Hexen: Walpurgis 0.91 (For Doom/Heretic/Hexen)

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Re: Hexen: Walpurgis 0.91 (For Doom/Heretic/Hexen) New Relea

Postby PresBarackbar » Thu Dec 03, 2020 6:04 pm

I know Walp is not specifically compatible with monster mods now but it'd be cool if it could be used with Mellow Heretic. It works for the most part, the only thing Ive noticed is discs of repulsion turn into Disciple sprites
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Re: Hexen: Walpurgis 0.91 (For Doom/Heretic/Hexen) New Relea

Postby eharper256 » Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:28 am

Lagi wrote:Waiting to test new animal form.

I want offer to do the "bear" white paws, but Im busy with other drawings. Would you be interested in help here or you good?

There are no plans for me to add in extra animal forms right now, but I could add polar bear paws as alternate art for the Wolf Form if you want to make them and they're good. You will obviously be credited if I use them (like SallazarSpellcaster got credited for updating the Myrm's boot), but don't force yourself on my behalf.

PresBarackbar wrote:I know Walp is not specifically compatible with monster mods now but it'd be cool if it could be used with Mellow Heretic. It works for the most part, the only thing Ive noticed is discs of repulsion turn into Disciple sprites

This would be because the sprites of the Disc use the prefix "DSCR" as a shortened 'DiscR'. Disciples normally use "WZRD" for 'Wizard' but I guess Mellow must have chosen to use the same "DSCR" for 'DiscipleR' for some reason?
In most of my newer sprites I've started making the sprites named in L33T to prevent obvious conflicts (lol) so I guess I could make it D5CR or D15C in the next update if @Lagi doesn't want to change it himself.

Alternatively you can also change it yourself in SLADE pretty easily; change the sprite name in Spawners.txt on this section:
Code: Select allExpand view
// Disc of Repulsion Upgrade: Much better than before!!
actor ArtiBlastRadiusW : ArtiBlastRadius replaces ArtiBlastRadius
{
   Inventory.PickupSound "Pickup/Gem"
   Inventory.PickupMessage "\c[white]A \c[gold]Disc of Force\c[white] from times of old..."
   Inventory.UseSound "SStaff"
   Inventory.InterHubAmount 20
   Inventory.MaxAmount 20
   States
   {
      Spawn:
         DSCR ABCDEFGH 4 Bright
         Loop
      Use:
         FORD A 0 A_Blast(0,350,350,30,"BlastEffectNew","BlastRadius")
   }
}

^ Change the "DSCR" in the 'Spawn' section to something different in 4 letters. And then rename all the disc sprites in the /Sprites/Doom Compatibility/ directory to match your new names (keeping the A0 through H0 at the end) and save it. Done.
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Re: Hexen: Walpurgis 0.91 (For Doom/Heretic/Hexen) New Relea

Postby Lagi » Fri Dec 04, 2020 10:03 am

In Mellow Heretic i changed the Disciple sprite names (to WIZR, WIZS), need to dl again should be fine

I need 2x set of alphabet so i use DSCP and DSCR (as next letter).

I was thinking about animal form:
  • Druid cut her forearm with the amulet
  • she start growing (hight view increase point by point)
  • [sound] her pain scream change into wild beast roar, as her hands change into bear paws
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Re: Hexen: Walpurgis 0.91 (For Doom/Heretic/Hexen) New Relea

Postby PresBarackbar » Sat Dec 05, 2020 12:19 am

Thanks Lagi! It works great now. Super fun to play Baratus and tear up the Heretic monsters!
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Re: Hexen: Walpurgis 0.91 (For Doom/Heretic/Hexen) New Relea

Postby eharper256 » Sat Dec 05, 2020 3:28 am

Lagi wrote:In Mellow Heretic i changed the Disciple sprite names (to WIZR, WIZS), need to dl again should be fine

I need 2x set of alphabet so i use DSCP and DSCR (as next letter).

PresBarackbar wrote:Thanks Lagi! It works great now. Super fun to play Baratus and tear up the Heretic monsters!

Sweet, thanks for the update. I will still update it my end eventually as well just in the off chance.

Lagi wrote:I was thinking about animal form:
  • Druid cut her forearm with the amulet
  • she start growing (hight view increase point by point)
  • [sound] her pain scream change into wild beast roar, as her hands change into bear paws

  • Cutting herself for a transform is pretty edgy :lol: and would imply damage to HP, mind, which I wouldn't want as a penalty for using the transform.
  • Growing height is something I wanted to do, but its not done to ensure Doom levels still work (in my original tests of getting 0.7 to work in Doom, I had to reduce all the default heights for the Hexen characters as Doomguy is a short-ass, and there are quite a few levels you end up having to crouch to get through basic doors!). I guess we could nudge the viewport up a couple of units, but its not very dramatic when I tried it.
  • If you want to mux a new sound for her I can send you a link to her original voice pack if you like though.
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Re: Hexen: Walpurgis 0.91 (For Doom/Heretic/Hexen) New Relea

Postby Lagi » Sat Dec 05, 2020 5:19 am

eharper256 wrote:
  • Cutting herself for a transform is pretty edgy :lol: and would imply damage to HP, mind, which I wouldn't want as a penalty for using the transform.

this would be nice gameplay detail, -1 hp/transform (unless you switch quickly back to another weapon, and not chance to kill self)

eharper256 wrote:
  • Growing height is something I wanted to do, but its not done to ensure Doom levels still work (in my original tests of getting 0.7 to work in Doom, I had to reduce all the default heights for the Hexen characters as Doomguy is a short-ass, and there are quite a few levels you end up having to crouch to get through basic doors!). I guess we could nudge the viewport up a couple of units, but its not very dramatic when I tried it.

  • this would be godlike gameplay feature! Having to crouch to go through the door! I already feel the size of the beast :twisted:

    plus i believe wolf move way faster when they not in bipedal position.

    eharper256 wrote:
  • If you want to mux a new sound for her I can send you a link to her original voice pack if you like though.

  • i sucks at music. more often than not I play games mute.
    send it anyway, it can stay in PM.

    oh oh ... and when you in animal form... "the ground tremble with every step"
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    Re: Hexen: Walpurgis 0.91 (For Doom/Heretic/Hexen) New Relea

    Postby eharper256 » Sun Dec 06, 2020 4:24 am

    Lagi wrote:this would be godlike gameplay feature! Having to crouch to go through the door! I already feel the size of the beast :twisted:
    oh oh ... and when you in animal form... "the ground tremble with every step"

    You're just quoting Heart of Demons: Baron features you like now, right? :lol:

    Lagi wrote:i sucks at music. more often than not I play games mute.

    That's honestly quite unfortunate; audio adds alot to an experience. I'm also completely lacking in rhythm and couldn't be musician if I tried, but I know how important it is to the experience, so I've done alot of Audacity work on Walpurgis to make things sound good.
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    Re: Hexen: Walpurgis 0.91 (For Doom/Heretic/Hexen) New Relea

    Postby Blackgrowl » Mon Dec 07, 2020 5:13 am

    Hey, I was wondering, and sorry if this was answered already some time ago if so, I've forgotten, but anyway...
    Are universal kicks planned?

    I know the Myrmidon has a kick as one of the three-punch combo attacks, but I still think having a dedicated key that makes you kick would be a great idea.
    You can even make it unique for each class, for example;
    Warrior can do "Drop Kick", which makes enemies get knocked down as well as a strong momentum. Also, his kicks deal more damage, he was trained for this! He ought to make enemies reach more than 4 metres.
    Crusader can make a slower kick (leg plate armor is no joke) but has a high chance to stun the enemy (for perhaps 3 seconds?), next hit will remove that stun though. Knockback is normal, should be as high as 1 metre and as low as 0.2
    Mage can do very low-damage dealing kung-fu-ish fast kicks, with a tiny chance for an elemental effect or at the very least freeze. Maybe a "combo kick" is better? Let's just say that he's also a Monk, or his kicks (legs) are magical, heh!
    No idea for the druid though, sorry.

    I'd love to see if you like this idea and can make it, I would be absolutely happy if so.

    By the way, I love how update 0.91 is merely 0.91 despite being a rather big one :lol:
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    Re: Hexen: Walpurgis 0.91 (For Doom/Heretic/Hexen) New Relea

    Postby Blackgrowl » Mon Dec 07, 2020 5:25 am

    Hey, thought you might wanna know; Doom Commandos don't have a "randomizer" for their trails, vertically that is.

    I consider this a bug because they now can't hit me when there is a tiny barrier they can easily get past, maybe it's good, because this is "tactical cover", but that's not what Doom is about and---I swear it's easy to avoid shooting that barrier even if you're a dumb old zombie.

    Here's a picture:
    https://imgur.com/a/f9I7nlL
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    Re: Hexen: Walpurgis 0.91 (For Doom/Heretic/Hexen) New Relea

    Postby eharper256 » Mon Dec 07, 2020 7:48 am

    Blackgrowl wrote:Hey, I was wondering, and sorry if this was answered already some time ago if so, I've forgotten, but anyway...
    Are universal kicks planned?

    I don't think its been mentioned before that I remember.

    Its an iconic Brutal Doom feature that I enjoy for sure, but I'm not sure if it has a huge place in Hexen, at least not directly as the mighty foot.

    I will certainly consider adding it for the Myrm, mind you, as you say, its quite relevant for him and he has a unique sprite that might as well be abused for it. It would have to go on the 'Zoom' button in GZDoom which is a bit odd, mind.

    Whilst I love my Kung-Fu Wizards from the Fate Stay Night franchise as much as any anime nerd, Daedolon doesn't strike me as one of them. :lol: So if I added a similar feature to the Crusader, Magister and Druid, it would instead be a Shield-Bash, Force Blast, and Knife Throw respectively. Which could be cool, so I'll consider that.

    Blackgrowl wrote:By the way, I love how update 0.91 is merely 0.91 despite being a rather big one :lol:

    Yeah, its funny you noticed that. :lol: Its because I'm running out of space between now and 1.0, which I want to be a mostly feature-complete version. Hahaha.

    Blackgrowl wrote:Hey, thought you might wanna know; Doom Commandos don't have a "randomizer" for their trails, vertically that is.

    I consider this a bug because they now can't hit me when there is a tiny barrier they can easily get past, maybe it's good, because this is "tactical cover", but that's not what Doom is about and---I swear it's easy to avoid shooting that barrier even if you're a dumb old zombie.

    Mmm, they don't, because it looks really weird if they do, with bullets coming from above and below their chaingun due to how projectiles work in Doom.

    Its obviously not noticeable if you have a hitscan, but its very much so if you have tracers. If lots of people feel its a problem, I might have to see if the projectile itself can give itself some Z velocity randomisation in its first frame; though that will lead the shots to be really inaccurate at long range, which completely nerfs maps that abuse the old 'chaingunner turret' effect.

    Which honestly I see as a positive because I hate them, but I didn't want to mess with the Doom menagerie balance that far either because its really easy to notice that kind of thing and completely warps the map makers intentions, sinister as they may be. :shock:
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    Re: Hexen: Walpurgis 0.91 (For Doom/Heretic/Hexen) New Relea

    Postby Blackgrowl » Tue Dec 08, 2020 4:00 am

    eharper256 wrote:
    Blackgrowl wrote:Hey, I was wondering, and sorry if this was answered already some time ago if so, I've forgotten, but anyway...
    Are universal kicks planned?

    I don't think its been mentioned before that I remember.

    Its an iconic Brutal Doom feature that I enjoy for sure, but I'm not sure if it has a huge place in Hexen, at least not directly as the mighty foot.

    I will certainly consider adding it for the Myrm, mind you, as you say, its quite relevant for him and he has a unique sprite that might as well be abused for it. It would have to go on the 'Zoom' button in GZDoom which is a bit odd, mind.

    Whilst I love my Kung-Fu Wizards from the Fate Stay Night franchise as much as any anime nerd, Daedolon doesn't strike me as one of them. :lol: So if I added a similar feature to the Crusader, Magister and Druid, it would instead be a Shield-Bash, Force Blast, and Knife Throw respectively. Which could be cool, so I'll consider that.


    Yeah! That's actually much, much better; instead of "universal kicks" it's "universal melees", all meant to deal less damage but also give a knockback and a special effect fit for every class. I like it.

    Only problem I see is the Knife Throw, how is that gonna be a "deal less damage but push back" attack? Either way, it's still unique.
    I don't think "The knives are blunt" is a good excuse if you were thinking about that, by the way :oops:

    And no, it's not odd at all that it goes to GZDoom's "Zoom" button, that one is nearly always used as the "Quick Melee" button for many other WADs.

    eharper256 wrote:Mmm, they don't, because it looks really weird if they do, with bullets coming from above and below their chaingun due to how projectiles work in Doom.

    Its obviously not noticeable if you have a hitscan, but its very much so if you have tracers. If lots of people feel its a problem, I might have to see if the projectile itself can give itself some Z velocity randomisation in its first frame; though that will lead the shots to be really inaccurate at long range, which completely nerfs maps that abuse the old 'chaingunner turret' effect.

    Which honestly I see as a positive because I hate them, but I didn't want to mess with the Doom menagerie balance that far either because its really easy to notice that kind of thing and completely warps the map makers intentions, sinister as they may be. :shock:


    I myself would consider to make that an option, but...I also hate options, especially too many options (Unless they are good/necessary, like GZDoom's itself, I do actually love how this source port has a variety of options)
    You could probably make it so it only works on difficulty 4 and 5? I mean, when anybody plays Difficulty 4, especially 5, they're just begging for sadomasochist pain. I know I am. Nothing wrong with making it extra-difficult then, including a surprise.

    But yeah, a poll would be better instead, if anything this must be a very rare "bug", I doubt many people noticed it, I might as well be the first and only.
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    Re: Hexen: Walpurgis 0.91 (For Doom/Heretic/Hexen) New Relea

    Postby eharper256 » Wed Dec 09, 2020 3:11 am

    Blackgrowl wrote:Only problem I see is the Knife Throw, how is that gonna be a "deal less damage but push back" attack? Either way, it's still unique.
    I don't think "The knives are blunt" is a good excuse if you were thinking about that, by the way :oops:

    I'd be more surprised if someone didn't reel backwards from a knife to the gut, honestly. :D

    That said, this one would also change to a punch or kick whilst in wolf form, of course. It would be cool to have a temporary partial-transform for a wolf paw I suppose, but that would make the animation really long which is unsuitable for a quick melee. :shock:
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    Re: Hexen: Walpurgis 0.91 (For Doom/Heretic/Hexen) New Relea

    Postby eharper256 » Fri Dec 11, 2020 11:52 pm

    Here's the new help/hints screen!
    Image
    There will also be a specific help page covering the classes features specifically. Let me know what you all think!
    Last edited by eharper256 on Sat Dec 12, 2020 6:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
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    Re: Hexen: Walpurgis 0.91 (For Doom/Heretic/Hexen) New Relea

    Postby Lagi » Sat Dec 12, 2020 2:20 am

    I need to know how many keys i need to bind, so alt and reload. Not zoom f.ex. or user 3.

    Info that walp is compatible with doom and heretic is valid for first timers.

    Arrow 3 and 4 are too long. Lots of people might don't even speak English (yes when I was a kid I was playing heretic like that).

    Arrow 5 is very good i need that info.

    Last 2x arrows are not needed
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    Re: Hexen: Walpurgis 0.91 (For Doom/Heretic/Hexen) New Relea

    Postby eharper256 » Sat Dec 12, 2020 4:46 am

    Lagi wrote:I need to know how many keys i need to bind, so alt and reload. Not zoom f.ex. or user 3.

    Yeah, I'll add in alt-fire as well; though that is default-bound to RMB in GZDoom.

    Lagi wrote:Info that walp is compatible with doom and heretic is valid for first timers.

    Arrow 3 and 4 are too long. Lots of people might don't even speak English (yes when I was a kid I was playing heretic like that).

    Less ruminating on my opinions then, haha.

    Lagi wrote:Last 2x arrows are not needed

    That one is for people who have never played a Hexen mod before but I guess its fairly redundant.

    Its helpful to get opinions on this though; there are things I wouldn't otherwise think of; since I'm both the author and a native English speaker with an English degree (lol), so all thoughts about what would be helpful are appreciated.
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