Nerf guns at the enemies. It takes me several Kraters of Might to get through each level of the Palace, and I'm wondering if I'm doing something wrong. No matter how high I pump her dexterity, which is currently at 32, her weapons just don't seem to be doing enough damage. Her combined weapons, the Viperlash and Tempestkeeper, are powerful but way too costly to be worth using, so I'm forced to stick with her normal weapons.

I have one more level of the Palace to go, but once I run out of gold, I'm screwed.

ETA: I beat the game with Qinefer, but just barely. Her weapons are unbalanced and underpowered. They take way too long to kill enemies, and in the final map, you're racing the clock before the monster hordes bash down the gates. The Viperlash would be more useful in the early game; later on, it's more of a hassle and takes too long to kill groups of enemies. The Tempestkeeper is powerful, but sucks away way too much mana to be practical.
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The Ultimate DooMer
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Re: [Hexen] Serpent: Resurrection [New version 11/2012]

Post by The Ultimate DooMer »

New version on the way soon - a more detailed changelog will be posted at some point (as I've still got 1 more class to play through), but the biggest changes are as follows:
Spoiler:
In this project dead now?
Nope, it was finished therefore alive and well :P
I still hate, hate, hate that they do this. There's a tradition in Hexen of making monsters appear *randomly* after every few minutes you spend on a map -- at least Serpent: Resurrection doesn't do that. But it's still incredibly annoying and I wish it weren't there (previously locked doors opening up and new enemies streaming out of them is fair game, by contrast).
I have to admit, the monsters that spawn when picking up certain quest items is pretty clever, and caught me off guard a few times. As for the random spawning of additional monsters, as in retail Hexen, I have mixed feelings about this. On one hand, it can get irritating, but on the other hand, you can get more exp.
The main thing to remember about this feature is that they only add a fixed number of mobs to each map, and as such I included them as part of the overall mob count in each map. It was done to emulate the old RPG's (where you'd get random encounters every few rooms etc.), but without the annoyance of said encounters being infinite in number.
One suggestion: the fire potion makes you immune to the lava, but not to the fireballs that fly everywhere in lava areas (this is also a problem later in the volcano). It would make more sense if you were immune (or at least heavily resistant) to both.
I agree with what was said about the Potions of Fire Protection. I kept getting roasted by fireballs more times than I'd like to count, and when you're wading through the lava, you can't exactly avoid fireballs spawning right underneath you.
Unfortunately there's no way to dynamically adjust DamageFactor for specific damage types (only the universal DamageFactor), so I can't fix this issue. (savegames are all I can suggest)
What happens if you raise the water level before rescuing the prisoners? Do they drown?
Try it and see for yourself ;)
The final level is OK... it could be even better, to end a great WAD on a high note. For one thing, the enemies don't actually seem to be actively attacking the palace: they are must milling around town, and can't seem to open the palace gate. They should be storming the palace -- with Selene, Banedon, and the palace guards actively fighting them -- when you arrive.
It does do that if you manage to run out of time before you get back...at which point it's impossible to save everyone :P (hence why you get time to kill them beforehand)
This is a known problem due to how the handling of polyobjects changed a few years ago.
Dunno what change it was, but it has essentially broken 2-sided polyobjects (which are essential for any 3D building). It lifts up any corpses etc. that are in it's path and drops them down afterwards, it does the same with any solid object that's within a massive radius of the 2-sided poly (leaving them in the air if they have +NOGRAVITY like all Serpent's items are), yet ignores those directly behind if they're far enough away from it and the wall. I've moved all solid objects away from the doors and added a hack for the cupboards, but I'm far from happy about it.
I also dislike the long delay after a spell has worn off before you can cast it again. I know this is for balance issues, but maybe the delay can depend on your Sorcery stat, as in a higher stat means less of a delay?
Cooldown reduction on spells would be too OP, as you'd reach the point where you could keep the protection spell up for most of the time.
As long as the scaled enemies cough up more exp. when I destroy them, it makes it all worthwhile.
Which they do, the exp formula is based on a percentage of the mob's health.
A suggestion: Make the voyage path narrower, so GZDoom doesn't have to render the entire wide sea, but block view of the walls with fog or islands.
It does do this - in fact the main "open sea" bit is actually quite small (with horizon lines) and the camera teleports a lot between different scenes. (GZDoom 2.1 breaks the sky fog though)
Also, I like the Doom 2 Easter Egg, but why do the exit switches punish you for touching them? Shouldn't you instead be rewarded for finding the Easter Egg?
It's actually a pisstake of dwango5 map 07 (a very overplayed DM mapset), and in DM the exit is always set to kill you.
Is there a time limit? If so, is there a way to display it? Like the poster who said it previously, I hate rushing through without killing everything.
There is a timer, but it's deliberately not shown for several reasons:
1) Eidolon doesn't tell you how long you have. (realism)
2) It adds a sense of urgency. (particularly around decision making)
3) It allows me to do various things under the hood - eg. to set a different time limit for each class (they all have differing levels of ability to beat the city invasion) and to adjust the timer if you skip a cutscene.
Okay, I was not prepared for the change here, where the enemies can actually bash open the gate and storm the castle. That makes the final battle even more intense. However, the time limit on this event is a bit illogical, as even if I clear the gate area of enemies (I used the Hellstorm spell) they still seem to be able to open it remotely.
They can't open the gate until they reach it, what you probably saw was a flying mob going over the top and triggering it from the air.
Maybe implement the feature from Wrath of Cronos that shows you a readout of the enemy's level and HP, and the feature that shows numbers over a monster's head indicating how much damage you're inflicting
I dunno about nameplates...my experience with those (in a certain MMO) is that they just add screen clutter and framerate drops.
I beat the game with Qinefer, but just barely. Her weapons are unbalanced and underpowered.
I've buffed her quite a bit recently (see the above changes), played through on Heroic and she's certainly a lot more balanced and fun now. (particularly later on now the big weapons have been sorted)
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Ed the Bat
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Re: [Hexen] Serpent: Resurrection [New version coming 12/201

Post by Ed the Bat »

He reappears! I honestly thought he may have been gone forever.

If you're updating, would you be willing to consider incorporating the fixes/revisions I've done?
The Ultimate DooMer wrote:Unfortunately there's no way to dynamically adjust DamageFactor for specific damage types (only the universal DamageFactor), so I can't fix this issue. (savegames are all I can suggest)
PowerProtection can do exactly this.
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Crudux Cruo
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Re: [Hexen] Serpent: Resurrection [New version coming 12/201

Post by Crudux Cruo »

Nice man, good stuff. i cant wait for your new version :)
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Frozenwolf150
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Re: [Hexen] Serpent: Resurrection [New version 11/2012]

Post by Frozenwolf150 »

The Ultimate DooMer wrote:I dunno about nameplates...my experience with those (in a certain MMO) is that they just add screen clutter and framerate drops.
Could this be an optional feature then, that the player can toggle on and off at will?
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Jblade
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Re: [Hexen] Serpent: Resurrection [New version coming 12/201

Post by Jblade »

Wow, that's great news to hear! I was planning on replaying this but I'll wait a little while longer for your updated version. Just want to say that Serpent Resurrection's one of my favorite mods ever - I only got around to playing it last year but it was just a fantastic play that I couldn't tear myself away from (I think I played it around the same time as when I got Bioshock infinite and I couldn't bring myself to finish that but I sat glued to my seat to beat SR over the course of 2 days) I couldn't imagine playing with a different soundtrack though, but considering how well you did a job of picking the first set of tunes I trust that the alternate soundtrack will be just as fitting.
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The Ultimate DooMer
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Re: [Hexen] Serpent: Resurrection [New version coming 12/201

Post by The Ultimate DooMer »

New changelog up on the OP, hoping to get the new version out within the next week or two.
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The Ultimate DooMer
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Re: [Hexen] Serpent: Resurrection [New version 12/2014]

Post by The Ultimate DooMer »

New version is up on idgames. See the changelog on the OP, or the tl:dr version below it for the main gameplay changes.

edit: standalone mods updated too now.
Lars2500
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Re: [Hexen] Serpent: Resurrection [New version 12/2014]

Post by Lars2500 »

I saw that another new version appeared on idgames, dated January 15.

May I ask what has changed?
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Re: [Hexen] Serpent: Resurrection [New version 12/2014]

Post by Skrell »

please update screenshots...all the links appear dead to me.
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The Ultimate DooMer
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Re: [Hexen] Serpent: Resurrection [New version 12/2014]

Post by The Ultimate DooMer »

Fixed now, they were the original shots I put up years ago though.
I saw that another new version appeared on idgames, dated January 15.

May I ask what has changed?
Nothing much really. I made some changes to the RPG mod so I could make a patch for Tower of Chaos, and decided to tweak one or two universal things while I was at it. I wouldn't normally update for something minor like that, but given I was uploading a bunch of stuff anyway (I'd updated all my ZDoom stuff and was waiting on the archive to come back up) I decided to go ahead.

(nothing compared to the changes I'm working on atm though)
Last edited by The Ultimate DooMer on Sat Jan 24, 2015 3:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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