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Graf Zahl wrote:The post above this is best ignored as it contains some misinformation.

nuts.wad is a perfect demonstration that a large amount of living monsters in a non-freeze mode game state causes a slowdown. And for added scientific basis, nuts even has a really simple BSP.. compared to, say, Vrack, so the renderer certainly is not the problem in nuts.wad.

Hirogen2 wrote:

Graf Zahl wrote:The post above this is best ignored as it contains some misinformation.

nuts.wad is a perfect demonstration that a large amount of living monsters in a non-freeze mode game state causes a slowdown. And for added scientific basis, nuts even has a really simple BSP.. compared to, say, Vrack, so the renderer certainly is not the problem in nuts.wad.

Nuts isn't "standard monster density" however. With regular use, monster count shouldn't be a problem at all.

Hirogen2 wrote:The larger a map, the more actors will be in it (assuming a 'normal' monster "density" in any average-and-above map)

Um. You're assuming that "larger" means more map space. Larger in terms of a number of linedefs, sectors etc can simply mean more detail. Compare any KDiZD map with its original counterpart and you'll get a much "bigger" map (e.g. more detail) but not necessarily much higher of a monster count.

HotWax wrote:Compare any KDiZD map with its original counterpart and you'll get a much "bigger" map (e.g. more detail) but not necessarily much higher of a monster count.

HotWax wrote:Um. You're assuming that "larger" means more map space. Larger in terms of a number of linedefs, sectors etc can simply mean more detail. Compare any KDiZD map with its original counterpart and you'll get a much "bigger" map (e.g. more detail) but not necessarily much higher of a monster count.

Well my point is that not the monster density, but the total number of them that dictate the speed. So if you have more space, you are inclined to also put more monsters in there (to keep the density 'equal' across the map, nonwithstanding specific scenes where more/less are needed), and that would then contribute to a slowdown. If the map is bound by the 65535x65535 rectangle, there is a limit to monsters you can realistically place (also assuming the map is a non-nuts one).

Yeah, on a second read-through of your previous post, it seems you're advocating that people shouldn't make larger maps because they would run slower on your computer. I suppose we should also petition all the game companies to make stuff that will run on your personal hardware too while we're at it.

HotWax wrote:Yeah, on a second read-through of your previous post, it seems you're advocating that people shouldn't make larger maps because they would run slower on your computer. I suppose we should also petition all the game companies to make stuff that will run on your personal hardware too while we're at it.

That's called "looking at required specs before buying".

To be blunt, I am really getting tired of some people whining and complaining that modern software does not run well anymore on their obsolete systems. Come on, guys! Even a €/$200 computer available today is better than the crap you are using!

Indeed. Come on people, it's not that hard. If you can't scrape together a couple hundred bucks, get it on a payment plan. Aren't we supposed to be in some kind of economic crisis because they'll give credit to anyone?

The only people that really have an excuse are kids whose parents won't buy them a new computer -- to which I say, get a paper route!

Work at Wal-Mart. They'll hire anybody, and you get to put up with 2 thousand people screaming at you every day. 10 of which happen to be your bosses.

Instead of whining about hardware, can we talk about the nodebuilder itself?!

(Namely, the fact that it doesn't work right?)

Where's the bug report?

Graf Zahl wrote:Where's the bug report?

In a locked file cabinet in an unlit basement in a disused lavatory labeled "Beware of the Tiger".

Gez wrote:

Graf Zahl wrote:Where's the bug report?

In a locked file cabinet in an unlit basement in a disused lavatory labeled "Beware of the Tiger".

And since MG_Man didn't use the board I've set one up with a redirect.

I could have posted it there, you're right (but this IS the ZDBSP 1.11 topic, I thought it deserved a mention here as well)