(Ask) SNES Doom wads/mod that compatible for ZDoom?

[DaMan]

While the 21MHZ SuperFX2 should be about equal to a 486 25MHZ MIPS wise you still only have 128K RAM+64K SRAM (there's no saving) of RAM to work with. Still impressive to fit the (mostly) not edited down levels into that.

[scalliano]

And, like I said, it's still smoother than ports for some of the more powerful systems of the time. Do I need to mention the 3DO? And lest we forget the 32X version, which not only had all of the same gameplay nerfs that the SNES version had, but fewer levels to boot, despite being a more powerful system, and that's even taking the FX2 chip into account.

My single biggest issue with the SNES version was the inability to circlestrafe, despite having independent strafe buttons. That just made NO sense.

[Sodaholic]

Still impressive to fit the (mostly) not edited down levels into that.

Chances are that they're using a stripped down version of the level format since they needed to conserve RAM/needed less information (no floor textures). Don't quote me on this, but I would guess that texture names were probably just an 8-bit integer or something instead of text, along with similar stuff done to other areas of the level format.

And about the other ports that you could compare it to, bear in mind that those other ports didn't have the help of anything like a SuperFX chip to render anything for them, meaning they had to come up with something themselves. Also keep in mind that they did horrendous jobs porting the game to other platforms as well. I will admit, SNES Doom (non-rendering wise) isn't as bad as I'm making it out to be, but it was still a mediocre job of imitating Doom's mechanics (still, they did a better job than the other ports).

My point being, platform has nothing to do with it, it depends on the degree of how bad the developers screw things up. SNES Doom's team just screwed up a little less than the other porting teams, that's all. And they were already ahead of the game with rendering already being taken care of for them; they didn't have to do anything, whereas the other teams had no such head start. If it hadn't been for the SuperFX chip, the SNES version would've probably been one of the worst ones.

[Kinsie]

Crediting the hard work of squeezing Doom onto a system that struggled with Wolfenstein 3D to a mere math co-processor is kind of an insult to the impressive display of programming on display, yo.

EDIT: To elaborate: Porting the Doom engine over to SNES is literally impossible - the processor is just too slow to hack it. The Super FX chip, while very useful for improving the SNES's visual processing abilities, is not a wonder-chip and certainly doesn't challenge the average 486 CPU. People like the SNES port not because it's on-par technologically with the PC version - because it clearly isn't - but because it's a very impressive feat of programming that squeezed in more content in some cases than ports to other, more powerful systems like the Jaguar.

[DaMan]

Its better than those more powerful systems probably because they had more time. 3DO was done in 10 weeks, John himself said the Jag port could've been better and Sega rushed the 32x port for Xmas.
A 486 25 does 20MIPS and while I couldn't find any numbers for the FX chip itself similiar processors like the 32x and SVP do the same. For simple 3D rendering they shouldn't be to far apart.

[scalliano]

Ah, the SVP. 16 colours (not 64) of silky smooth goodness. No texture-mapping/sprite manipulation, though, unlike the FX chips, although it is slightly faster than the FX2 (I own VR, the only game that used it). Also, that article must be quite old as Kega Fusion now emulates it, and has done for about a year.

The 32X has the same (albeit slightly slower) dual SH2 chips as the Saturn, making it twice as powerful as either the SVP or FX2, so there really was no excuse for screwing up Doom as badly as they did. However, while the 32X and 3DO ports were indeed rush jobs, the Saturn port was over a year late, by which point the Playstation had got a version of Final Doom, yet the Saturn port, well see for yourself. Incidentally, that video is a lot smoother than the version I have (PAL, obviously), but still pretty choppy.

[BlueFireZ88]

I own the 32X version, and after playing it a bit, I've come down to three major issues.

1.The music, the common complaint. Obviously it's not that good compared to other versions, but it's not that bad either. I kinda like some of the song renditions from this versions (like E1M3, Dark Halls).

2.Enemies only face forward (but this is common of both 32X and SNES versions).

3.Lack of levels, clearly the biggest issue. Though I've seen ROM hacks that attempt to add the missing levels from Inferno, so it's not like there isn't a way to play them.

If I had to choose between the two 16-bit ports of Doom, I'd go for the 32X version, cause even though it's missing levels, gameplay wise, it's superior to it's SNES counterpart.

That's just my opinion though.

[scalliano]

I owned the 32X version too, but I got rid of it when the console gave up the ghost after little more than a year. It definitely has better gameplay than the SNES version, helped along by the fact that it actually uses the Doom engine (albeit in a cut-down form).

Incidentally, the Jaguar TC I was working on was based off said 32X romhack by saxman (before MAP20 was edited to fit into the 32X's memory constraints).

[taufan99]

you all discussing the console doom greatness and lacks? then, let me join!
absolutely, snes memory for doom may only a little bit, but that doesn't mean it sucks.
32x does not shows some levels.
jaguar levels are edited, and not bad, only missing a famous cyberdemon & spiderdemon.
3do are created only 10 weeks, but doesn't mean it better than jaguar. remember doom 3? it was first started in 2000, but done in 2004, and doom 3 was awesome.
psx are same as jaguar, although shows the cyberdemon and spiderdemon and levels added.
saturn are same as psx.
but no matter what kind of the console, all of doom was great! but some console lacks ability or does not shown to avoid spoiler...
thanks, guy for your attention

[Nightside]

SNES Doom

The link is working, but the file is corrupted. Please would change server or put the file back on the internet?

[wolfman]

Rename the file to SNESDoom.7z and extract with 7zip.

Here is a link to another version with maps: http://www.mediafire.com/?9bf6ffqbrl5s4cc

[Nightside]

Rename the file to SNESDoom.7z and extract with 7zip.

Here is a link to another version with maps: http://www.mediafire.com/?9bf6ffqbrl5s4cc

OH YEAAAAAHHHHHH...... Thanks man!!!

[taufan99]

Rename the file to SNESDoom.7z and extract with 7zip.

Here is a link to another version with maps: http://www.mediafire.com/?9bf6ffqbrl5s4cc

Uhh, i have a bug. When i shoot plasma rifle, the sounds crashed and ZDOOM gets crashed too. Fixes?

[darkhaven3]

Eh, not really. The rendering was already taken care of with the SuperFX2 chip. (SNES Doom was polygon based, IIRC) They didn't really have to do much work to get the 3d running. The rest of it is a mediocre attempt at recreating the Doom gameplay engine, and does a pretty shitty job of it, as it plays horribly. The music is nice, though.

Incorrect. The Super FX 2 chip has no hardware to deal with textured 3D polygons, so all the drawing is done in software with math functions pushed onto the FX2. There is no "rendering magic" the FX chip is doing, it's basically just another general purpose coprocessor that whoever programmed the SNES Doom engine decided to utilize for the software renderer

Really, Doom isn't that complex of a game besides the 3d rendering, and they already had that taken care of. They didn't accomplish much. I mean, yeah, the SNES is a limited piece of hardware, but Doom doesn't exactly take a supercomputer to run, and it's not even Doom itself on a technical level, it's a clone of it.

The engine was 100% in house, designed from the ground up, and is not very much at all like the original Doom engine, actually

Am I the only one that feels this way?

You don't seem to know what you're talking about, so yes, probably

Everyone seems to adore how "oh wow they got it running on this?", but I don't see what was so special about it, they didn't have to jump through any hoops

So writing your own renderer from scratch I suppose does not count as "jumping through a hoop" in Sodaland

all they had to do was just put together a shitty clone engine (not really as hard as you would think on an SNES, given the power of the chip they used)

What, 20MHz? And that was only the theoretical clock speed the chip itself ran at, it was probably more limited by the system/cartridge bus and RAM access latency. You're aware that Doom doesn't run that well even in a smaller viewport on a 33MHz 386 with 4MB of RAM, right? With all things taken into consideration, you're looking at a 16-bit 65c816 chip @ 3.58MHz and a math coprocessor at around 21MHz that intentionally periodically locks up so the CPU can DMA the contents of the FX2 RAM into VRAM (and the FSB runs alot slower than 21MHz, so ultimately FPS depends on how long it takes instructions to go to the FX2 and then for the SNES CPU to read a large image through the cartridge slot many times a second), and total, you have 128KB of RAM on the SNES itself and you effectively have to rely on slower RAM that resides on the cartridge to store textures and stuff.

The chip took all the hard work out of it. All they had to do was make something with it, the hard part (fast-ish textured polygon rendering) was already done for them.

LOL

Rename the file to SNESDoom.7z and extract with 7zip.

Here is a link to another version with maps: http://www.mediafire.com/?9bf6ffqbrl5s4cc

Uhh, i have a bug. When i shoot plasma rifle, the sounds crashed and ZDOOM gets crashed too. Fixes?

Old bug, happens because the DEHACKED patch is for some reason written in such a way that the plasma rifle tries to shoot all of its ammo in 0 tics. I could have sworn either me or Bashe fixed this back in 2004

EDIT: Also, whoops, didn't see this post:

Chances are that they're using a stripped down version of the level format since they needed to conserve RAM/needed less information (no floor textures). Don't quote me on this, but I would guess that texture names were probably just an 8-bit integer or something instead of text, along with similar stuff done to other areas of the level format.

The maps for SNES Doom are an entirely different format than the PC version, because they are not even close to being the same engine

And about the other ports that you could compare it to, bear in mind that those other ports didn't have the help of anything like a SuperFX chip to render anything for them, meaning they had to come up with something themselves.

Repeating myself so it's clear -- the Super FX chip is not some magical godsend chip that has built-in polygon handling circuitry, it's just a math coprocessor that does what you tell it to do.

Also keep in mind that they did horrendous jobs porting the game to other platforms as well. I will admit, SNES Doom (non-rendering wise) isn't as bad as I'm making it out to be, but it was still a mediocre job of imitating Doom's mechanics (still, they did a better job than the other ports).

I think it does a pretty remarkable job considering the technical limitations that come with relying on a cartridge-mounted coprocessor that runs through a 3.5MHz system bus to do all your rendering

My point being, platform has nothing to do with it, it depends on the degree of how bad the developers screw things up

Fairly certain the fact that the 32x has two 23MHz 32-bit RISC CPUs and plenty more RAM than the SNES + FX2, in addition to the Genesis having a CPU about twice as fast as the SNES's, has something to do with the fact that the SNES version is in many aspects inferior to the 32x version

SNES Doom's team just screwed up a little less than the other porting teams, that's all. And they were already ahead of the game with rendering already being taken care of for them; they didn't have to do anything, whereas the other teams had no such head start. If it hadn't been for the SuperFX chip, the SNES version would've probably been one of the worst ones.

The Super FX 2 chip is, again, just a math processor that does whatever you tell it to do. Hell, if you wanted to, you could have the Super FX chip mix digital SFX for you, it doesn't have any dedicated circuitry for any particular task other than storing and loading data from a bit of onboard cart RAM and stopping mid-process to let the SNES CPU have access to its little buffer

[Xtyfe]

The SNES version of doom was the first version of doom I ever played and also the first FPS game I ever played. I wish I owned the original cart