[SoftPoly] Evilution MAP02 midtextures not showing properly

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Rachael
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Re: [SoftPoly] Evilution MAP02 midtextures not showing prope

Post by Rachael »

Xaser wrote:...Do y'all not know how issue trackers work? o_O

[EDIT] Just to make super-sure this wasn't getting rug-swept, I pinged dpJudas on Discord and he had this to say:
[5:36 PM] dpJudas: I'm aware that renderhacks doesn't work, but I don't have any immediate plans to fix it
[5:36 PM] dpJudas: if I do, it only happens if I'm really really bored :)
That more or less places this particular one into a probable [Won't Fix] category, which is fine. It just isn't clear from the close reason.
The reason why I closed it is because it is a bug report on a missing feature that has never yet existed in the SoftPoly renderer.

In a way, with the way SoftPoly was designed, this is not even really a bug, just a hack that was never implemented. This counts more as a feature suggestion, to me.

Think of it this way: What do you think would happen if you opened a bug report that GZDoom is unable to open .bsp maps? :)
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Chris
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Re: [SoftPoly] Evilution MAP02 midtextures not showing prope

Post by Chris »

I guess it doesn't help that in recent years, many code repositories (*cough*github*cough*) blur the distinction between bugs and feature requests. I mean, the word "issue" kind of does that itself in a way; a bug implies a defect that needs correcting, whereas an issue implies something to be dealt with. A lack of a feature is an issue, but it's not a bug.
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Re: [SoftPoly] Evilution MAP02 midtextures not showing prope

Post by Xaser »

I guess I just don't tend to worry much about the feature/bug axis compare to the open/closed one, since "closed" is the ultimate out-of-sight whereas open bugs/features can be moved if need be. 'Course, I was approaching it from a "wait, dpJudas might want to save this for later" mindset, which as it turns out ain't the case. tl;dr, my concerns are moot. :P
dpJudas wrote:Sorry for the wall of text, but hopefully that explains why, to me, issue trackers isn't an aid. :)
No worries -- that makes total sense. Thanks for the background! 'Tis interesting.

Thinking on it, I'm kinda surprised I'm not the same way. I'm also the guy who does all the free-wheeling random-dev; I just tend to leave a mass of self-opened tickets in my wake for future-me to handle... or ignore. :P
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Rachael
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Re: [SoftPoly] Evilution MAP02 midtextures not showing prope

Post by Rachael »

Xaser wrote:I guess I just don't tend to worry much about the feature/bug axis compare to the open/closed one, since "closed" is the ultimate out-of-sight whereas open bugs/features can be moved if need be.
We're not the Supreme Court. You can reopen issues later. A lot of recent features got in that way. ;)
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Graf Zahl
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Re: [SoftPoly] Evilution MAP02 midtextures not showing prope

Post by Graf Zahl »

dpJudas wrote: In a professional team I'm the developer that somehow "forgets" to create tickets and codes on stuff I'm not really supposed to be coding on.
I don't want to insult you, but I got a colleague like that, too. And this guy's driving me nuts because ultimately his attitude works against the project.
What I feel like coding on varies greatly from day to day, but ultimately half of what I implement would not ever get done if you strictly followed the backlog.
True, but in general, when the backlog is not cleaned the project won't go forward. How do you manage? Where I work there's a clear roadmap what needs to be done, but keeping the backlog of issues in order is the most important thing because if that becomes a problem, the project would be in trouble.
And for the same reason all bugs related to renderhacks are filed under "renderhacks not implemented" in my head - I don't need to see all the variations that would need testing if I tried to implement it one day. If anything, it would just discourage me. :p
Same here at work. There's the big elephant in the room called "UI redesign". But there's ONE issue for the whole thing, no need to micromanage it.

That said, how do you think I went after this in GZDoom? Initially I grabbed myself a large number of maps with known render hacks and then went after them one at a time. Most were actually solvable with a small amount of generic handling. Most of what's in hw_renderhacks should be just as usable for the softpoly renderer as well.
In a few cases I had to give up because the hacks were just too gross. And a few times even trying to make it work with compatibility settings failed (e.g. Suspended in Dusk - its hacks were just too extreme.)
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Re: [SoftPoly] Evilution MAP02 midtextures not showing prope

Post by dpJudas »

Graf Zahl wrote:I don't want to insult you, but I got a colleague like that, too. And this guy's driving me nuts because ultimately his attitude works against the project.
Hehe, I don't doubt that. Having someone like me on the team has its pros and cons, just like with every other developer personality.
Graf Zahl wrote:True, but in general, when the backlog is not cleaned the project won't go forward. How do you manage? Where I work there's a clear roadmap what needs to be done, but keeping the backlog of issues in order is the most important thing because if that becomes a problem, the project would be in trouble.
Where I currently work I'm responsible for coding one of the epics from the roadmap. I usually don't deal with the small feature requests or bug tickets. If a ticket does get assigned to me I do eventually fix and close it, so it isn't like I completely 100% ignore the ticket system. I just don't use it to manage my own thoughts and plans like some other developers do.

Some development methods (mostly scrum/agile) thinks my kind of role shouldn't really exist. In those systems all developers are treated as alike and I'm supposed to decompose my entire battle plan into 1-2 day tasks before even really starting. Then my boss/scrum master needs to ask me every day if I solved the current task yet, officially to "help" me, but in reality to force me to walk forward ("sprint") every single day - like whipping an ox. It might very well be more efficient, but it sure hell isn't fun to work like that. So when I "forget" to do things, it is partly my way of sabotaging systems that I find destroys the fun of working.

Sorry to folks that feels those systems work for them - anyone insisting I need to follow them is effectively asking me to quit. Luckily for me, there's plenty of jobs out there that aren't drowned in this kind of red tape. They are usually more fun, too, as the agile method is usually overkill in the startup phase. :)
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Re: [SoftPoly] Evilution MAP02 midtextures not showing prope

Post by Rachael »

These kinds of corporatisms are part of why I haven't gone into professional programming like dozens upon dozens of people in my life keep saying I should.
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Re: [SoftPoly] Evilution MAP02 midtextures not showing prope

Post by dpJudas »

Rachael wrote:These kinds of corporatisms are part of why I haven't gone into professional programming like dozens upon dozens of people in my life keep saying I should.
The trick is to figure out what kind of role you like to do and find the right company type and size that fits. Generally speaking, the older a company is, the more all the roles will be well-defined and systems in place that must be followed.

Smaller companies often don't have the resources to hire a testing team, an architect, two junior and a senior developer, etc etc. As a result, if you like more to be the jack-of-all-trades that runs both their IT systems as well as their website (i.e. the kind of work you do for zdoom), then there's companies that need just that and gives you the freedom to arrange it as you like. Office space is a documentary of larger corporations - the smaller ones are usually not as bad. :D
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Rachael
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Re: [SoftPoly] Evilution MAP02 midtextures not showing prope

Post by Rachael »

You mean I don't have to file TPS reports? 8-)
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Re: [SoftPoly] Evilution MAP02 midtextures not showing prope

Post by Graf Zahl »

dpJudas wrote: Some development methods (mostly scrum/agile) thinks my kind of role shouldn't really exist. In those systems all developers are treated as alike and I'm supposed to decompose my entire battle plan into 1-2 day tasks before even really starting. Then my boss/scrum master needs to ask me every day if I solved the current task yet, officially to "help" me, but in reality to force me to walk forward ("sprint") every single day - like whipping an ox. It might very well be more efficient, but it sure hell isn't fun to work like that. So when I "forget" to do things, it is partly my way of sabotaging systems that I find destroys the fun of working.
I couldn't work in such an environment either. Fortunately it's more oriented towards long term goals (3 releases per year) and what matters is that the work gets done, not how it gets done.
But working on a software that's being used by paying customers means that customer reported issues always need to take priority because a dissatisfied customer may eventually become a non-customer if they don't get what they want.
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