"Where's my resolutions?" Read here!

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Re: "Where's my resolutions?" Read here!

Postby stan423321 » Sat Jul 21, 2018 2:42 pm

In light of this, to the best of my understanding, being a thing because of lack of suitable list of resolutions, what would prevent numeric specification of one in the menu without invokation of consoles and external programs?

And if that could be implemented but just wasn't, would a checkbox disabling "window manager" resizing be a huge pain on top of that?
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Re: "Where's my resolutions?" Read here!

Postby Rachael » Sat Jul 21, 2018 3:00 pm

For Windows, that would not be too much trouble as it's simply a window attribute that has to be flipped, but I am not sure how to do it in Mac or Linux. I rarely ever do GUI work and the initial implementation of Borderless (which in this case, completely replaced Fullscreen) was just me wanting it badly enough to finally get off my butt and do the research on how to do the window manipulation and make it happen.
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Re: "Where's my resolutions?" Read here!

Postby TerminusEst13 » Sat Jul 21, 2018 3:04 pm

This seems like a really arbitrary removal of a much-relied-on-and-baseline feature for no real tangible reason.
Telling players to download a third-party application just for standard functionality seems like an incredibly bad idea.

Not really a fan of this, sorry. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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Re: "Where's my resolutions?" Read here!

Postby iSpook » Sat Jul 21, 2018 3:16 pm

TerminusEst13 wrote:This seems like a really arbitrary removal of a much-relied-on-and-baseline feature for no real tangible reason.
Telling players to download a third-party application just for standard functionality seems like an incredibly bad idea.

Not really a fan of this, sorry. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


^ This, on top of that, this is really a dumb idea.
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Re: "Where's my resolutions?" Read here!

Postby Hege Cactus » Sat Jul 21, 2018 3:22 pm

Yeah gotta agree with term and kinsie here, telling users to download third party program isnt a great solution

not to mention the mentioned blizzard games are like, how much newer compared to the doom and its pixels?
old games, and games made to look old style that have a lot of pixelation which dont really like self modifiable resolutions
so comparing this to blizzard games kinda doesnt work if you ask me

Depending how this works I am very sceptical about it, cause doom is after all sprite based game, not 3D modeled, so it really worries me
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Re: "Where's my resolutions?" Read here!

Postby Graf Zahl » Sat Jul 21, 2018 3:32 pm

Hege Cactus wrote:... so it really worries me


I have to admit I have no clue what you are trying to say with your post.
Is this about not being able anymore to switch to low res display modes or not being able to set a specific window size?

I already said, the mode change was removed because it was a source of endless problems.
And with Vulkan this would have spelled serious trouble so it got removed before I started with that.
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Re: "Where's my resolutions?" Read here!

Postby TerminusEst13 » Sat Jul 21, 2018 3:45 pm

Graf Zahl wrote:I already said, the mode change was removed because it was a source of endless problems.
And with Vulkan this would have spelled serious trouble so it got removed before I started with that.


Such as?
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Re: "Where's my resolutions?" Read here!

Postby iSpook » Sat Jul 21, 2018 3:49 pm

Maybe you should look into re-writing it, so it plays nice with what you plan on doing, instead of robbing us of a common, valuable option for something that's obviously not going to be done for a long while.
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Re: "Where's my resolutions?" Read here!

Postby wildweasel » Sat Jul 21, 2018 3:54 pm

iSpook wrote:Maybe you should look into re-writing it, so it plays nice with what you plan on doing, instead of robbing us of a common, valuable option for something that's obviously not going to be done for a long while.

Suggestions, contributions, testing reports, bug threads, explanations of use cases, etc. are appreciated at this point. The best way to get the problem solved is to help with it.

(And not that this is leveled specifically at you, or any specific people for that matter, but doing so in a calm and rational manner would help as well.)
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Re: "Where's my resolutions?" Read here!

Postby Rachael » Sat Jul 21, 2018 3:56 pm

The responses here are starting to get a little vitriolic including a couple guest posts that I had to throw out because they were getting a bit hostile. So I am closing this thread.

PLEASE people - I've said it before, and I'll say it again - if you want to convince anyone, of ANYTHING, in an argument, TRY to be nice about it! Rationalize your argument, think about the other person's perspective, or you will get NOWHERE with it. This is a perfect example of that.

iSpook wrote:Maybe you should look into re-writing it, so it plays nice with what you plan on doing, instead of robbing us of a common, valuable option for something that's obviously not going to be done for a long while.

This post is a common example of the kind of thing I am talking about. It's very ego-centric, with absolutely no desire to even consider what caused the change, and also makes an assumption about a feature being further off than it might actually be. If you wanted to be more effective with it, you could've just said this, instead:
What kind of technical hurdles were you running to that necessitated this change? Would it have been possible to implement an alternative in advance to the feature's removal? I feel a bit robbed with the sudden removal of the feature, and wish it could have been handled a bit differently.

Notice the biggest change is the tone of the post - the original quoted host was pretty hostile, my alternative would've been MUCH more effective at conveying the same message without the harsh "bite". AND you would've been a LOT more likely to get what you wanted, with the second example, rather than the first! Think about it, please!
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Re: "Where's my resolutions?" Read here!

Postby Cardboard Marty » Sat Jul 21, 2018 4:09 pm

Hello! I don't really like to speak up on technical matters, but I did want to address this!

Graf Zahl wrote:Ironic, considering that for layout testing a draggable window is a lot better. Stuff has to work on all screensizes however weird they are. Just testing on a small number of fixed resolutions tend to hide the more subtle positioning errors. It doesn't help if something works in 640x480, 1024x768 and 1200x1024, but then someone resizes the window to 1000x500 and everything falls apart. For layout testing it's the completely wrong way to work, actually.


I totally get what you mean here, but for HUD and menu design, I like to account for the commonly used resolutions people might actually play in. I'm sure somebody does play in something like 1000x500, but if my HUD breaks in 1000x500 I'm not too worried, as opposed to 1024x768, you know?

I feel like closing down threads because people weren't too nice with their feedback isn't really the way to go. We have a great moderation staff and a warning system that I feel suits that better. Closing down an open thread limits discussion on an issue people clearly feel strongly about, and doesn't look too good on the part of the developers and staff.
Last edited by Cardboard Marty on Sat Jul 21, 2018 4:11 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: "Where's my resolutions?" Read here!

Postby Rachael » Sat Jul 21, 2018 4:11 pm

If you feel strongly about it, fine, but be nice!
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Re: "Where's my resolutions?" Read here!

Postby iSpook » Sat Jul 21, 2018 4:13 pm

Rachael wrote:The responses here are starting to get a little vitriolic including a couple guest posts that I had to throw out because they were getting a bit hostile. So I am closing this thread.

PLEASE people - I've said it before, and I'll say it again - if you want to convince anyone, of ANYTHING, in an argument, TRY to be nice about it! Rationalize your argument, think about the other person's perspective, or you will get NOWHERE with it. This is a perfect example of that.

iSpook wrote:Maybe you should look into re-writing it, so it plays nice with what you plan on doing, instead of robbing us of a common, valuable option for something that's obviously not going to be done for a long while.

This post is a common example of the kind of thing I am talking about. It's very ego-centric, with absolutely no desire to even consider what caused the change, and also makes an assumption about a feature being further off than it might actually be. If you wanted to be more effective with it, you could've just said this, instead:
What kind of technical hurdles were you running to that necessitated this change? Would it have been possible to implement an alternative in advance to the feature's removal? I feel a bit robbed with the sudden removal of the feature, and wish it could have been handled a bit differently.

Notice the biggest change is the tone of the post - the original quoted host was pretty hostile, my alternative would've been MUCH more effective at conveying the same message without the harsh "bite". AND you would've been a LOT more likely to get what you wanted, with the second example, rather than the first! Think about it, please!

Two things:
1.) I assumed it was long-term because I haven't heard a single thing about this thing Graf wants to do, so it was an assumption to be on the safe side.
2.) I WAS being nice with my post, don't assume I was being hostile when I wasn't, it's rude. Sure I could have been nicer but when Graf goes "Hey I'm going to take something away because it causes problems, problems I won't go into to help understand the people who might not agree with it" then, in my eyes, why bother?

And as Weasel said: I could help test, but hearing stuff like this going on? Updating my Gzdoom doesn't bring much confidence, it just doesn't.
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Re: "Where's my resolutions?" Read here!

Postby Eric_ » Sat Jul 21, 2018 4:13 pm

Why wasn't this change implemented in QZDoom first? Isn't the entire point of that fork to be able to make radical changes without interfering with normal user operation, thus avoiding PR disasters like this?
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Re: "Where's my resolutions?" Read here!

Postby Graf Zahl » Sat Jul 21, 2018 4:15 pm

Some people here really make me question why IK should up with this pile of self-entitlement. If you think you can do it better, feel free to fork the project and do what you want to have. But then don't complain that eventually the code starts to rot away and cannot be worked with anymore.

Let's not forget that much of the system backend has been ancient ZDoom code made for computers with go several generations back. This code was absolutely unworkable and in order to implement Vulkan some sacrifices had to be made. The alternative would be to depend on an old and crusty API that one OS maker has already deprecated and stopped developing.
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