[The Original] Conan the Barbarian (Crappy preview released)

[ThomsonI]

I was thinking akin to Dungeon Master, but kinda. They'll be presented with three or four different symbols (each set different in each stage), tied to primary and secondary attack, reload, and zoom. The player has to get the right combinations to cast a spell. There'll be spell books that the player can consult for info on different codes.

[SallazarSpellcaster]

Ah, fair enough. Though as far as I recall, on Dungeon Master you selected the runes with the cursor, on this game I refer to, you choose them with your numeric pad. Essentially it's the same. Though, however, perhaps it may be convenient to have a "quick cast" option or button, instead of having to reselect every single rune, as it might become rather difficult due to the slow recast speed, and that may make tight fights a problem.

[ThomsonI]

I was going to have different methods of spellcasting (Akiro would have yantras, mantras, and maybe mudras) take up different weapon slots, and each slot could hold a spell up to the last symbol/syllable/gesture, but I'm seeing enough combinations in just the yantras (which will be Alchemy for Kalanthes) that I may just use that.

Since I'm also planning to ultimately have each character limited to 4-ish weapon slots, this would also allow me to dedicate the other slots to spellcasting, and I could make choosing which type of spell the first choice (or drop everything but the yantras and alchemy system). So a player could, during the peaceful time he would normally reload all his guns and hunt for medkits, sit there and prepare 5-ish spells up to the last element, and then blast off the only final elements when they're needed (like wizards in D&D).

EDIT: Oh, I thought I should also mention that some of the spells will unlock special attacks for a while. If a player casts a lightning spell, they don't just throw a lightning bolt and have to redo every part of the chant again. Instead, they gain access to a lightning attack for a half minute or so, with the primary, secondary, reload, and zoom doing a bolt, ball, stream, or burst; for example.

[SallazarSpellcaster]

That sounds good, particularly, to me, the DnD like system, it sounds like that one would make combat very tactical and relying on preparation rather than guns blazing. Plus, for the spellcasters, there's a pack somewhere that has Hexen's mage's hands doing a myriad of magic gestures, those might work as a resource. I'll pledge my allegiance to you eternally and acknowledge you as my liegelord, if you include a DnD Magic Missile, Fireball and Chain Lightning spells lol.

But indeed, spellcasting that way does sound like it'll be amusing, same with the special attacks.

[ThomsonI]

Fire ball - already planned to be a function of the fire spell.

Chain lightning - I'm not sure how to quite incorporate chain lightning without causing infighting, unless some feature was added to make projectiles blink between being solid and not (so half hit the first target, then half the target behind that one). I will have a lightning stream, though, that one could fan by turning back and forth to imitate chain lightning.

Magic missile - wasn't planning on it since it's a bit out of place in Conan, but there were some not-so-low magic Conan modules by TSR, so why not, I wasn't quite happy with the current spell roster. Rolled Summon Skeleton and Summon Zombie together (now %50 chance of either), and added Magic Missile.

[SallazarSpellcaster]

Awesome, those spells are pretty much archetypal, I'm honestly surprised no one has tried to implement them. What is the difference between a summoned skeleton and a zombie, strengthwise? I mean, are they akin, or does one have an advantage over the other?

[ThomsonI]

There'd at least be a difference in deathmatch. Skeletons get more resistance against cutting weapons and less resistance against blunt weapons than zombies. Zombies have a bit better damage, but skeletons have a chance of being archers.

EDIT: I was initially trying to avoid imitating D&D, because that's what I try to do when writing rules for RPGs, but now that I'm trying to avoid imitating Hexen and Heretic, D&D's actually not the worst thing to aim for. I guess I'm not quite going full D&D, however, since the symbols and phrases the casters will use will be more or less derived from historical magical beliefs (simplified and made generic just enough to fit into a Doom Conan mod). Akiro's symbols for his yantras are derived from figures on Taoist amulets, and his mantras will use words actually used in mantras (not in the right order, and with no repetition, but eh). I've already figured out how Kalanthes would use the exact same coding, just different graphics and names (but same meaning) for each keypress.

[TheMightyHeracross]

Sallazar, are you going to have a 50-something page long conversation with Thompson like you did with acidhoez?

[SallazarSpellcaster]

Sallazar, are you going to have a 50-something page long conversation with Thompson like you did with acidhoez?

If the situation merits so, perhaps. Hopefully with a side of wit and charm, a few obscure references inbetwixt, and politeness worthy of the Immortal Bard. When... not calling ladies pox ridden wenches of course.

And regarding zombies and skeletons, I see, classic RPG differentiation. Personally, I don't find D&D a "bad" thing to take inspiration and cues from; I mean, after all, it is a classic RPG, so lots of the things that have been used in it might work. As for the use of symbols coming from actual ones, that is a pretty neat idea and, I believe, might add a welcome dash of reality to this mod. Do you intend to have a more straightforward spellcaster, similar to DnD 3.5's Sorcerers? Pardon my lack of knowledge on Conan's adventures, alas, I haven't taken the time to read them yet, so I'm not aware of the types of spellcasters found within.

[ThomsonI]

There are a few characters in Conan that would classify as sorcerers in 3e/3.5, but they'd also automatically be half-fiend, half-abomination, yuan-ti, or something else generally nasty and bad. I may have a couple of gun wands and staves that can be fired used and reloaded recharged, ala Heretic (but I really want to avoid having many of those, and don't want anyone other than Kalanthes to start with one). It may also be a good idea to give each caster a hail Mary signature move, maybe an existing spell that they don't have to prepare to cast.

Howard grognards would be offended that I'd include any spellcasters other than Kalanthes and maybe Pelias, and then offended that he'd have any direct combat power except against spirits and certain monsterous critters. I'm also mixing in the movies, and starting to approach the territory. The original stories, casters are at best grey hats. Even "good" ones have tried to kill Conan just to make sure that he was going to be able to protect them, or openly admitted they were into stuff Aleister Crowley wouldn't touch, and then mainly helped him kill the bad guy to help them escape from prison or avoid execution. Perhaps the only exception is Kalanthes, priest of Ibis (who is someone you'd like to hang out with as much as Morgan Freeman), but there's still plenty of hints that Kalanthes knows just as much evil magic as as "good" magic, and merely finds it more useful to be "good" than "evil."

[SallazarSpellcaster]

I see, fair enough; though it might be worth it to have them as well, as the Evil Protagonists or Sociopath Heroes. Wand and staves would be cool, and it could not be only signature moves, but perhaps also character-specific traits. Perhaps an extra spell slot, health regeneration, more speed, things such as those to further difference their play styles.

[ThomsonI]

I'm definitely including Akiro (who was in the movies as a good wizard), and want to include Kalanthes (just need to work out the graphics, but I already know what the symbols will be for his spells). Pelias and Hadrathus would also be good to include, with Pelias using Goetia inspired sigils for the material spells and sharing Kalanthes Enochian-inspired verbal spells, and Hadrathus sharing Kalanthes Alchemy and Akiro's Mantras. They're all human enough to include without upsetting gameplay.

I guess a good way to sum it up in D&D terms is, if a caster isn't part of the party and isn't a druid/wizard or cleric/wizard (and then only clerics of Mitra, Asura, or Ibis), it's totally reasonable for anyone in the party to gank them, burn the corpse (do not loot it!) and move on with no moral conflict whatsoever. ...And sometimes even if the caster is a member of the party once the adventure is over.

Akiro would probably have telekinesis or stun as his signature move, since he uses each in the second movie in a psychic duel (probably stun). Healing or exorcism would be most appropriate for Kalanthes as his signature move. Pelias would certainly have summon zombie/skeleton as his signature move (or maybe a slightly restricted variation that only works on a single corpse instead of just calling the undead out of nowhere), since he manages to bring a guard back from the dead in his prison cell with no effort. I'm tempted to have Hadrathus have the ability to animate statues, but that'd make cross-game play and custom maps a bit troublesome.

[Crudux Cruo]

I like the way you're approaching it, especially the spellcasting system, and I think its great you're focusing on conan and the thief first! keep up the good work man!

[SallazarSpellcaster]

Everything that was said

Yes, indeed, all that does sound quite awesome, and like it will be really mighty fun to play with.

[ThomsonI]

Yes, Conan and Subotai are still going to be coded and finished first (Subotai basically a faster but weaker Conan with different equipment), then Malak (just need to do lockpicks, then make him a faster but weaker Subotai). Mainly just plotting what I need to code for the casters, not actually coding for them yet. Akiro will definitely be the first caster coded (since all the first characters are from the movies). Pelias, Hadrathus, and Kalanthes would pretty much be color-shifted reskins of Akiro with some slight differences in abilities (Kalanthes and probably Hadrathus being able to use blunt weapons, for one), signature moves, and starting spellbooks. Once Akiro is finished, it'll be no trouble to crank them out as well (so there'll probably just be a giant caster update).

I did find some graphics that would be a perfect player skin for Red Sonja (the "Magyar" from one of the Might & Magic games), but don't have feminine arms for the weapon sprites. Her coding would be similar to Subotai's, so if anyone can provide me with enough feminine arms to feminize the arms found in the resource thread (everything except the Atlantean sword and Stygian sword), I could include her (and maybe Valeria) pretty quickly.

(Also, looking into it, Hadrathus was a master of illusion magic, probably going to make invisibility his signature move).