[ZDoom LE] freezing issue during keyboard/mouse input.

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[ZDoom LE] freezing issue during keyboard/mouse input.

Postby Dragon Mech » Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:47 pm

hello everyone.

i have downloaded ZDoom LE v2.8.1a (GL 1.8.4a) and am running it in an un-modified version of windows millennium.

during gameplay, zdoom LE will either stutter or freeze when i move with either the keyboard or mouse. the freezing issue is more prominent when i move the mouse.
however, the freezing is temporarily fixed after i press any maped key on the keyboard. but zdoom LE will just stutter or freeze again when i try to continue to play.
standard zdoom 2.8.1 also has this issue
for some reason, this problem does not happen when i run either zdooms from a fresh boot. it only happens when i close zdoom (LE) and restart it. or open zdoom (LE) after i have run another program before zdoom (LE).
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Re: [ZDoom LE] freezing issue during keyboard/mouse input.

Postby wildweasel » Tue Oct 17, 2017 10:12 pm

Can you tell us the exact specs of your computer?
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Re: [ZDoom LE] freezing issue during keyboard/mouse input.

Postby Dragon Mech » Tue Oct 17, 2017 10:52 pm

Tower:Etower 366 i2
OS: Windows Millennium Edition (4.90, Build 3000)
Motherboard:TriGem Florida
(Motherboard ID: 62-314E-041999-00101111-071595-440LX$FLORIDA_VERSION 1.11)
Chipset: Intel i440LX
CPU: Intel Celeron Processor Code Name "Mendocino" @500Mhz, clocked at 501.2Mhz
CPU Package: Socket 370 PPGA
RAM: 384MB SD-RAM clocked at 66MHz
2 PCI slots
2 ISA slots
2 USB 1.0 onboard ports
Drive A: 3.5 inch 1.44MB floppy drive
Drive B: 3.5 inch 1.44MB floppy drive
HDD :Westeren Digital 60GB HDD (split in to two partitions. C: and D: )
Drive E:LITE-ON CD-RW (52x write speed, 32x re-write speed, 52x read speed)
Drive F:DVD-ROM Drive
Video: ATI 3D Rage PRO intergrated AGP 2x with 4MB SGRAM video memory
DirectX: 8.1 (4.08.01.0881)
Audio: SoundBlaster Live! Value PCI SoundCard
Virtual Memory: fixed 1024MB
PS/2 mouse and keyboard
OPTi 82C861 FireLink PCI-to-USB Open Host Controller (in PCI slot)
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Re: [ZDoom LE] freezing issue during keyboard/mouse input.

Postby Graf Zahl » Wed Oct 18, 2017 1:39 am

Moved to "technical issues".

In general, I don't think it's a good idea to allow ZDoom LE bug reports as this engine is based on an older version of the source so any gameplay related bugs have no meaning for current development.
This one clearly does not qualify as a bug, though.
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Re: [ZDoom LE] freezing issue during keyboard/mouse input.

Postby Dragon Mech » Wed Oct 18, 2017 2:54 am

the whole point of the LE and 32 forks is to make a compatible and stable version of (G)ZDoom for win9x operating systems. and one of the ways to do that is to at least try to fix or patch most side affects that arise from running modern coding on a legacy OS. this means that the submition of reports that point out these issues is critical to the further development of the forks. and would you rather i break the rules and post this "side affect" report in the ZDoom LE release topic? hmm?
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Re: [ZDoom LE] freezing issue during keyboard/mouse input.

Postby Graf Zahl » Wed Oct 18, 2017 3:41 am

That doesn't change the fact that this is not being developed by the core team here but by an independent developer. It's a completely separate project. You also do not post Zandronum bugs at zdoom.org, right?
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Re: [ZDoom LE] freezing issue during keyboard/mouse input.

Postby Blue Shadow » Wed Oct 18, 2017 4:03 am

The port has a thread of its own here. Maybe try posting the issue there.
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Re: [ZDoom LE] freezing issue during keyboard/mouse input.

Postby drfrag » Wed Oct 18, 2017 6:13 am

True, these legacy ports are unofficial. Besides what Rachael said here, old GZDoom and ZDoom versions are unsupported.
Anyway bug reports for older versions will not harm and some bugs could still be present in more recent versions, there's still a lot of common code. I beg to disagree with the Zandronum comparison tough.
I think a new bugs subforum inside Legacy Discussion could be a good idea for older GZDoom and ZDoom versions.
On the issue itself i've already investigated it, it's not a bug but i've discovered an unrelated issue so the report has been useful.

@Dragon Mech:
That's a pretty cool machine you've got there. You may want to check the vogons forum on old games and hardware.
I own myself a celeron mendocino with win me installed, mine is on an intel 810 board tough. I cannot reproduce the issue, for me it works fine so must be a problem with your machine, could be a driver problem.
You could try disabling raw input entering 'norawinput 1' in the console but i don't think that will help.
Then try disabling sound, setting the sound backend to no sound. Then it would be a problem with the live drivers.
Something could be running in the background like an antivirus program or the problem could be with win me itself. I think win 98 would be more adequate for such machine.

Edit: what do you mean with "the freezing is temporarily fixed after i press any maped key on the keyboard"?
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Re: [ZDoom LE] freezing issue during keyboard/mouse input.

Postby Rachael » Wed Oct 18, 2017 10:18 am

To clarify what I said about Zandronum bugs: They should be reported to Zandronum developers first, and usually they can figure out if it is something that needs to be reported to us. Nevertheless, if said bug can be verified in GZDoom, Zandronum involvement or not, then yeah we'll fix it on our side.

The same goes for ZDoom32/LE/etc.

But Graf has a point: despite sharing a lot of the same code, reporting bugs for forks based on old versions of the code (yes, Zandy included) in the ZDF dev forums usually just causes clutter. That's not something I am willing to green light without some really good reason to.

I am willing to open a single developer forum for you after you discuss it with me if you determine that's what you really want. There are options for you to choose from - like Vogons, or even starting your own. (Wouldn't Vogons be a far more supportive community for you?) Please take that into consideration first.
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Re: [ZDoom LE] freezing issue during keyboard/mouse input.

Postby drfrag » Wed Oct 18, 2017 1:38 pm

When i was talking about bug reports for older versions i was not referring to my ports i just meant Zandro is a different animal. Anyway this issue is affecting the official latest ZDoom as well.
I think there's no need for a specific dev forum for them but still that new bugs subforum inside Legacy Discussion could be a good idea.
I also think i'm the one who is supposed to support the community and not the other way. :wink:
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Re: [ZDoom LE] freezing issue during keyboard/mouse input.

Postby Dragon Mech » Thu Oct 19, 2017 4:09 am

@drfrag:
i'll try to be detaild as i can. i would upload a video but i'm one of those poor guys that is forced to use 56K Dial-up for thier internet.

i'll start a fresh game of Doom/Doom2( it really dosen't matter which game i play as it affects zdooom itself) or i'll continue a saved game.
the game will run normally and smoothly (the music is unaffected by this issue) untell i move the mouse ore try to walk with the keyboard. at this point i'll be more detailed about the issue's behavior with the keyboard and mouse.
Keyboard:
when i try to walk or strafe with the keyboard, the game will stutter (freeze up for no more than 5 milliseconds. the music continues to play normally) as i move. if i release the key just as a stutter happens, the game will freeze but the music will continue to play normally. i will be unable to use/change a weapon, use an object (open door, activate switch etc..), access the map or open the console. if i press a movement button again, the game will unfreeze and run smoothly untell the next time it freezes or stutters.
Mouse:
when i use the mouse to turn or look up/down, the game will freeze (the stuttering only affects the keyboard) but the music will continue. as with the keyboard, i can't use/change my weapon, use an object, access the map or open the console untell i press a movement button on the keyboard. than gameplay resumes normally.

i have already gotten the win me drivers for my 3D rage pro 2x from vogons. i got the SB Live Value drivers from Creative Technologies legacy driver page.

UPDATE:
as of the time and date of writing this post i believe that my issue is caused by running a modern media player called XMPlay on Win ME before i run either standard zdoom or zdoom LE. i'm not sure if the media player is leaving something in the system buffers or what. but both zdooms work properly after i restart the computer.

further more. as a globle moderator of the forums of a different web site, i must say that i am shocked and ashamed at the way certian individuals have responded to my topic. only at one other forum site have i seen such venomous behavior towards other members. and believe it or not i've seen worse at other sites too. here i am asking for help with what i though at the time was a genuine issue with running zdoom(le) on my retro machine, but instead i see forum members taking sarcastic pot shots at each other(and some of them were down right mean) and me. and as far as my posting this topic in the bug subforum, to me it was the most logical place to post about my problem and be within the forum rules. that crack about reporting zandronum bugs here was uncalled for. i hope in the future to see a lot less hostility between forum members (and what assume are good friends).
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Re: [ZDoom LE] freezing issue during keyboard/mouse input.

Postby phantombeta » Thu Oct 19, 2017 4:31 am

No one here was being sarcastic or hostile. You're misinterpreting what everyone has said.
All Graf and Rachael were talking about was how reporting bugs for ZDoom32/LE or Zandronum would be useless 99% of the time, since the codebases are very different. (ZDoom32/LE because they're based on an outdated version, and Zandronum because it's based on an outdated version AND because frequently Zandronum bugs are either bugs already fixed in GZDoom or bugs related to its own netcode, both of which are completely useless for GZDoom)
And that's not taking into account the fact that 1: getting fixed here doesn't mean the code for the fix will work in said forks, due to the codebase being very different, and 2: Graf and Rachael don't work on any of those 3 ports. They can't do anything about bugs in them.

ZDoom32/LE bugs should be reported in their threads, and Zandronum has an entire bug tracker dedicated to it.
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Re: [ZDoom LE] freezing issue during keyboard/mouse input.

Postby Graf Zahl » Thu Oct 19, 2017 6:13 am

Dragon Mech wrote:further more. as a globle moderator of the forums of a different web site, i must say that i am shocked and ashamed at the way certian individuals have responded to my topic. only at one other forum site have i seen such venomous behavior towards other members. and believe it or not i've seen worse at other sites too. here i am asking for help with what i though at the time was a genuine issue with running zdoom(le) on my retro machine, but instead i see forum members taking sarcastic pot shots at each other(and some of them were down right mean) and me. and as far as my posting this topic in the bug subforum, to me it was the most logical place to post about my problem and be within the forum rules. that crack about reporting zandronum bugs here was uncalled for. i hope in the future to see a lot less hostility between forum members (and what assume are good friends).


1) There has been no hostility.
2) The same applies here as for any other product: If you get yourself a modified version of some product out there this essentially voids the original manufacturer's warranty.
So if you got some problem with such a product and contact the original manufacturer they'll politely tell you that they take no responsibility for said modified product and ask you to contact the one who did the actual modification.

The same applies here. It may have ZDoom in its name but effectively isn't a ZDoom release, so the original developers cannot and will not be able to help you because they are not the ones who made the product you use.
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Re: [ZDoom LE] freezing issue during keyboard/mouse input.

Postby Rachael » Thu Oct 19, 2017 6:49 am

Dragon Mech wrote:further more. as a globle moderator of the forums of a different web site, i must say that i am shocked and ashamed at the way certian individuals have responded to my topic. only at one other forum site have i seen such venomous behavior towards other members. and believe it or not i've seen worse at other sites too. here i am asking for help with what i though at the time was a genuine issue with running zdoom(le) on my retro machine, but instead i see forum members taking sarcastic pot shots at each other(and some of them were down right mean) and me. and as far as my posting this topic in the bug subforum, to me it was the most logical place to post about my problem and be within the forum rules. that crack about reporting zandronum bugs here was uncalled for. i hope in the future to see a lot less hostility between forum members (and what assume are good friends).

I applaud your efforts to read between the lines.

I do not applaud reading between the lines so much that you see something that isn't there.

No one here has been venomous whatsoever, in this thread. We are being blunt, we are being honest, but we are not being hostile. I don't know where you drew that conclusion.

Now, can you please calm down, and reread the posts as the way they were intended (i.e. not humorous, not sarcastic, not even remotely hostile)?

As a matter of fact, Graf's "joke" about posting Zandronum bugs here was not a joke at all. It was a very neutral example of why we don't just post bugs at any source port's tracker. His example could easily be reversed - we don't report GZDoom-specific bugs that have nothing to do with Zandronum on the Zandronum tracker. That's not a joke - it's a simple fact with reasoning behind it - they can't do anything about it and we're not obligated to check their tracker. The few times it does occur, or the many times that Zandronum has a GZDoom-specific bug, the user is redirected here by the Zandronum team. Again - not a joke. It's standard procedure.
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