[WIP] GZDA - Virus Issues (p. 16)

[eliw00d]

alright, i'll start looking into slugs. what about the rare chances for bandoliers and the auto shotgun? do you guys like that? if so, how rare should they be?

[eliw00d]

my brother and i have barely had time to thoroughly test the current build, so i put it up for download on page 1. let me know what you guys think so far! also, the bfg has not been fixed, i'm still trying to find a good solution to that problem.

[Matt]

Holy crap you're actually going that route with the microgun @_@

It would be nice if there were some logical connection between the autoshotgun appearing and its ammo doing so. Maybe call an ACS script that checks for an autoshotgun nearby or spawn both drums and autos based on a single 1d20 roll per level?

As for shell types, how about making the auto shots weaker, possibly reflecting a smaller-caliber shell? It would provide a consistent explanation why you can't just switch the shells back and forth between it and the other two shotguns, while not making it some uber-god weapon that might spell the difference between a cakewalk and a slugfest (no pun intended) on some maps depending on whether it spawns.

And I think if you're going to add custom shell types, the best weapon for it would be side-by-side. I've tried doing it just for two types on a pump-action and it was a pain in the ass (though admittedly fun).

[eliw00d]

Holy crap you're actually going that route with the microgun @_@

is this implying that it is a bad thing or a good thing? hehe.

the auto shotgun was mostly just something i threw in for custom maps that my brother and i make, but i figured some sort of random chance of it spawning based on pre-existing items for regular doom maps would be cool. this is a really early build, so what you see now doesn't reflect on its future state. hopefully time will tell if it is worth keeping this way. i do like the random chance of bandoliers showing up, though. my brother and i played through earlier and it was neat finding the rare spawns.

[Phucket]

I'm not sure whether this is intentional or not, but the shotgun guys are ridiculously overpowered. I just got shot by one who was quite aways from me and my health dropped from 100 to 34.
I tried playing on the lowest difficulty, and I still took a shit load of damage from just one hit.

The chaingunguys seem a bit overpowered as well. Just staying out in the open for a couple of seconds is all it takes for them to chew you apart.

[eliw00d]

I'm not sure whether this is intentional or not, but the shotgun guys are ridiculously overpowered. I just got shot by one who was quite aways from me and my health dropped from 100 to 34.
I tried playing on the lowest difficulty, and I still took a shit load of damage from just one hit.

The chaingunguys seem a bit overpowered as well. Just staying out in the open for a couple of seconds is all it takes for them to chew you apart.

ah, now that you mention it, i forgot to change the shotgun guy's spread from 4,4 to 12,12 in that particular build (it has since been fixed otherwise in my current build). i uploaded the most current build to reflect that change, among other things. the microgun guys are a different story, they will take some definite balancing, so any input on how they should be tweaked would be nice.

also, if you run across any bugs or other concerns, please let me know as i would like to make things as balanced as possible.

[Matt]

Hence my "holy crap" - balancing an enemy with that kind of firepower is going to be a bitch. I'm actually a bit surprised that the microgunners currently take so long to kill the player.

That said, the player already has more hitpoints, accuracy, and intelligence (both information and judgement), not to mention comic-book-superhero-level strength and speed, so giving the doomguy any more advantage kinda takes away from the point of giving the monsters equal weaponry. But then again, following this "point" through does sorta preclude compatibility with some maps...

In Hideous Destructor I've decided (as of the upcoming New Year's release) to add a new skill level where the monsters do 1/3 the damage but things are set to Hard otherwise, just to have an option to play the mod on a traditional map without resorting to -host 1 and turning the game into a one-man Somme. Maybe you might want a similar option between "realistic" and "Doomlike" behaviour to address different gameplay balance concerns?

[eliw00d]

build 2 has been uploaded, download it from page 1 as always. check the changelog for more specific details, so far build 2 has mostly been all about balancing the weapons and monsters. my brother and i will play through one of the iWADs today and see how it all balances out, but report anything you guys find as well!

[Matt]

Just tried this on map15. I like how the inaccuracy creates a dynamic where you're always choosing between keeping a "safe" distance where even the microgunners do only nibble damage, versus going in close and minimizing your exposure to any fire by killing off the enemy quickly.

One issue, though: I'm taking like 13-15 shots with the pistol to take out one imp at point blank range. (contrast vanilla 6-8) Combined with the disposed ammo forcing a choice between tactical reloads and having anything for the next fight (or the next enemy in this fight), things get pretty desperate before I can get another weapon. Is this intended?

[eliw00d]

Just tried this on map15. I like how the inaccuracy creates a dynamic where you're always choosing between keeping a "safe" distance where even the microgunners do only nibble damage, versus going in close and minimizing your exposure to any fire by killing off the enemy quickly.

One issue, though: I'm taking like 13-15 shots with the pistol to take out one imp at point blank range. (contrast vanilla 6-8) Combined with the disposed ammo forcing a choice between tactical reloads and having anything for the next fight (or the next enemy in this fight), things get pretty desperate before I can get another weapon. Is this intended?

it's definitely intended, the sidearm is, well, a sidearm. it's meant to be a last resort, even though it's your starting weapon. if this is a big concern, i can look into it. but considering the sidearm shoots twice as fast as the Doom pistol, i figured it could do around half the damage.

[Tenement Funster]

I don't really understand why the microgun's slower alt-fire mode has a longer warm-up time than the full speed mode. The long warm-up time makes it practically useless, and more aggrivating to use than fun. Perhaps the alt-fire mode could act more like the classic chaingun?

As for the BFG charging, I never use the BFG unless I want to do a ton of damage. I'd never waste precious ammo with lesser charged shots. I was thinking that there's either two levels of charge, or seperate firing modes for each. One could be the railgun, and the other the more traditional BFG shot.

Speaking of BFG, I found an odd bug. After firing a fully charged shot that hits nothing but a wall, if you try to fire again with the empty clip while near the blasted wall, a bunch of railgun shots instantly come out of the wall(?) and kill you. I tried this with the lesser charged shots and nothing happened, along with it not occuring when hitting monsters (even if it's not a direct hit, but one of the railguns things coming out of the BFG shot)

[eliw00d]

I don't really understand why the microgun's slower alt-fire mode has a longer warm-up time than the full speed mode. The long warm-up time makes it practically useless, and more aggrivating to use than fun. Perhaps the alt-fire mode could act more like the classic chaingun?

As for the BFG charging, I never use the BFG unless I want to do a ton of damage. I'd never waste precious ammo with lesser charged shots. I was thinking that there's either two levels of charge, or seperate firing modes for each. One could be the railgun, and the other the more traditional BFG shot.

Speaking of BFG, I found an odd bug. After firing a fully charged shot that hits nothing but a wall, if you try to fire again with the empty clip while near the blasted wall, a bunch of railgun shots instantly come out of the wall(?) and kill you. I tried this with the lesser charged shots and nothing happened, along with it not occuring when hitting monsters (even if it's not a direct hit, but one of the railguns things coming out of the BFG shot)

the microgun's slower alt fire hasn't been touched since i changed the rest of the weapon. i'm still balancing out the weapon in general, and have been thinking about more fire modes. i'll change the windup speed for the 500rpm mode asap, though, since you brought it up. i'm only one guy and there are so many things to cover.

i assure you the bfg will go through a major revamp soon enough, i just need to figure out how i'm going to make it work. i want it to be unique, but when it comes to projectile code i'm not the greatest.

in other news, i have replaced the sidearm with eriance's new pistol sprite. this new pistol is what i wanted to do from the start. instead of 9mm like the sidearm, it is .45acp with a 12+1 capacity. the damage has been increased due to this, as well as the kickback and recoil. the rate of fire has been adjusted for the heavier round, as well. there is no select fire mode, so you are stuck with the same rate of fire. the increase in damage balances this greatly, however. it acts much like the original doom pistol, more or less. if you want an incomplete build without reload animations just to see what it's like, download here. the sidearm has been renamed the machine pistol and as of now functions the same as it did, only with its own ammo type now. i'm toying with the idea of keeping it in as a rare weapon you can find. i will probably give it select fire between semi and full auto, but keep everything else the same (capacity, reload speed, etc).

[eliw00d]

i released an update to Build 3, so if you don't have the December 31st 11:08am version, be sure to download from the link on page 1 again. changelog reflects the updates to that build. the update mostly deals with the alt fires for several weapons. still working out the reloading frames for the new pistol.

[Orangewaggs]

ill definately download the one that has the new pistol but this is goos the only problem(although it realistic) is the way the pistol and machine shotgun reload and how musch the pisol eats through its ammo anyways....

[Matt]

Gotta admit, even if it does about the same damage per second I like the .45's feel a lot better than the old sidearm... might just be because I've been conditioned to associate the old gun's sprite with semi-auto buttonmashing or something, but I feel more like I'm running around looking for a "better" weapon rather than a "real" one.

Balance feels pretty much on par with Doom, although the specific playing style remains noticeably different with the faster shooting balanced by the reloading periods.

Haven't encountered the auto shotgun yet...