[Fixed] Things don't drop down to floor

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Postby Chris » Sat Nov 01, 2003 9:11 pm

But it is the way Hexen behaves, and I think it makes more sense. But since you complained about it so vociferously, I've changed it back for Doom and Heretic so that things standing on the floor will stay glued to it no matter how fast it drops, if only so that that spot in E4M7 will work.


I think this would do better as a compatibility option. Having the player stay at the current height as the floor drops out from underneath is IMO a great effect that can be used very effectively by modders.

EDIT:
Or maybe a DEHACKED flag: NOFLOORSTICK
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Postby Graf Zahl » Sun Nov 02, 2003 2:43 am

Chris wrote:
But it is the way Hexen behaves, and I think it makes more sense. But since you complained about it so vociferously, I've changed it back for Doom and Heretic so that things standing on the floor will stay glued to it no matter how fast it drops, if only so that that spot in E4M7 will work.


I think this would do better as a compatibility option. Having the player stay at the current height as the floor drops out from underneath is IMO a great effect that can be used very effectively by modders.

EDIT:
Or maybe a DEHACKED flag: NOFLOORSTICK


I agree. I didn't know that Hexen behaves differently than Doom. In that case it's certainly preferable to have both options available, either through MAPINFO or a compatiblity flag (which can switch between Doom/Hexen/default.
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Postby Cyb » Sun Nov 02, 2003 12:49 pm

I used that very effect in massm2 (map09, the uac_dead area), does this mean it doesn't work now? because if so the joke in that part is pretty much totally ruined :(

or does that mean for doom format maps?

either way I still like the previous behavior much better...
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Postby Xaser » Tue Nov 04, 2003 10:00 am

Cyb wrote:I used that very effect in massm2 (map09, the uac_dead area)


Umm... which part is that?
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Postby Cyb » Tue Nov 04, 2003 12:30 pm

after the cutscene with the stairs the player gets teleported onto the steps, replacing the scripted marine, and the stairs drop instantly causing you to hang in the air for a second then then drop ("in order to walk on the stairs you must believe that they exist" or somcsuch)
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Postby Anonymous » Tue Nov 04, 2003 1:13 pm

randy, thank you so much for submitting to the pressure and fixing this instant drop floor bug for Doom and Heretic in ZDoom. On Eternal DOOM MAP06, there is a spot where the instant floor drop trick is used to make enemies appear instantly in front of you when you hit a switch. The player is the one who is dropped instantly in this case. With this bug, that spot was no longer frightening when played in ZDoom, where with doom2.exe, that spot would scare the crap out of you.

Thanks for fixing it!!!!
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Postby Nanami » Tue Nov 04, 2003 1:28 pm

Hm, seems like there's a compatibility issue now.
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Postby Anonymous » Tue Nov 04, 2003 2:57 pm

That spot would scare the scrap out of you because at Ultra Violence at that spot in doom2.exe, you hit the switch and the wall then disappears instantly revealing a Revenant!!! With this, bug, that doesn't happen in ZDoom. You fall instead, ruining the effect.
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Postby Chris » Tue Nov 04, 2003 3:34 pm

I don't think the insta-drop as described above really warrants, not only a visual change, but a gameplay one as well. When you're on a floor and it falls out from underneath, if you stick to it, it's as if you were on the floor the whole time. But if you fall to it, it still does the same thing, more realisticly, and also if the drop is far enough, to cause damage in a trap.

It would be a little odd to be standing running across somewhere, then all of a sudden you're many units lower, and stuck, instead of having fallen and died. Or if you completely miss a reachable/secret alcove because you stuck to the floor instead of falling through the air.

Basically, while the above example behaves somewhat differently, it still acts properly. Where as sticking to the floor (by default) would ruin many potential (and existing) things.
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Postby Nanami » Tue Nov 04, 2003 3:39 pm

I believe the dropping from the floor instead of sticking to it is more desirable because:

1) Traps meant to damage the player with a fall will work correctly. The area in Massmouth2 where the floor drops will work correctly.

2) The effect that Patriot describes would merely be slightly changed (monsters falling from the ceiling I suppose?), not entirely ruined. Besides, isn't this effect usually used with an instantly raising floor, not a lowering one?
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Postby HotWax » Tue Nov 04, 2003 3:44 pm

Nanami wrote:I believe the dropping from the floor instead of sticking to it is more desirable because:

1) Traps meant to damage the player with a fall will work correctly. The area in Massmouth2 where the floor drops will work correctly.

2) The effect that Patriot describes would merely be slightly changed (monsters falling from the ceiling I suppose?), not entirely ruined. Besides, isn't this effect usually used with an instantly raising floor, not a lowering one?


He's saying the player drops instantly, not the monsters, but yes it could have as easily been done by instantly raising the player, which would still work.
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Postby Graf Zahl » Tue Nov 04, 2003 3:50 pm

Nanami wrote:Besides, isn't this effect usually used with an instantly raising floor, not a lowering one?


It is but at the point where the thing height calculations are done the only relevant thing is the absolute movement and that is 'down'.
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Postby Anonymous » Wed Nov 05, 2003 5:55 pm

I think insta-drop should be optional then, based on what you all are saying. I think it should be available on the compatibility menu.
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Postby Kate » Thu Nov 06, 2003 12:53 pm

Or maybe it should only affect monsters and have the player fall as normal.
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Postby Cyb » Mon Nov 10, 2003 11:52 am

I would think the best behavior would be hexen behavior for hexen format maps (and thus any zdoom specific map) and doom behavior for heretic and doom format maps, unless that's what randy already did (or was it changed for the doom/heretic gamemode?)
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