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Re: Brutal HeXen/Heretic RPG - Version 3 Fighter Demo

PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 2:54 pm
by Kagur
Seidolon, if you like you can try implementing this two headed dragon from Gloom deluxe as part of the Swamp Wildlife (credits to Kinsie for ripping them):

Image

Either that, or a golden version of him in the dragon chapel. Personally I always felt that a lockness-monster like long necked dragon would have looked really good on the large cliffs near the swamp moat of that castle in hub three's swamp level. It would have really given a nice mysterious medieval surreal-ness that's always been part of Hexen.

Re: Brutal HeXen/Heretic RPG - Version 3 Fighter Demo

PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 3:48 pm
by Seidolon
@the95mexican
Those look pretty good so far! I'm glad you are willing to help me with this.

@Kagur
I like the idea of putting a swamp dragon/serpent in the swamp areas. However, those sprites don't look like they would fit in with the game very well, and may need a bit of editing to work in my mod. The idea of making such a colossal monster be a randomly spawning creature also isn't something that I like too much. I had some other sprites that I thought about using in this situation.
HYDRH1.png
HYDRH3H7.png

I didn't make them, but the rotations don't look too good. I might try remaking my own using the heretic ophidian's sprites. This enemy was going to be a random replacement for the stalkers, but I might just make them one of the several randomly spawning wildlife.

Re: Brutal HeXen/Heretic RPG - Version 3 Fighter Demo

PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 4:32 pm
by Valherran
I would have to agree with Seidolon about those proposed sprites, they really do not fit with the default stuff in Hexen at all...

Anyways, I have a report to give you on that Fighter Demo you released recently.

1. I noticed this time around that enemies are getting stronger as you level up, this kind of becomes a problem in the 2nd half of the game. Reason being is the monsters are getting stronger, but you, the player, are not. After while it got extremely tedious to fight monsters because of how much damage they were soaking up, and it got very dull to play by the time I got the 4th hub because of how underpowered I felt.

2. The familiar system has potential, but currently it is nearly useless due to the difficulty scaling from leveling up. The Golem barely did any damage by the time I got to the 2nd half of the game, and it died fairly easily to just a few Ettins. Again this is due to the mobs getting stronger per level, but not the player.

3. Because the mobs were getting stronger per level, mana was becoming too much of a chore to maintain. I was constantly having to transfer red mana into green mana to effectively kill the close quarter mobs with my hammer. Which by the way has little to no splash damage on it, this weapon badly needs to have the same splash damage as the Flechette but without the self damage penalty.

4. And due to the ever scaling mobs per level you gain, it rendered things like the gem mace ability useless since the enemy can get hits in far more than you can make that effective as an HP farming tool thanks to their new attack methods. I really hope the shield gets modified later on so that it can actually do its job to some to degree instead of being a small knockback tool.

5. The addition of those bats, scorpions, and spiders were interesting. But they are just too damn imbalanced to deal with. The bats and scorpions are so small and too hard to hit and they drain more HP out of me than anything else in the game, and they really should just be removed from the game. The spider was tolerable and can probably stay as a chance to spawn in place of an Ettin. In my opinion, I would add more creatures into the game that fit the game's atmosphere and balance, and modify them to spawn in place of the regular enemies. Then with some menu options, you could add in a progression style type of spawning for enemies like Project Brutality does, which I strongly recommend you incorporate all of those menu options into your mod as they are incredibly useful.

6. The hotkeys for the weapon switching is still broken, and it made kind of annoying to switch weapons in the heat of battle. Same goes for the menu, it is also still wonky on the main page of it.

7. The system in which you gain brutality bonuses could be better. Killing a dying Ettin should give you the bonus right off the bat, and as a +5 instead of a +1 per hit. +1 doesn't really do you any good in the time frame it takes to get it. Making it more of a chore than a fun thing to do, Brutal Doom got it right with its methods, I recommend you do the same here.

As for the other stuff like the addition to Red Mana and the whole level up system, it has potential, but alas it needs to be tweaked in its current state. Anyways, I will be waiting for the next demo or version to come out, and I hope you add/fix a lot of things discussed here. :-)

Re: Brutal HeXen/Heretic RPG - Version 3 Fighter Demo

PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 6:28 pm
by Kagur
Well, those are your opinion guys, although I agree that the two headed dragon needs a palette conversion more closer to Hexens.

I just think fresh monsters are needed in this new mod because most of the mods seen contain the usual Neoworm/EttinGrinder/Amuscaria(Eriance)/Realm667 sprites. If you want to make this more "unfamiliar", you'll need a bit more than different colored versions of the same monsters.

Re: Brutal HeXen/Heretic RPG - Version 3 Fighter Demo

PostPosted: Mon Mar 14, 2016 12:53 pm
by Valherran
Kagur wrote:Well, those are your opinion guys, although I agree that the two headed dragon needs a palette conversion more closer to Hexens.

I just think fresh monsters are needed in this new mod because most of the mods seen contain the usual Neoworm/EttinGrinder/Amuscaria(Eriance)/Realm667 sprites. If you want to make this more "unfamiliar", you'll need a bit more than different colored versions of the same monsters.


Bare in mind that the sprite concepts of Heretic and Hexen are heavily influenced by Todd McFarlane (creator of Spawn), which is why the green and brown serpents look like The Violator. The sprites above look like something off of the cover of a 1970's D&D manual, which does not mix, at all.

Re: Brutal HeXen/Heretic RPG - Version 3 Fighter Demo

PostPosted: Mon Mar 14, 2016 7:31 pm
by Manhs
Valherran, Exactly.

Don't go to much off topic of the art style of heretic or hexen, if not we could just make a ton of monsters who look like heavy or heroes with heavy armor like in world of warcraft, "lets add everything who look fun" method is just horrible in some mods, nothing coherent, let's keep the line of the style of the games, that's the point.

Re: Brutal HeXen/Heretic RPG - Version 3 Fighter Demo

PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2016 9:27 pm
by the95mexican
recently i made this sprite sheet of a fatality of the minotaur on the warrior but still not i finished soon I will have separate and send as an attachment until then we will see you soon :D :D :mrgreen:

Re: Brutal HeXen/Heretic RPG - Version 3 Fighter Demo

PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2016 10:48 pm
by mekanchest
Hi I played your mod and is really cool btw i found a bug in the secret level of the first hub the sevent portals, in this zone in the glass near the entrace to the stone where you put the daimon if you attack they make the sound and the animation of the break glass.http://imgur.com/qP2RiAc

Re: Brutal HeXen/Heretic RPG - Version 3 Fighter Demo

PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2016 12:32 pm
by BFG
will you be adding Ettin variants made by Rolls? (amour, helmet, sword, chainmail etc)

Re: Brutal HeXen/Heretic RPG - Version 3 Fighter Demo

PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2016 3:48 pm
by Seidolon
@the96mexican
looks really good so far. I guess I could use that if I make a version that combines the hexen and heretic players, or maybe if your summoned maulotaur gets pissed at you. :p

@mekanchest
That bug is in the original game, so I don't know how I could fix it. I'll do that in the brutalized mappack that I'm making.

@BFG
Probably not, since those sprites aren't of very good quality. I'm using a chainmail variant of the ettin, made by neoworm, which will be in the next update.

Re: Brutal HeXen/Heretic RPG - Version 3 Fighter Demo

PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2016 8:21 pm
by Carbine Dioxide
I'm not sure I like the Heretic one too much. What happened to this? It looked awesome compared to Brutal Hexen and Heretic RPG.


Re: Brutal HeXen/Heretic RPG - Version 3 Fighter Demo

PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2016 9:56 pm
by Captain J
neat project. but i've been wondered, is there will be normal death animations for exploding enemies such as serpent, gargoyle and a sabreclaw? or is some of them are already finished?

i would love to see them if you or someone manage to make them!

Re: Brutal HeXen/Heretic RPG - Version 3 Fighter Demo

PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2016 11:02 pm
by BFG
how about some different sounds for the Brown Chaos Serpent to make it sound more fierce than the green one? :)

Re: Brutal HeXen/Heretic RPG - Version 3 Fighter Demo

PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2016 11:41 pm
by mekanchest
BTW Seidolon I can help with some sprites, of animation. http://imgur.com/w2TEeZN http://imgur.com/F0HEeMh this are some examples

Re: Brutal HeXen/Heretic RPG - Version 3 Fighter Demo

PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2016 1:18 am
by Seidolon
@Carbine Dioxide
Yeah, the heretic one's kinda lame right now compared to what's in the hexen one. It's gonna be totally not-lame once it gets caught up. I have currently completed a crafting system and it will be in the next update, along with customizable stat growth and much more!
Also, that's just an unfinished attempt of an RPG gameplay mod for heretic that I started making. I never really made any progress since posting those videos. I'm probably gonna release that someday with the other dozen or so unfinished projects of mine in the hopes that somebody wants to continue it.

@Captain J
Tha would be a lot of effort to make entirely new death animations for those enemies. I'm not saying that it wouldn't be worth it, but I suck at spriting and have plenty of other aspects of this mod that I can direct my attention to instead. I'll try maybe a few, and if I can't get the hang of making them look good, then I'll have to just move on.

@BFG
I don't know if making them have different sounds would be a very good idea. Maybe just slightly edited sounds if anything.

@mekanchest
If you want to help me by creating some death animations, that would be wonderful! I would especially like it if you made some "begging" animations for some enemies, similar to the one for the ettin.