Well, my map gets played in the Dump test stream (4) video, and ... man, I need to look at rules more.
MP3's were unallowed? Shot. HOM's? Well, at least it was funny.
Thanks for playing my map! Well, I need to do a lot of work.
DUMP Episode 3: BFG Edition [map + weapons released]
Forum rules
The Projects forums are only for projects. If you are asking questions about a project, either find that project's thread, or start a thread in the General section instead.
Got a cool project idea but nothing else? Put it in the project ideas thread instead!
Projects for any Doom-based engine (especially 3DGE) are perfectly acceptable here too.
Please read the full rules for more details.
The Projects forums are only for projects. If you are asking questions about a project, either find that project's thread, or start a thread in the General section instead.
Got a cool project idea but nothing else? Put it in the project ideas thread instead!
Projects for any Doom-based engine (especially 3DGE) are perfectly acceptable here too.
Please read the full rules for more details.
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Deviluke Roy
- Posts: 405
- Joined: Sat Mar 05, 2016 4:43 pm
- Location: Where's my jokebook?
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InsanityBringer
- Posts: 3392
- Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2007 4:53 pm
- Location: opening the forbidden box
Re: DUMP Episode 3: BFG Edition [Deadline extended to 20th!]
Given that it doesn't appear to have been featured on the stream, just want to verify that the changes for The Mine to Hell made it in.
I imagine it doesn't actually warrant a new playthrough since the changes are so minor, but just making sure they were seen
I imagine it doesn't actually warrant a new playthrough since the changes are so minor, but just making sure they were seen
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LogicalFallacy
- Posts: 89
- Joined: Tue May 24, 2016 8:59 am
Re: DUMP Episode 3: BFG Edition [Deadline extended to 20th!]
Well, here's the HOM-filled version of Deviluke's map if you still want it Term. It... may need some tweaks still, but I'll leave them for you to decide what needs doing. I did remove the music file, so that's all set for you to slot whatever in.
And I'm not being derelict in prettying my own map up! I don't have an updated version ready for download yet, since I'm waiting until I've done a first pass cosmetic lift in every room,but I should have it up in the next few days.
And I'm not being derelict in prettying my own map up! I don't have an updated version ready for download yet, since I'm waiting until I've done a first pass cosmetic lift in every room,but I should have it up in the next few days.
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SoundofDoomDoors
- Posts: 25
- Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2016 5:00 pm
Re: DUMP Episode 3: BFG Edition [Deadline extended to 20th!]
Alright I have updated versions of 11 and 35 here. The latter was right above me. I wish I'd played that the first time! When Deathz0r updates his level I'll get on that. I went back through a few days' worth of comments and didn't see a new version from him.
MAP11 Replay: Venture into the Bouncy Castle (Beed28)
90% Kills/66% Secrets
-Terminus laughing like a hyena on stream when he tested the end of this map's updated version was no coincidence. I had a lot of fun with the bouncing cyberdemon too. He was the highlight of the map. I remember joking with term on stream when he walked up to the final building. He said something like "Like SoundofDoomDoors was saying there's gotta be a cyberdemon in here." I wasn't sold until he opened the door and I saw the megasphere. "Yep cyberdemon," I said in chat. He's telegraphed, but still awesome. The rockets bouncing make it.
-Putting the weapons you need to fight him effectively in a secret is not cool, on the other hand.
-I suggest giving the SSG outside of a secret to make fighting the fairly meaty enemies a little less tedious. It's been a long time since I had to kill archviles with a chaingun. It's pretty boring. I suggest reversing the weapons' positions. Put the chaingun in the secret and the SSG where the chaingun is now.
-Leave the plasma rifle where it is. It was my weapon of choice for the ending, but I had to double back to find it.
-To give players a viable alternative for the final battle other than the secret gun, give a rocket launcher and about 40 rockets in the stock-up room. It's dangerous with all the bouncing and teleport shenanigans, but that's what I like about it. It makes the plasma rifle useful, but not as essential as it is now. I list 40 rockets even though it takes more to kill the cybie because of the suggestion to put the SSG in the open. Players without the plasma rifle can use that to finish him off.
Overall: The impression I get is that you tested the map heavily, but you always got every secret and forgot to account for the possibility that the player wouldn't. There's a really unique map here, it just needs some weapons switched around.
---
MAP35 Replay: Lair of the Sempiternal Archvile
DNF. (did not finish
)
-I still can't get through the second red skull door. Looking at it in doombuilder shows a messed up door lock. You've set the front linedef of the door to "scroll texture left." I think that's why I can't open it.
-Harsh start. I don't think I've seen an opening 30 seconds with this many ways to die in a long time. You must really like turtling gameplay. That's all I can do here.
-There's a closet with two mancubi and a chainsaw. I would reduce it to one so it's easier to bypass them and run backward. Getting to the SSG from that side relies on realizing you have to jump to get on the ledge, so I'd be a little merciful with the monster placement there.
-I would also reduce the chaingunner count in front of the SSG room from 2 to 1 or remove them entirely. The idea behind that is letting the player grab the SSG and make a run for it to take out all the meat in the surrounding areas. There's quite a bit!
...
Okay I checked term's playthrough and he didn't get to the door. I noclipped through it so I could see the rest of the level.
-I found a secret rocket launcher.
-That's the problem. When I actually needed it at the end, all I found were useless stacks of shells and bullets. I'd give a rocket launcher as a non-secret for the finale and switch some of the bullets for rockets. Nobody's going to use a chaingun against groups like that. It doesn't do enough damage per second.
-You could also give a plasma rifle + ammo to go with it if you're dead set on keeping the RL a secret.
MAP11 Replay: Venture into the Bouncy Castle (Beed28)
90% Kills/66% Secrets
-Terminus laughing like a hyena on stream when he tested the end of this map's updated version was no coincidence. I had a lot of fun with the bouncing cyberdemon too. He was the highlight of the map. I remember joking with term on stream when he walked up to the final building. He said something like "Like SoundofDoomDoors was saying there's gotta be a cyberdemon in here." I wasn't sold until he opened the door and I saw the megasphere. "Yep cyberdemon," I said in chat. He's telegraphed, but still awesome. The rockets bouncing make it.
-Putting the weapons you need to fight him effectively in a secret is not cool, on the other hand.
-I suggest giving the SSG outside of a secret to make fighting the fairly meaty enemies a little less tedious. It's been a long time since I had to kill archviles with a chaingun. It's pretty boring. I suggest reversing the weapons' positions. Put the chaingun in the secret and the SSG where the chaingun is now.
-Leave the plasma rifle where it is. It was my weapon of choice for the ending, but I had to double back to find it.
-To give players a viable alternative for the final battle other than the secret gun, give a rocket launcher and about 40 rockets in the stock-up room. It's dangerous with all the bouncing and teleport shenanigans, but that's what I like about it. It makes the plasma rifle useful, but not as essential as it is now. I list 40 rockets even though it takes more to kill the cybie because of the suggestion to put the SSG in the open. Players without the plasma rifle can use that to finish him off.
Overall: The impression I get is that you tested the map heavily, but you always got every secret and forgot to account for the possibility that the player wouldn't. There's a really unique map here, it just needs some weapons switched around.
---
MAP35 Replay: Lair of the Sempiternal Archvile
DNF. (did not finish
)-I still can't get through the second red skull door. Looking at it in doombuilder shows a messed up door lock. You've set the front linedef of the door to "scroll texture left." I think that's why I can't open it.
-Harsh start. I don't think I've seen an opening 30 seconds with this many ways to die in a long time. You must really like turtling gameplay. That's all I can do here.
-There's a closet with two mancubi and a chainsaw. I would reduce it to one so it's easier to bypass them and run backward. Getting to the SSG from that side relies on realizing you have to jump to get on the ledge, so I'd be a little merciful with the monster placement there.
-I would also reduce the chaingunner count in front of the SSG room from 2 to 1 or remove them entirely. The idea behind that is letting the player grab the SSG and make a run for it to take out all the meat in the surrounding areas. There's quite a bit!
...
Okay I checked term's playthrough and he didn't get to the door. I noclipped through it so I could see the rest of the level.
-I found a secret rocket launcher.
-That's the problem. When I actually needed it at the end, all I found were useless stacks of shells and bullets. I'd give a rocket launcher as a non-secret for the finale and switch some of the bullets for rockets. Nobody's going to use a chaingun against groups like that. It doesn't do enough damage per second.
-You could also give a plasma rifle + ammo to go with it if you're dead set on keeping the RL a secret.
Re: DUMP Episode 3: BFG Edition [Deadline extended to 20th!]
Has anyone given any reviews or advice on weapons? Or are we all waiting on the test build first?
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LogicalFallacy
- Posts: 89
- Joined: Tue May 24, 2016 8:59 am
Re: DUMP Episode 3: BFG Edition [Deadline extended to 20th!]
Yell at Yholl. He seems to be taking forever to get everything put together.Zerrer wrote:Has anyone given any reviews or advice on weapons? Or are we all waiting on the test build first?
(Just kidding Yholl, please don't murder me.)
Re: DUMP Episode 3: BFG Edition [Deadline extended to 20th!]
NO DEALLogicalFallacy wrote:Yell at Yholl. He seems to be taking forever to get everything put together.
(Just kidding Yholl, please don't murder me.)
Re: DUMP Episode 3: BFG Edition [Deadline extended to 20th!]
After seeing term play my map, Brown Mesa, I have a few comments and a tiny revision. If anyone wants to watch him play my map for some reason it's here https://youtu.be/9CKAMJDI4No?t=4h30m30s
First, That bottomless instakill pit wasn't designed to be jumped over, there's a switch to raise a bridge in a room right off of it that you didn't go into. Luckily the jump required is pretty skill based and doesn't break anything, it just cuts off having to go to that room. I also never intended for you to be able to jump into the helipad secret like that, you were jumping just barely around the trigger to lower one of the box stacks so you can walk in much more easily.
Secondly, it has no music because by the time I got around to the level of finish where it was time to add music I was thoroughly done, and all of the music I'd think of adding isn't midi.
Also thanks for noticing that really unaligned texture in the round nukage room, I have no idea how I managed to miss that.
Brown Mesa Revision 1
https://a.cocaine.ninja/jsxxjo.zip
- fixed misaligned texture in round nukage room
- increased brightness of door leading to bridge switch so it's harder to miss
First, That bottomless instakill pit wasn't designed to be jumped over, there's a switch to raise a bridge in a room right off of it that you didn't go into. Luckily the jump required is pretty skill based and doesn't break anything, it just cuts off having to go to that room. I also never intended for you to be able to jump into the helipad secret like that, you were jumping just barely around the trigger to lower one of the box stacks so you can walk in much more easily.
Secondly, it has no music because by the time I got around to the level of finish where it was time to add music I was thoroughly done, and all of the music I'd think of adding isn't midi.
Also thanks for noticing that really unaligned texture in the round nukage room, I have no idea how I managed to miss that.
Brown Mesa Revision 1
https://a.cocaine.ninja/jsxxjo.zip
- fixed misaligned texture in round nukage room
- increased brightness of door leading to bridge switch so it's harder to miss
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LogicalFallacy
- Posts: 89
- Joined: Tue May 24, 2016 8:59 am
Re: DUMP Episode 3: BFG Edition [Deadline extended to 20th!]
Alright, there is now an update for my map available here.
Changes are primarily cosmetic, lots of decorations and obstacles strewn about and some extra texturing and lighting work to try and make everything look nicer.
A change was made to one of the secrets.
Some balance tweaks were made to keep things interesting.
Several areas have a sort of designated "boss monster" now that must be killed before progression is possible. If folks really don't like this one it's easy enough to revert.
I'm reasonably certain I didn't horribly break anything in this update, and I actually put together the pk3 correctly, so you shouldn't have any issues shoving it in Term.
Changes are primarily cosmetic, lots of decorations and obstacles strewn about and some extra texturing and lighting work to try and make everything look nicer.
A change was made to one of the secrets.
Some balance tweaks were made to keep things interesting.
Several areas have a sort of designated "boss monster" now that must be killed before progression is possible. If folks really don't like this one it's easy enough to revert.
I'm reasonably certain I didn't horribly break anything in this update, and I actually put together the pk3 correctly, so you shouldn't have any issues shoving it in Term.
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SoundofDoomDoors
- Posts: 25
- Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2016 5:00 pm
Re: DUMP Episode 3: BFG Edition [Deadline extended to 20th!]
I'm now up to MAP43. My current list of maps I need to replay is 30, 38, and 39. I await updated versions from the authors or for terminus to update everything.
---
MAP36: Missing!
---
MAP37: Complex Alive (Roxas)
100% Kills/No Secrets to Get!
-It's a Dead Simple clone. I hate Dead Simple clones.
-The art style is its saving grace. I love the black and white, the slants encouraging the player to jump around, the hallways that fill up with monsters later, it's just great.
Overall: I'd like to see a map that isn't a Dead Simple clone in this art style. You should consider that for DUMP 4.
---
MAP38: DUMP TD (Arctangent)
DNF.
-I'm not getting any credits for my kills. The monster count reached about 700, with me having killed around 200, but my credit count sat at 250.
-Terminus didn't have this problem when he played it, but the fonts were messed up.
-My fonts are fine.
Overall: I'll get back to this. Try testing in GZDoom to see if you can replicate the issue.
---
MAP39: Dumping Ground (Total Injury)
DNF.
-The switch to lower the outdoor area should NOT be one time only. I raised it down in the courtyard without doing something important and seem to have rendered the level unwinnable, on account of not being able to lower it again.
-Health is very tight prior to getting the YK. Consider changing some of the stimpacks to medkits.
-In the dark room just off the area with the blue key there are two pushwalls, one on each side of an area. One door track of each of these pushwalls is a hall of mirrors.
-After raising the floor in the central outdoor area, I found I could fall through fake floors in the middle of the room. I had to noclip to get out.
Overall: I'll get back to this.
---
MAP40: Mercury Rain (Jimmy)
100% Kills/50% Secrets (I got the secret RL!)
-My review is based on v4.
-The lift down into the containment area doesn't move when activated or shot. I noclipped down to finish the level. I also had to noclip back out after I switched off the emergency forcefield. Both issues can be fixed by turning the switch and lift bottom linedefs to face the player. Right now they're pointing in the wrong direction.
-The start is great. I nabbed an SSG before I fired a shot, making it much easier than it would have been otherwise. Rewarding exploration and trigger discipline is a good thing!
-The idea with the forcefields works very well too. I had to fish a little bit for the yellow switch, but I found it in less than a minute.
Overall: Great map, just two easily fixable problems left. I need to play Jenesis.
---
MAP41: Mapsterpiece (Idiotblitz)
I ran away in terror when I recognized it from one of terminus' streams. Is that a did not finish or did not start?
-The following is based on memories from terminus playing this live and a quick look-over. I'm scared to death of this map.
-The opening 15 - 20 seconds are great.
-Platforming is extremely difficult. So is the monster placement and usage of badly damaging hurt floors.
-I just don't have the skill/patience for levels that require you to do near impossible jumps over 10 - 20 damage floors with arachnotrons and cyberdemons shooting at me.
-My only suggestion is to start over. Whoever made this is a damn good player, a sadist (I've been accused of that), or both.
---
MAP42: Dump Numbah Two (stale_meat)
88% Kills/25% Secrets
-I see a lot of vertical texture mis-alignment on this map. Try pressing control-a in GZDoomBuilder to fix some of it. STARTAN doesn't vertically align well, so you might want to get rid of it in places where the editor can't clean it up.
-Non-linear! I like how there are optional areas with useful items in them, such as the area with the backpack. More maps should do this!
-The eastern area seems to have a lot of health compared to the western parts of the map. I would add a lot more on that side. I rarely got above 50 due to getting chased around by hitscanner hordes.
-I would put the SSG outside of a secret here. Mancubus, hell knight, and revenant groups are best fought with it if you run out of rockets like I did.
Overall: Tastes like TNT with all the hitscanners.
---
MAP43: Cloverhouse (Icept)
100% Kills/100% Secrets
-I would mark the plasma rifle as a secret. It uses a similar method as another secret in the same room, so I think it's consistent to count them both as such.
-Secrets within secrets are great.
-Infighting kind of defangs the last big fight outdoors. I just sat back and watched until it was down to about ten goats. Then they ate rockets. I don't know what I'd do to improve it right now.
Overall: I had fun.
---
MAP36: Missing!
---
MAP37: Complex Alive (Roxas)
100% Kills/No Secrets to Get!
-It's a Dead Simple clone. I hate Dead Simple clones.
-The art style is its saving grace. I love the black and white, the slants encouraging the player to jump around, the hallways that fill up with monsters later, it's just great.
Overall: I'd like to see a map that isn't a Dead Simple clone in this art style. You should consider that for DUMP 4.
---
MAP38: DUMP TD (Arctangent)
DNF.
-I'm not getting any credits for my kills. The monster count reached about 700, with me having killed around 200, but my credit count sat at 250.
-Terminus didn't have this problem when he played it, but the fonts were messed up.
-My fonts are fine.
Overall: I'll get back to this. Try testing in GZDoom to see if you can replicate the issue.
---
MAP39: Dumping Ground (Total Injury)
DNF.
-The switch to lower the outdoor area should NOT be one time only. I raised it down in the courtyard without doing something important and seem to have rendered the level unwinnable, on account of not being able to lower it again.
-Health is very tight prior to getting the YK. Consider changing some of the stimpacks to medkits.
-In the dark room just off the area with the blue key there are two pushwalls, one on each side of an area. One door track of each of these pushwalls is a hall of mirrors.
-After raising the floor in the central outdoor area, I found I could fall through fake floors in the middle of the room. I had to noclip to get out.
Overall: I'll get back to this.
---
MAP40: Mercury Rain (Jimmy)
100% Kills/50% Secrets (I got the secret RL!)
-My review is based on v4.
-The lift down into the containment area doesn't move when activated or shot. I noclipped down to finish the level. I also had to noclip back out after I switched off the emergency forcefield. Both issues can be fixed by turning the switch and lift bottom linedefs to face the player. Right now they're pointing in the wrong direction.
-The start is great. I nabbed an SSG before I fired a shot, making it much easier than it would have been otherwise. Rewarding exploration and trigger discipline is a good thing!
-The idea with the forcefields works very well too. I had to fish a little bit for the yellow switch, but I found it in less than a minute.
Overall: Great map, just two easily fixable problems left. I need to play Jenesis.
---
MAP41: Mapsterpiece (Idiotblitz)
I ran away in terror when I recognized it from one of terminus' streams. Is that a did not finish or did not start?
-The following is based on memories from terminus playing this live and a quick look-over. I'm scared to death of this map.
-The opening 15 - 20 seconds are great.
-Platforming is extremely difficult. So is the monster placement and usage of badly damaging hurt floors.
-I just don't have the skill/patience for levels that require you to do near impossible jumps over 10 - 20 damage floors with arachnotrons and cyberdemons shooting at me.
-My only suggestion is to start over. Whoever made this is a damn good player, a sadist (I've been accused of that), or both.
---
MAP42: Dump Numbah Two (stale_meat)
88% Kills/25% Secrets
-I see a lot of vertical texture mis-alignment on this map. Try pressing control-a in GZDoomBuilder to fix some of it. STARTAN doesn't vertically align well, so you might want to get rid of it in places where the editor can't clean it up.
-Non-linear! I like how there are optional areas with useful items in them, such as the area with the backpack. More maps should do this!
-The eastern area seems to have a lot of health compared to the western parts of the map. I would add a lot more on that side. I rarely got above 50 due to getting chased around by hitscanner hordes.
-I would put the SSG outside of a secret here. Mancubus, hell knight, and revenant groups are best fought with it if you run out of rockets like I did.
Overall: Tastes like TNT with all the hitscanners.
---
MAP43: Cloverhouse (Icept)
100% Kills/100% Secrets
-I would mark the plasma rifle as a secret. It uses a similar method as another secret in the same room, so I think it's consistent to count them both as such.
-Secrets within secrets are great.
-Infighting kind of defangs the last big fight outdoors. I just sat back and watched until it was down to about ten goats. Then they ate rockets. I don't know what I'd do to improve it right now.
Overall: I had fun.
Re: DUMP Episode 3: BFG Edition [Deadline extended to 20th!]
SoundofDoomDoors, I can tell you the lines for the elevator are all facing the correct way. You probably had your compatibility options set to "Doom (strict)" or somesuch which makes special linedefs block use, because in that instance the elevator becomes unusable from the top, and partially so from the bottom, due to the arrangement of the activating lines.
Don't get me wrong, I'm a stickler for compatibility, but being that this is a ZDoom map, I don't think that accounting for compatibility options is a priority fix. I can make the lift a walkover special from the top, though, and that will neatly address the issue.
Don't get me wrong, I'm a stickler for compatibility, but being that this is a ZDoom map, I don't think that accounting for compatibility options is a priority fix. I can make the lift a walkover special from the top, though, and that will neatly address the issue.
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Arctangent
- Posts: 1235
- Joined: Thu Nov 06, 2014 1:53 pm
- Contact:
Re: DUMP Episode 3: BFG Edition [Deadline extended to 20th!]
Wouldn't surprise me if that's also the issue with my map and not giving credits.Jimmy wrote:You probably had your compatibility options set to "Doom (strict)" or somesuch
Re: DUMP Episode 3: BFG Edition [Deadline extended to 20th!]
Updated my map again.
https://www.sendspace.com/file/5zfmtb
Changes:
- Took SoundofDoomDoors' advice and rearranged the weapons. The Chaingun is now secret while the Super Shotgun is given in the blue key room. Added a Rocket Launcher just before the Cyberdemon so you can use that to weaken him if you didn't pick up the secret Plasma Rifle.
- Added some torches to the dark maze. Also swapped out a few Hell Knights for groups of Imps, and added a small surprise for when you're heading back.
- Added a pillar in the passageway behind the blue door to help with dealing with the Arch-vile on the way back.
- Some small visual touchups to the bathrooms. Also, the three health bonuses there now heals 28 health each.
Also, Term, can you please append the word "bouncy" to the quote? So it displays as "Just remember to take your boots off before stepping onto the bouncy castle!". It's weird to see it as just "castle" now, thinking about it.
https://www.sendspace.com/file/5zfmtb
Changes:
- Took SoundofDoomDoors' advice and rearranged the weapons. The Chaingun is now secret while the Super Shotgun is given in the blue key room. Added a Rocket Launcher just before the Cyberdemon so you can use that to weaken him if you didn't pick up the secret Plasma Rifle.
- Added some torches to the dark maze. Also swapped out a few Hell Knights for groups of Imps, and added a small surprise for when you're heading back.
- Added a pillar in the passageway behind the blue door to help with dealing with the Arch-vile on the way back.
- Some small visual touchups to the bathrooms. Also, the three health bonuses there now heals 28 health each.
Also, Term, can you please append the word "bouncy" to the quote? So it displays as "Just remember to take your boots off before stepping onto the bouncy castle!". It's weird to see it as just "castle" now, thinking about it.
Re: DUMP Episode 3: BFG Edition [Deadline extended to 20th!]
Or explicitly turn off the offending setting in MAPINFO.Jimmy wrote:Don't get me wrong, I'm a stickler for compatibility, but being that this is a ZDoom map, I don't think that accounting for compatibility options is a priority fix. I can make the lift a walkover special from the top, though, and that will neatly address the issue.
Re: DUMP Episode 3: BFG Edition [Deadline extended to 20th!]
THE GUNS APPROACH
at some point soon, because I finished compiling them all together
I've looked at all of them
SO I'M AWARE OF WHICH OF YOU HAVE COMMITTED CRIMES
TERRIBLE CRIMES
MAKING ME ANGRY
YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE
anyway, almost all the guns are pretty good, which is really nice. Good job everyone who submitted a gun! I'm glad to see such a combined effort take shape like this.
Amusingly for a project like this, there was only one set of two weapons that did more or less the same thing, and that's my Shotgun replacement and SMG_Marine's Chaingun replacement, hahahaha. Of course, there are major differences, but their functions were the same, heh.
YHOLL OUT, MAGGOTS
at some point soon, because I finished compiling them all together
I've looked at all of them
SO I'M AWARE OF WHICH OF YOU HAVE COMMITTED CRIMES
TERRIBLE CRIMES
MAKING ME ANGRY
YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE
anyway, almost all the guns are pretty good, which is really nice. Good job everyone who submitted a gun! I'm glad to see such a combined effort take shape like this.
Amusingly for a project like this, there was only one set of two weapons that did more or less the same thing, and that's my Shotgun replacement and SMG_Marine's Chaingun replacement, hahahaha. Of course, there are major differences, but their functions were the same, heh.
YHOLL OUT, MAGGOTS