Monster replacements like complex doom?

[invictius]

I really like the monsters in complex doom, but I also want to use the doomRL arsenal weapons, they just won't load together. Atm I'm running beautiful doom's objects only. Is there anything like complex doom, maybe even with a separate wad for map objects, weapons and monsters?

[Cryomundus]

I really like the monsters in complex doom, but I also want to use the doomRL arsenal weapons, they just won't load together. Atm I'm running beautiful doom's objects only. Is there anything like complex doom, maybe even with a separate wad for map objects, weapons and monsters?

Really it's just a simple matter of stripping complex of all the playerclasses, weapons, huds, and pickups, and leaving only the monsters and their respective randomspawners. Just make sure the decorate file that has all of the #include only contains the monster random spawners, and nothing else.

[invictius]

I really like the monsters in complex doom, but I also want to use the doomRL arsenal weapons, they just won't load together. Atm I'm running beautiful doom's objects only. Is there anything like complex doom, maybe even with a separate wad for map objects, weapons and monsters?

Really it's just a simple matter of stripping complex of all the playerclasses, weapons, huds, and pickups, and leaving only the monsters and their respective randomspawners. Just make sure the decorate file that has all of the #include only contains the monster random spawners, and nothing else.

No monsters.dec, just the spawners?

[Cryomundus]

I really like the monsters in complex doom, but I also want to use the doomRL arsenal weapons, they just won't load together. Atm I'm running beautiful doom's objects only. Is there anything like complex doom, maybe even with a separate wad for map objects, weapons and monsters?

Really it's just a simple matter of stripping complex of all the playerclasses, weapons, huds, and pickups, and leaving only the monsters and their respective randomspawners. Just make sure the decorate file that has all of the #include only contains the monster random spawners, and nothing else.

No monsters.dec, just the spawners?

You'd need to leave that in, otherwise the randomspawners would probably crash the game trying to spawn something that doesn't exist.

If it didn't crash zdoom, than you'd either A) have the vanilla DOOM cast, or B) nothing at all. So yeah, kinda important you leave monsters.dec in.

[invictius]

Really it's just a simple matter of stripping complex of all the playerclasses, weapons, huds, and pickups, and leaving only the monsters and their respective randomspawners. Just make sure the decorate file that has all of the #include only contains the monster random spawners, and nothing else.

[/quote]

I'm getting errors like this:

Code: Select all

Script error, "c no weap.pk3:monsters.dec" line 10965:
Parent type 'Red10KEx' not found in CardinalRed10KEx

With this: https://www.sendspace.com/file/8gkmym

[Cryomundus]

Really it's just a simple matter of stripping complex of all the playerclasses, weapons, huds, and pickups, and leaving only the monsters and their respective randomspawners. Just make sure the decorate file that has all of the #include only contains the monster random spawners, and nothing else.

I'm getting errors like this:

Code: Select all

Script error, "c no weap.pk3:monsters.dec" line 10965:
Parent type 'Red10KEx' not found in CardinalRed10KEx

With this: https://www.sendspace.com/file/8gkmym

Oh man, the author seriously referenced the player's most powerful weapon for the boss? Oh good lord that is just awful design. I've seen this done a few times and it's just "oh god why would you want to do this".

Ahem.

What likely needs to be done is either A) comment out/remove the portion of the state that utilizes that reference, or B) Add the portion of the Red10KEx to the Cardinal itself, and make sure that it refers to that instead. There isn't really an easy why to explain this, but honestly, I'd just flat out remove the cardinal entirely, he's the definition of bad boss design. Cheap shots abound, tends to insta-kill AND makes himself invulnerable.

[Virtue]

Really it's just a simple matter of stripping complex of all the playerclasses, weapons, huds, and pickups, and leaving only the monsters and their respective randomspawners. Just make sure the decorate file that has all of the #include only contains the monster random spawners, and nothing else.

I'm getting errors like this:

Code: Select all

Script error, "c no weap.pk3:monsters.dec" line 10965:
Parent type 'Red10KEx' not found in CardinalRed10KEx

With this: https://www.sendspace.com/file/8gkmym

Oh man, the author seriously referenced the player's most powerful weapon for the boss? Oh good lord that is just awful design. I've seen this done a few times and it's just "oh god why would you want to do this".

Ahem.

What likely needs to be done is either A) comment out/remove the portion of the state that utilizes that reference, or B) Add the portion of the Red10KEx to the Cardinal itself, and make sure that it refers to that instead. There isn't really an easy why to explain this, but honestly, I'd just flat out remove the cardinal entirely, he's the definition of bad boss design. Cheap shots abound, tends to insta-kill AND makes himself invulnerable.

have you never played complex doom?

The Cardinal is very rare and is definitely beatable. he doesnt -just- use the 10k, plus your arsenal is considerably beefed up to boot.

please play the mod before making such accusations.

[Cryomundus]

have you never played complex doom?

The Cardinal is very rare and is definitely beatable. he doesnt -just- use the 10k, plus your arsenal is considerably beefed up to boot.

please play the mod before making such accusations.

Actually, yes, I have in fact played complex doom. Been playing it since before grenades were added and the railgun sprites were still using BD's railgun sprite, complete with scope that'll never ever see any use. Heck, I still remember the INFURIATINGLY CHEAP Black Archvile that could resurrect en masse. Cheap little shit he was. Now THAT bastard was the textbook definition of bad monster design. Sturdy enemy, strong attacks, and super OP move that let him resurrect walls of meat with ease. Say goodbye to your ammo stash.

But he's no longer around, and I'm not here to talk about him.

For starters, the Cardinal has a Thamuz-like attack, which he sits still and calls down explosive meteors. Now, you'd think "Aw ye I can kill this bastard," but no, he's actually INVINCIBLE during that attack, and there is jack all you can do to stop it.

Now, the Devastator attack he has. Well, when it hits, it explodes for about... 800 damage. Not only that, but even if you dodge it, it has about 30 or so tracers to it as well. So if you're out in the open, well, might as well just restart the map and hope he doesn't spawn. You really don't stand a chance at all. On top of those 2, he also has regular rockets AND homing rockets, not to mention he can fly.

Really, he's just an awful boss. The only redeeming factor is that if you manage to kill it, it'll always drop the DemonTech 10k.

Really, monsters where never really intended to have BFG style attacks, it's more of a player-ONLY weapon.

Edit: Oh man you really think the arsenal is "beefed up?" Please, it hardly compensates at ALL for the monster difficulty. The only way you stand a chance at all is if you get some of the dropped extra weapons. Your shotgun is hardly any different than the regular one, especially that it has a 9 clip limit too. Double barrel is still reasonable, but only just. The assualt rifle is absolutely pitiful with the clip it has, and your rockets are SLOWER than vanilla's. Plasma is arguably worse with the vanilla one with the clip. The BFG is still pretty good, its kinda hard to ruin that weapon.

Oh, and your punch? It's now either a punch or a much stronger kick, and is chosen at random. How utterly useless. Can't even try and time an attack with it since the punch is faster and the kick is slower, and you NEVER KNOW WHICH IS COMING.

Quite trying to stick Complex Doom on a pedestal, it's a decent idea with awful implementation.

[Virtue]

hmm, I see a few of your points. I was refering to the extra weapons though, the grenade launcher is handy, the demontech rifle is powerful (good for taking out cybers), the autoshotgun is awesome as is the quad shotgun, and the extra BFGs certainly help.

and that black vile does still exist :/ I hate them too, Dark Hellion's I think theyre called and they can resurrect from a distance still.

Yes, out in the open the cardinal is nigh unbeatable but even with a little cover hes certainly beatable, the rockets can be dodged, the Dtech 10k is slow and the tracers have a short range, the worst is the normal 10k shots which can 1-shot you.

Also, the assualt rifle is great for sniping, just set up a zoom macro to a key and short control bursts, you can pick off enemies at the other side of the map. Thats what ive done anyway.