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Re: [Release] The Persecution Complex is pleased to announce

PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2010 2:05 pm
by ReX
Dancso wrote:I think I did find the secret map... it was named something like "dirty... something?" was accessible
Spoiler:

As Enjay said, it looks like you got to the portion of Map06 that is blocked, and to which you can get legitimately (i.e., without cheating). Going to the map this way is not considered finding the secret map, as you can only really play a very small portion of it. Reat the secrets.txt file for information on how to get to play the full map.

Not to worry; you don't need to play the entire game again to get to Map06. Just warp there [IDCLEV06] and begin. Maps04, 05, 06, 07, and 08 have been designed to be also playable with a pistol start as stand-alone maps. Of course, you won't be able to complete some of the key mission objectives if you play them as stand-alone maps, but then that's not why you'd be warping to the map, so it's not an issue.

Re: [Release] The Persecution Complex is pleased to announce

PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2010 3:34 pm
by DBThanatos
@Dansco: if is any consolation, I couldnt really find the legit way to get there either :P

Re: [Release] The Persecution Complex is pleased to announce

PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2010 9:50 pm
by perfectpitchrob
Finally finished the wad, and I can definitely say that not only did it live up to my expectations, but I plan on replaying it immediately, just for the atmosphere and fantastic game play.

Pros - (just a few out of a much larger list I'm sure I could come up with, but won't bother listing)

- Fantastic architecture. The giant cavernous warehouse of map 4 and the massive four story office building in map 5 stuck out the most to me. Plus, in map 8, I loved the cavern sections and the feeling of isolation.
- Excellent use of music choices for the particular scenario. (especially the sad music after Dr. Zimmerman gives you the access card)
- Realistic architecture as well as great game play. Usually the two don't mix well together, but I found that they did blend nicely.

Con -
- When there were a lot of Scientists/Barney's/etc around, (mostly in map 1), you could hear all 9 or so of them talking at once even if they were in another room behind a solid wall. (I'm sure that's just doom's limitations though)

Bug - In map 1, the first time I played, one of the random scientists was blocking the way to one of the final hallways that I needed to get through in order to progress. The hallway that's right before the elevator that takes you to map 2). After going through the areas of map 1 I'd visited numerous times, I started the game fresh and there was no scientist blocking the way anymore.

- Overall, this has become one of my favorite projects that I've played, and it was well worth the wait.

- And also -
Spoiler:

Re: [Release] The Persecution Complex is pleased to announce

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:14 am
by ReX
perfectpitchrob wrote:Finally finished the wad, and I can definitely say that not only did it live up to my expectations, but I plan on replaying it immediately, just for the atmosphere and fantastic game play..... Overall, this has become one of my favorite projects that I've played, and it was well worth the wait.

It's very kind of you to say so. Thanks.

- When there were a lot of Scientists/Barney's/etc around, (mostly in map 1), you could hear all 9 or so of them talking at once even if they were in another room behind a solid wall. (I'm sure that's just doom's limitations though)

Yes, I agree. And this becomes somewhat ridiculous when more than one scientist says the same thing together, or repeats it. We had reduced the probability of speech considerably, and I'm guessing that each time we tested the game the probability worked in our favor or we tuned out the scientist speech. We'll look into reducing the probability further.

Bug - In map 1, the first time I played, one of the random scientists was blocking the way to one of the final hallways that I needed to get through in order to progress. The hallway that's right before the elevator that takes you to map 2). After going through the areas of map 1 I'd visited numerous times, I started the game fresh and there was no scientist blocking the way anymore.

This is not technically a bug. You encountered one of the "wandering" scientists, which can sometimes stop to ponder at places that block the player's progress. If that happens, simply "using" the scientist (and, no, I don't mean that to sound the way it does; heh) will cause him to resume his wandering and get out of the way. This is definitely something that needs to go into the ReadThis.txt file

- And also -
Spoiler:

I think you meant to say "office in Map02" not "office in map 5".

I'm very glad you took the time to provide feedback. Thanks, again.

Re: [Release] The Persecution Complex is pleased to announce

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:29 am
by Enjay
perfectpitchrob wrote:Finally finished the wad, and I can definitely say that not only did it live up to my expectations, but I plan on replaying it immediately, just for the atmosphere and fantastic game play.

Thanks very much for taking the time to give feedback. It really makes a difference when people do that (good or bad). I'm glad you enjoyed it. :)

perfectpitchrob wrote:the massive four story office building in map 5

I mentioned to Rex a few times during development that I simply love playing through that bit. Not only does it look good IMO, but it is good fun to play through, wandering from room to room with plenty of cover just blasting away at the bad guys in a realistic environment. Great fun.

perfectpitchrob wrote:- Excellent use of music choices for the particular scenario. (especially the sad music after Dr. Zimmerman gives you the access card)

We were really pleased with the music that Jeff composed for us. The Zimmerman piece does seem to be a bit of a love it or hate it thing (or maybe an "I get it" versus a "WTF is that" thing). I think that it works perfectly.

perfectpitchrob wrote:- When there were a lot of Scientists/Barney's/etc around, (mostly in map 1), you could hear all 9 or so of them talking at once even if they were in another room behind a solid wall. (I'm sure that's just doom's limitations though)

As Rex said, it was something that we trimmed significantly during development but perhaps it does need to be trimmed further. The thing I keep hearing them say over and over is "this'll shake up those grand unification boys". Smug swines. There is also the possibility of adding in a few more sounds so that when a sound is played, there is a lower chance of the same one being heard. I think that there are a few more available that we didn't use.

perfectpitchrob wrote:Bug - In map 1, the first time I played, one of the random scientists was blocking the way to one of the final hallways

Rex has explained why that happened (and how to deal with it) but perhaps certain essential areas could be marked off with monster blocking lines to prevent some pathways getting blocked. Evan just a triangle of lines to stop the scientists getting too close. Of course, it would have to be somewhere that monsters didn't need to wander later on.

Re: [Release] The Persecution Complex is pleased to announce

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:49 am
by Enjay
Something that would help, or at least be of interest - system specs. Clearly there has been a range of experiences with how well Paranoid performs on different peoples' computers and more information might help identify either where problems lie or what a more realistic base line for acceptable performance is.

So, it would be nice if people could post their system specs and a brief description of how well Paranoid performed for them (anything from smooth as a baby's bottom to worse than Dr. Zimmerman trying to run through treacle).

I'll go first.

Computer 1
Processor: Intel® Core™ i7-920 (4 X 2.66GHz) 4.8GTs/8MB Cache
Graphics card: GeForce 285GTX 1GB
System memory: RAM 12GB
OS: Vista 64
Game resolution: 1920x1200
Performance: No real problems at all. The briefest of momentary stutters were noticed when loading some resources for the first time but nothing that got in the way of playing. Otherwise, very smooth. The biggest stutter I notice is just after arriving in map04 and moving forward but even that doesn't really get in the way of anything.

Computer 2
Processor: Intel® Pentium® 4 2.81 GHz
Graphics Card: GeForce 6200 256MB
System memory: RAM 1GB
OS: XP
Game resolution: 640x480
Performance: No significant problems. An occasional drop into the mid 20s frames per second during some parts of some maps (eg when moving around in the big room near the start of map04) but most of the time well over 100fps. Resource loading stutters were noticeable in a few places but not problematic. The game was playable throughout and performance did not interrupt playing at any point. ie, still very playable on this system.

Re: [Release] The Persecution Complex is pleased to announce

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:55 am
by Gez
Computer specs:
http://eu.msi.com/index.php?func=prodde ... od_no=1529

Performances: map initialization takes 15+ seconds (made me check all the "gen*" console vars to see if nodes weren't being rebuilt, but no, they're all false).
FPS is okay in play, but there are frequent stutters where the game freezes and wait a couple of seconds before returning to normal, until the next freeze...

Re: [Release] The Persecution Complex is pleased to announce

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 8:14 am
by ReX
Computer 1
Processor: Intel® Pentium™ M (1.8GHz)
Graphics card: Mobility Radeon 9000
System memory: RAM 2GB
OS: XP Professional
Game resolution: 1440x900
Performance: Most maps start fine, but start lagging very severely within a few minutes. [This sounds like it might be a memory management problem.] The warehouse in Map04 gives considerable problems, particularly when enemies are active. At a lower resolution (e.g., 640 * 400) the game plays somewhat better.

Computer 2
Processor: Intel® Core 2 Duo™ E4400 (C) DC 2.0 GHz
Graphics card: Itegrated Intel 945G
System memory: RAM 2GB
OS: Windows 7 Home Premium
Game resolution: 1440x900
Performance: Game plays smoothly throughout, but integrated graphics chipset does not support Shader Models, which means brightmaps in the game are not displayed.

Computer 3
Processor: Mobile Intel® Celeron™ M (1.5GHz)
Graphics card: Mobility Radeon
System memory: RAM 512MB
OS: XP Home
Game resolution: 1024x768
Performance: Most maps start fine, but start lagging very severely within a few minutes. [This sounds like it might be a memory management problem.] At a lower resolution (e.g., 640 * 400) the game plays somewhat better.

Re: [Release] The Persecution Complex is pleased to announce

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 8:29 am
by Enjay
Gez wrote:Performances: map initialization takes 15+ seconds

:shock: I know you said it was bad but I didn't think you meant that bad. 15 seconds is an exceptionally long time to wait. I'm not sure that I have ever had to wait that long for a map to load in Doom. What do you think might be causing that? What happens of you warp to a map, warp away and come back - does the second visit load noticeably quicker (ie is it down to resources and do the resources get cached and remain so for the second visit)?

Re: [Release] The Persecution Complex is pleased to announce

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 8:53 am
by Enjay
Well, I just tried my wife's computer which is a bit of a slug and tends to perform worse than its specs would indicate. Although it is newer than my old machine, it generally doesn't give such good performance and is usually regarded as the slowest machine in the house.

Dell Inspiron 530
Processor: Intel® Core™ DuoCPU E4500 @ 2.20GHz
System memory: 1.18GHz 1.99GB RAM
Graphics card: Integrated Intel® G33/G31 Express Chipset
OS: XP Home
Game resolution: 1440x900
I played as far as half way through map04 and, despite looking fairly U.G.L.Y. thanks to the intel graphics performance was acceptable. There were noticeable stutters when a lot of new resources came into view but, once that had happened, the game performed well enough. Frame rate values occasionally dropped but never enough to make things unplayable and most of the time they were definitely in the acceptable range of well over 50 and sometimes much higher. Map loading time was quick - less than 1 second.

I could test my kids' machines but both of them should out perform the one above so there is little point.

Re: [Release] The Persecution Complex is pleased to announce

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 10:13 am
by Dancso
My comp specs:

Processor: AMD Athlon 64 x2 4000+
Graphics card: ATI HD 4730 (512mb)
Memory: 3GB (2x512MB+2x1GB)
OS: Windows XP Professional
Resolution: 1280x1024
Performance: Pretty smooth except for some random areas at which FPS dropped below 30, but was still very much playable. The first autosave/regular save takes several seconds to finish but that's not really related to this, as I get the same time to load up doom 2 map02. :blergh:

The fact that i had 4x Antialiasing on (via ATI's catalyst control center) and I think adaptive antialiasing was on aswell, could have been the reason of the occasional lower FPS. Actually... I'm not sure what's the cause of it. Might be just the loading of resources. (I have precache textures on)

Re: [Release] The Persecution Complex is pleased to announce

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 3:19 pm
by chronoteeth
Well, I just got a run through, and to be perfectly honest I just dont think it feels fun. The technical aspects and the little attention to details are impressive and even groundbreaking, but the clash of styles (models and sprite rips especially), repetitive architecture, uninteresting battles, and pacing just bring it down a lot. Its immersive and impressive, but personally I just find that it tries too hard to be a combination of a doom and half life experiences, but it just ends up not doing too well at both. Sorry enjay, it really is a great technical marvel, but personally, it plays erratically and just not too well. <:c

Re: [Release] The Persecution Complex is pleased to announce

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 3:38 pm
by Enjay
Oh well, thanks for giving the game a try and for your feedback anyway. It's a shame that you don't like it but if we all liked the same stuff it would be a boring world eh? ;)

Re: [Release] The Persecution Complex is pleased to announce

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 3:47 pm
by chronoteeth
True that! Besides, varied opinions and criticism makes everything much better the next time. I guess im an immersion junkie, haha. Can't wait to see what you release next though, your other stuff was baller. Just dont let it slip up with this one sir D:

Re: [Release] The Persecution Complex is pleased to announce

PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 4:24 pm
by Enjay
Just to be clear, Paranoid is not just my release. It was very much a team effort headed up by the good captain Rex (though he keeps denying that there was any kind of rank within the team).

Personally, I don't think there was any "slip" in this one at all. It's pretty much exactly what I (and I think we) hoped it would be. However, what it is, is a bit different to the style of many Doom mods. We always knew that would be something that might make it not to some people's tastes but we accepted that as part of how it would be received.