[Public Beta] Ultimate Simplicity (Episodes 1-4)

[Cutmanmike]

You know, I wasn't really saying that this wad is bad/horrible/crap or whatever so the insults are just transparent here.

So I just finished the second chapter and IMO the later on the better it is. I loved the weird void map at the end, and the boss was rather funky I might add.

Two bugs though that you might have already changed:

1) In the long library there's an elevator near the start which goes down to a hellknight. If you bump your head on the ceiling as it's going back up a big void is revealed when it comes back down again.

2) Not exactly a bug but it seems pretty out of place. The hectebus' mass seems to be way too low, along with it's painchance. You can literally juggle them around with the plasma rifle. This happens in Torm's sapphire too.

[Zippy]

1. It allows a new feel to the interface.. especially for a 13+ year old game. How often do we have to see the same stupid hud?
2. It allows authors to demostrate their creativity with Zdoom's ACS. You may be surprised to just how powerful ACS really is.

As nice as this is, making custom HUDs optional goes a long way in my book. It's just plain fact that not everyone is going to like a (or the) new HUD, just as not everyone likes the status bar. You'll notice that the status bar in Doom is optional. It even has a third, reduced mode. GZDoom supplies yet another mode (the alternative HUD). Providing the optional behavior to custom HUDs is something I think is critical in wads where there are no new gameplay elements, and hence no new important information that the HUD needs to show.

In addition to this, the procedure itself is hardly difficult. All the needs to be done is surround the whole HUD drawing script in a check if the HUD is on or off. Don't draw it if it's on and draw it if it's off. Then provide a script that will toggle the outcome of that check.

[Graf Zahl]

That won't work. All graphics for the original HUD have been replaced by empty placeholders so if the custom HUD was disabled the standard one still wouldn't show.

[HotWax]

I never cried about anything in that post. Perhaps your satire detector is broken? If you bothered to look at the date on it, you'd see that it was written at least 2 months ago.

My apologies then; clearly my "satire" detector was broken. However, my original point directed to Kaiser still stands. Cutman didn't act like a "crybaby" anywhere in his post. Your response combined with Kaiser's seemed overly defensive to the point of resorting to unnecessary insults.

@Phobus: What "lies and bollocks" are you referring to?

@Graf Zahl: I just want to point out that if randy or yourself would grant us the ability to specify a custom HUD, being able to turn it off would be a standard feature and this would never be a problem again.

[AgentSpork]

I never cried about anything in that post. Perhaps your satire detector is broken? If you bothered to look at the date on it, you'd see that it was written at least 2 months ago.

My apologies then; clearly my "satire" detector was broken. However, my original point directed to Kaiser still stands. Cutman didn't act like a "crybaby" anywhere in his post. Your response combined with Kaiser's seemed overly defensive to the point of resorting to unnecessary insults.

Well I apologize if my post seemed overly defensive, as that was not my intention when I wrote the post.

2) Not exactly a bug but it seems pretty out of place. The hectebus' mass seems to be way too low, along with it's painchance. You can literally juggle them around with the plasma rifle. This happens in Torm's sapphire too.

Well, can't really expect much for my first attempt at a DECORATE monster oh so long ago. I'll tweak it a bit.

[Graf Zahl]

@Graf Zahl: I just want to point out that if randy or yourself would grant us the ability to specify a custom HUD, being able to turn it off would be a standard feature and this would never be a problem again.

Without a good scripting language that's not going to be easy. Creating a decent HUD is not just placing a few items on the screen.

[Cutmanmike]

I prefer the default one anyway.

[Phobus]

@HotWax: The hypothetical ones that Kaiser seems to believe we mods stand for as he suggests we'll delete "the truth".

[chis]

Hi Spork, just giving the beta a brief go (mostly Episode 4, I want to see what I missed in the original Simplicity ... two things I've noticed already:

I play with fast monsters all the time. With your PK3 file loaded, it doesn't quite work properly: monsters move and shoot at the same rate they normally do with -fast used, but the monster projectiles move at the standard speed. Instantly makes things a lot easier. ;P

Also, I play widescreen - the HUD doesn't seem to scale to 16:10 resolutions.

[Nash]

Spork, I guess you should just enclose your entire HUD drawing code with a screenblocks check. For example:

Code: Select all

if ( getcvar("screenblocks") == 11 )
	{
	// .. your existing HUD code
	}
else
	{
	// clear the HUDMessages used by your custom HUD
	}

... so that people will stop complaining about your HUD. Personally, I'd still like to see a HUDDEF lump someday but we all know what happened when that was suggested awhile ago.

I like the new HUD, by the way. I also like the randomized startup screens. Nice touch.

EDIT: There are some "missing skyviewpoint" errors in your TITLEMAP.

[Graf Zahl]

AFAIK he already does something like that.

And there won't be a HUDDEF lump. To create a HUD you need at least some programming, not simple definitions.

[Nash]

Right. That ought to teach me for attempting to post immediately after randomly waking up at 5 in the morning.

Well it looks like all he has to do is put back the regular Doom HUD graphics (I see they are all replaced with black graphics) and remove that warning message.

As for a customizable HUD, yes, I realize programming is needed fro something as complex as a HUD.

[Graf Zahl]

A HUD isn't complex - but you need at least some means to check game conditions to decide what to show.

[Kaiser]

Oh shit!

Kaiser has been infected by the Hobbs virus!

If I was, I'd be acting like an emo.

[HotWax]

A HUD isn't complex - but you need at least some means to check game conditions to decide what to show.

How about something like this:

Code: Select all

HUDDEF:

AddHud "Green Jelly" 667
AddHud "Red Octane" 668
AddHud "Blue Lightning" 669

Code: Select all

MYHUDS:

// Hud definition file
#library "myhuds"
#include "zcommon.acs"

script 667 HUD {
     // Hud drawing code here
}

...etc...

This would remove the need to implement yet another custom scripting language while providing the same power that ACS already gives us to create complex HUDs, and providing a standardized ability for the player to switch between HUDs at will.

It would be the mapper's responsibility to ensure their HUD works properly. This includes being switched away to and from on the fly at any given point by the player.

With the above example, a menu would be added somewhere in ZDoom that would show the user the following options:

Select HUD:

None
Standard
Green Jelly
Red Octane
Blue Lightning

Selecting an option other than Standard would cause the default HUD rendering to be skipped and the appropriate ACS script to be executed instead. I'll leave the means of this execution up to you to decide -- it could either be a one-time execution with the assumption that the mapper will make it loop and selecting another one will terminate the script, or it could be similar to a function (no delays) in which the script is called each time a hud update is needed (presumably every frame). In fact you could as easily make this use functions instead of scripts, which eliminates the risk of using duplicate script numbers.

The point is, existing ACS code would drive the display of the HUD. This saves you from having to design a complicated HUD scripting language but still gives mappers the same power and freedom to create custom HUDs they currently have while providing the player a way to choose between that HUD and the standard one (or none at all).