[Not a bug] Effects of Berserk last indefinitely. 2.0.63a

GeeDougg · Post by **GeeDougg** » Sat Aug 28, 2004 5:20 pm

I honestly don't believe in the "first rule of source-port programming", if that is actually an established rule of source-port programming. If you think about it, jumping and mouse-look severely modify the bahaviour and feel of the original Doom, so does that make ZDooM an invalid source-port, and does it mean ZDooM can't technically be called a source-port for DooM? I doubt that.

And anyways I'm not saying ZDooM desperately needs an option for that feature to be available...; I'm just sayin that for some (myself included) that might be a good option to have.

Post by **Graf Zahl** » Sat Aug 28, 2004 5:25 pm

Use scripts! This is the same nonsense as the chaingun accuracy thread. Somebody doesn't like the game's behavior in a certain aspect and loudly demands a change. No thank you!

As for jumping/mouselooking: You just don't have to use them and it's all the same. If Berserk is timed it has a fundamental impact on the way the game is played. There are lots of maps out there which require an untimed Berserk because otherwise you'd run out of ammo.

GeeDougg · Post by **GeeDougg** » Sat Aug 28, 2004 5:34 pm

Dude I'm not "loudly demanding a change".... I thought I've already made that clear....

As for the fundamental impact argument, I could say the same for jumping. You could easily cheat or get past something quickly and easily with jumping (and sometimes you may even break what little plot there is that you're supposed to follow because you'll get to an area via jumping before you're meant to get there and you'll cross a line/sector too quickly and trigger an event that would other wise not have happened then.

Also, I know that Mouse-Look and Jumping are there as an option and you could "not use them if you don't want" but that's basically what I was saying with the Berserker thing. You could have it set to "original Vanilla behaviour" by default and have an *OPTION* to turn it on or off if you please. And still I'm not even saying that even this option must be implemented. I'm just saying that it would be better for myself if it was there, and I can live with it if it's not.

HotWax · Post by **HotWax** » Sat Aug 28, 2004 5:47 pm

Graf Zahl wrote:This is the same nonsense as the chaingun accuracy thread. Somebody doesn't like the game's behavior in a certain aspect and loudly demands a change.

Yes, because having an uber-powerful close-range attack purposefully programmed into the game destabilizes multiplayer just as much as an uber-powerful long-range attack that was never intended to be combined with zooming.

Gee: You're wasting your breath. Graf doesn't know what the word "option" means.

I'm not going to agree with you here, though. The berserk is a trade-off. You get excellent damage, but only with your shortest-range weapon, so you have to put yourself in danger to keep using it. Unlike a programming side-effect that id could never have guessed would be abused and combined with zooming, there can be absolutely no doubt that the Berserk has always been behaving as intended.

If it needs to be changed for a specific map, it can be scripted right now anyway.

Post by **Graf Zahl** » Sat Aug 28, 2004 5:51 pm

THe word 'option' means to add a potential improvement that may be switched off for compatibility. But it does not mean to remove functionality which both of these cases would be.

HotWax · Post by **HotWax** » Sat Aug 28, 2004 6:00 pm

So what you're saying is that adding a non-default sv_* option that doesn't show up in the compatibility menu because it's server side is apparently removing functionality? Interesting.

/me calls the men in white coats.

Post by **Graf Zahl** » Sat Aug 28, 2004 6:24 pm

Just because I disagree with you?

Get a life!

Giest118 · Post by **Giest118** » Sat Aug 28, 2004 6:32 pm

SHUT THE FUCK UP BOTH OF YOU.

Okay? Thank you.

GeeDougg · Post by **GeeDougg** » Sat Aug 28, 2004 6:34 pm

Graf, for the last time man, functionality in it's current form wouldn't have to be "removed", just modified (or just with an option added) that would allow the player to choose whether ot not they want it on or off. And anyways this is almost the opposite of the chaingun thread, because in this case you'd actually be limiting yourself to a set-time berserker effect, which means that you'd probably make it easier for yourself to just leave it on.

HotWax, it's OK that you don't agree with me (what is it, 253 to 3 now?!

); we all have opinions. I give mine, you give yours, Graf gives his, etc.. I personally think the Chainsaw is a close range weapon too and you could just use that, and while it may not be as powerful as the berserker-activated fists (which can have as much damage as Rockets) it's still a good alternative to the regular fists (as far as close-range attacks go anyway). And if leaving it the way it is (with the current berserker behaviour) is how you like it or how Graf likes it then that's OK. I don't even know how this thing turned into an argument. It seems whenever I step into a thread all of a sudden everyone becomes possessed. And now I seem to have pissed Graf off (which I didn't mean to do).

Oh, and no, Graf, I don't think you're crazy just 'cuz you disagree with me or with HotWax.

Edit: Giest, how exactly will that help?!

Post by **randi** » Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:56 pm

Well, I'm not changing it. Goodbye.

HotWax · Post by **HotWax** » Sat Aug 28, 2004 10:23 pm

Graf Zahl wrote:Just because I disagree with you?

Get a life!

No, because you're defining the word "option" as something it's not.

wildweasel · Post by **wildweasel** » Sun Aug 29, 2004 1:18 am

The discussion is over. Randy said he's not changing it. So please, retreat to your rooms, and let's not have to use the report button.

HotWax · Post by **HotWax** » Sun Aug 29, 2004 2:49 pm

Hey, WW, feel free to Nazi elsewhere. We're having a discussion and you're not invited.

Thanks.

wildweasel · Post by **wildweasel** » Sun Aug 29, 2004 4:53 pm

Too late. Unwarranted flames get warranted punishments.

HotWax · Post by **HotWax** » Sun Aug 29, 2004 6:55 pm

That wasn't a flame, moron. Butting into a conversation you have nothing to do with and declaring martial law could be considered one, though. And now you're going to waste Randy's time by reporting that post? If you want him to rethink his decision to add the feature, keep it up.