Hideous Destructor 4.10.0b

[Matt]

As far as my experience with the Doom engine has ever told me, no that is not possible.

Movement on 3D floors seems normal to me. I've only tested this on the table on the firing range though (which, incidentally, is one of those things that gives odd results when you try to take out its legs with a doorbuster).


"Spent shotgun shells spawned on maps endlessly spin."
So that's where those are coming from, thanks!


Re: DERP, it's not calling A_Look quite as often, but I think I might be able to change that. Its firing seems pretty stable as it is.

Its current bulk includes the treads... that's quite a bit of additional width, so it's not too far in principle from the difference between say this nice flat Viking sword and this gargantuan full-hilted rapier. (One ought-to-be-bigger thing on my list of life goals: learn to stop relying on that huge ass thing to protect my hand when I fence, so I can go to tourneys and shit and not have that awful thing banging against me all the time.)

[mumblemumble]

I'll test again with latest commit, but I had something from a week ago that did this to higher up 3d floors. Like, walkways above things. I remember this was an issue before zscript changes, maybe the zscript conversion lost this? I'll check again though.

If possible, I'd LOVE to see walls blasted open more, but I imagine this would be very complex. A few more idead are
-taking small, empty sectors (pillars) and turn them into full sectors (broken pillars).
-drawings line defs around thicker walls and removing pieces, to make dents in walls
Honestly, i won't pester much on this because i know it might be difficult.

A_look sounds right, both mine, and enemy derps seem half awake to the point they occasionally ignore a monster walking past, and its incredibly aggivating. And part of the reason i call for a slower fire rate, is with its size, accuracy wouldn't be very possible with a fire rate that a human hand struggles with. Mechanically it would spin slightly if shooting mid turn so quickly.

Tb beam seems to have trouble detonating on actors as bits of movement prevent the chain reaction. This is another reason i suggests a tao cannon setup, it would be less finicky managing the stack of zaps, and would be less finicky about effective range. I also know that you don't have any clear head cannon of what it is, but I can't think of anything, light, radiation, electro magnets, or whatever, that would produce a stronger effect being spread out, so the fact "wide" beam instantly kills zombies, and narrow can cook a zombie for half of the battery, yet still explode, boggles the mind. A more focused energy should be more effective, just like our talks about fire.

Is there any way to make ladders descend along steep slopes? This would be nice for mountainous maps.. And i wonder if perhaps, the ladder could have a grappling hook, and a pulley, so you could toss the hook that is welded to the pulley, and then use the pulley to raise the ladder almost like a flag. Would be handy, as ladders are mostly for descent, and not ascent. Another idea, could we hook multiple ladders together for longer distance?

And if i sprited the new smg, would you code in a collapsing stock with pistol like handling?

[Matt]

I'm thinking of the collapsing stock handling anyway, the current sprite seems passable enough. Might not be for the very next stable but not ruling that out.

The current TB takes the old behavioural bug and turns it into a full feature - the electrical buildup just gets conducted away causing more damage to the actor but preventing the catastrophic reaction.

I don't really see anything stopping the ladder from going down really steep slopes (I had to look it up to make sure it was position-based rather than sector-based like the new doorbusters) but actually following a slope is a lot more complicated.

[Caligari87]

If possible, I'd LOVE to see walls blasted open more, but I imagine this would be very complex. A few more idead are
-taking small, empty sectors (pillars) and turn them into full sectors (broken pillars).
-drawings line defs around thicker walls and removing pieces, to make dents in walls
Honestly, i won't pester much on this because i know it might be difficult.

It's not just difficult, it's downright impossible. Lines are immobile. New lines cannot be added, and lines cannot be deleted. Same for adding/removing sectors. Those things require rebuilding the blockmap and reloading the map.

Sectors in Doom can move their floors and ceilings. That's it. That's what this effect is based on, and I think Matt's shown us the most it can possibly do. ZScript is great, but it cannot overcome this fundamental limitation. At least, not without an entirely new map format and rendering code, which isn't coming anytime soon.

[Matt]

Thanks, Caligari - that's what I've been assuming but I didn't know for sure. (I can imagine a Vertex/Line/Sector.Create() function in ZScript but then there's all that stuff about nodes and whatnot)

[mumblemumble]

I'm just going off the sprite having a 2 beam stock, which would fold over the side, and the extremely long smg barrel. I figure the smg could have its barrel shortened to the base of the frame, or at least cut in half, and the stocl could have A single compression tube to quickly extend in or out. So overall slightly shorter than now, but still longer than the pistol.

I'll see what I can do with gimp.

The 3d floor is still messed up, the table only works kinda, because the legs are TRUE floors, but you still slow on the gap. You also cannot vault over 1 side line defs, which substantially limits mobility on many maps.

I'd like to suggest that derpgo maybe allow the derp to jump off small ledges. I can understand that it can't go up, but since there's been rc cars for years that can flip themselves up right, I'm sure a derp could be made to go down stairs.

A small bug, but if you use revive, your corpse is glued to your next body, which blocks all kicks kinda obnoxious.

I know I've mentioned before, but i want to suggest again.. Could second flesh cap hp at 25 or 30,rather than 10? I understand such a substance would be intense, but I still think one could tolerate a single bullet during the process. 10 has zero forgiveness, 30 has at least a tiny amount. And for the stim, could they, a few seconds after injection, give a more rapid heal, for about 3 seconds? Something to simulate the drug hitting your heart and brain, waking you up a bit, a good, and quick maybe 15-20 point heal, and possibly a shorter elevated heal rate as it is now, after ? Its obvious not berserk, but stims are STILL a drug, which means as close to instant gratification as you can get, especially with a needle , which would mean picking you up pretty quickly. Another idea is allowing slight negation of lethal damage with stims, slightly lower overdose tolerance, adverse effects from higher doses (twitchy, elevated heart rate) and even a possibility for addiction, which lowers energy / health levels on withdrawal. This way there's more wiggle room to exploit stims, but also a risk of getting addicted, having a habit to manage, and it possibly increasing the likelihood of an od. It could also give something else for blues to apply to. I primarily ask about stims, because they really don't feel like a combat stim at all, they at best feel like a healing ointment in application, speeding up recovery slightly, while a stim popped in battle feels largely more a placebo than anything, as in a 20 second fight you will only gain maybe 15 points more than standard heal rate. To compensate, maybe stims themselves could have a minor crash like berserk, nothing severe, just a little more sluggish, for a minute, which could also lead to dangerous addiction of the fairly common item. I'd be happy with all of this, if only stims had a very noticeable effect during the 3 seconds while i pop in cover. Especially with heavy bleeding, or burning, stims feel untimely useless. It honestly feels comparable to minecraft food

RL / bronto zoom is wonky compared to what it used to, for one particular reason. The point blank mark is also the VERY top of the sight, which makes aiming extremely obnoxious. I think the top should be extended up a little bit, so a target in point blank zoom isn't half off screen. I do like the zoning on it with the distance rungs, just not the center of crosshair so close to the top. Beyond that, a dual red dot / zoom would be nice, like the rifles.

[Matt]

What's a good map to test this 3d floor stuff on? I just tried Killhouse and it works fine.

[mumblemumble]

Map08 of dump 3,the walkways over the slime are the offending floor. I think it has to do with thickness, as thicker 3d floors don't offend. But as soon as i step on it, I'm slower, and I also cannot vault over the railings which are just solid mid textures.

[Matt]

...what the fuck is that horrible thing.

Someone open this in a map editor that works and explain it to me, this is not a normal 3D floor.

No wait that is a normal 3D floor, just the lines disappeared from the automap.

"3d MidTex" is new to me though.

[mumblemumble]

Pretty sure it is last i checked, even the table on the range is the same, and the gaps between the table legs do the same thing. But ill check just in case

EDIT : JUST CHECKED, it is indeed a 3d floor. With a triangle just south in the void with a "set 3d floor" line to the sector in question. So its just you man. It's odd because i remember this issue before, and you fixed it, but its back now... Perhaps the zscript change broke something

[Matt]

Turns out there was a major error in how that entire thing was calculated (adding to the Z value of the checked position twice). I'm surprised it worked as well as it did all this time.

Still no idea how to deal with that railing though.

[mumblemumble]

Strangely, again, i remember railings working before.

Actually i JUST checked the pre-zscript build stable, and yes, vaulting mid textures works fine there, but not in current. Maybe you should look there

Also, considering air burst range starts at 10 meters, why not make the air burst setting go from 0 to 10 immediately? 1-9 seem to do the same thing, and it wastes time.

EDIT : Theres a crash seemingly with yokai.

VM execution aborted: tried to read from address zero. In function parameter "target"
Called from actor.checksight [native]
called from yokaispawner.statefunction.2 at :zscript/yokai.text, line137
called from state yokaispawner.2 in yokaispawner

You know, the more I think about gyro rockets stopping within 10 meters, the more I dont understand. How does it remain stable despite the heat of jetfuel? how does the jet actually TURN OFF on impact within this time, without exploding?...I can understand grenade mode, since its basically a large primer going off, but shutting down a rocket engine is incredibly difficult, and I think a rocket cracking its frame from an impact with hot burning fuel next to a high explosive charge, presumably with a few pieces inside shattered, would cause an explosion. Seems too unreasonable, I think rocket mode should just detonate on hit. Also, I've noticed grenade mode has a better active range than rocket, so perhaps your measurements of distance needs to be re-calculated for rockets specifically, as air burst rockets also seem inconsistent.

[Matt]

The pre-ZScript version uses a slower method. The new fix works with 3dmidtexes now but is slower than the old new method and I'm not sure if it's faster or slower than the pre-ZScript method.

[mumblemumble]

What the... bloody HELL MATT, what did you do to the spidermastermind and cyberdemon! The mastermind has an energy shield which shrugs off rockets by the handful, and the cyberdemon fires homing plasma slugs?!

hmmn...hold on. I'm off to give "gotcha" a try.

EDIT : and cyberdemons now give even less about cover...

[Caligari87]

Quick question, who made Office Assault? I'm building a page on the HD wiki, a list of levels that work well with, or are designed for HD: https://github.com/MatthewTheGlutton/Hi ... Destructor