Hideous Destructor 4.10.0b

[ChronoSeth]

Who needs an auto shotgun? ;p

People who don't have the stamina to pump the gun over and over and over again?

[Greenmarine]

If you don't have that kind of stamina, then you certainly aren't going to make it very far as a soldier let me tell you.

[DoomRater]

The military did make em too, yano. And it has only slightly above that firerate. It 's slow enough that a single squeeze is enough to reliably fire a single shot, slow enough that the recoil doesn't mess with your aim, all that. FPS Russia demonstrated it's ease of use firing it with one hand on the grip.

[Greenmarine]

Talking about the AA-12? Popular among Call of Duty players and...nobody else. With that said, I'm not sure how anyone can watch FPS Russia and not get extremely offended at his fake accent and stereotypical characterization...

Anyway, that video was supposed to be humourous more than informative - but it should be clear that lots of military and police outfits prefer the pump/semi-auto configuration over the semi-auto or full-auto models for some pretty good reasons.

We shouldn't be thinking too hard about the weapon choices Id Software made for Doom though - I guarantee that they put almost exactly zero thought into any canon reasons why you might find those guns in the game.

[DoomRater]

I'm really not sure what those reasons would be.

[Matt]

I mentioned flexibility in which loads to use in the last page, and linked to a page that mentioned the much lower maintenance/longer durability advantage of a manual action. Also the shell doesn't always fly out immediately after you shoot, for what that might be worth in space (cf. my previous comment re: caseless ammo). Also you might not want to have a round in the chamber after every shot before the last, though that's kind of irrelevant in a shooter game.

Don't know about any other reasons off the top of my head though.

I guarantee that they put almost exactly zero thought into any canon reasons why you might find those guns in the game.

No reason for us not to!

[DoomRater]

Heh... in a shooter game it'd seem to make more sense to use a magazine base for loadouts, since you don't need to worry about that pesky inventory so much or weight limits. The RL objections seem more reasonable.

[-Ghost-]

Maybe jamming? Don't auto-shotguns like the AA12, etc jam sometimes at high rates of fire? The shells are pretty big

[Greenmarine]

No, they don't tend to jam.

The main issues with the AA12 and the reason why it's not been adopted anywhere yet is because it's extremely expensive, large, maintenance is difficult, it goes through ammo like water and it doesn't yet do anything that other more practical weapons don't already do. Always remember that your weapon is produced by the lowest bidder.

It's a gun that got good advertising (tv, youtube, films) much like the Desert Eagle - another large, impractical weapon that isn't fielded anywhere. It's just another firearm that nerds get hard over.

Shotguns aren't typically used for much more than breaching doorways in a military setting (in which case you want a gun that's very small and light), or in special forces units designed to engage enemy forces at very close range - they're much more widely used by police agencies worldwide, the reasons for this being the aforementioned versatility, reliability and ease of maintenance.

[DoomRater]

Sounds like a specialty weapon that's at least more reliable than the predecessors! You almost make it sound as practical as the nuclear artillery shell though.

[Matt]

An AA12 with two spare drums would be 2 shells more than the total you can carry right now with the pump and SSG (24 in side saddles, 24 in pockets, 10 in guns themselves=58; 3 drums=60).

Someone who doesn't have very good fire discipline would probably go through those 60 in a quarter of the time to the same overall practical effect. (nb: this is from personal experience in Killing Floor - I tend to use the basic pump shotgun well into the late game and frequently die ammoless and naked and crying ineptly trying to headaxe fleshpounds if I attempt to use the AA12 without significant backup)

That said, having 20 shots before any reloading would be a pretty huge advantage in a lot of Doom-style firefights! And having 2 mags plus gun would mean I could be arsed to track each mag separately... but the thing still looks bulky as hell and should be at least as encumbering as the rocket launcher which kinda kills the biggest advantage of running around with a shotgun, and also means you'll have to be really accurate with every shot just to defend yourself (so turn off the fullauto and treat it like the rifle with actual stopping power) while against bigger baddies you're wasting ammo trying to punch through their damage resistance. In any event, merely adding the AA12 and no spare mags would increase your shell capacity by a metric caketonne so it's definitely not in the works anytime soon.

tl;dr it's the spork cousin of the current pump SG and the Vulcanette which niche is already filled by the rifle

Still kinda wishing I could create some kind of mouse inertia/lag effect to simulate a bulkier, harder-to-maneuver weapon...

[DoomRater]

Nah, not saying AA-12 should be added to anything honestly. Especially not HD.

[HexaDoken]

Let's keep in mind that pump action shotguns may have advantages over automatic shotguns NOW, but 133 years is a considerable time for improvements. I don't really think that in distant future there would be pump-action/manual reload shotguns. Heck, I wouldn't be surprised even if I'd see a minigun type weapon which fired goddamn shotgun shells. At the rate of ~6000 rpm.

Also, nah, HD is fine without a aa-12. The way you picture it I think I'd be only using it when I would need a vulcanette but don't have bullet ammo.

[Matt]

The only way I can see that happening is if they make gun parts out of something that's just as strong as steel but doesn't rust or expand or contract because of temperatures, and can be made so smooth and slippery that machine parts made from them can be moved by too little gas going into the pipe just as well as enough or too much... and heck, the Colt 1911's been around for over 100 years and people still like revolvers, so I'm not holding my breath.

(Anyway yes there will be an update this Monday, this tangent is not an elaborate plan to distract everyone)

[Matt]

I'll post this update a bit earlier just to get it in on time.

• Bugfix: Rocketeer was still shooting from height 32.
• All slow monster projectile trails now emit sounds.
• Foreclosed on the possibility that the cyberdemon's and arachnotron's missiles could be launched even after its attack sequence was aborted.
• Turned off the blood.
• Zombiemen and shotgun guys now fire from the shoulder.
• Happy Thanksgiving!