Doom Rebalanced - A simple vanilla-styled rebalance mod

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Doom Rebalanced - A simple vanilla-styled rebalance mod

Postby Boondorl » Wed Jan 16, 2019 5:43 am

Current version: Beta 4 - http://www.mediafire.com/file/du0ecls618yyast/Doom+Rebalanced+Beta+4.pk3

Previous versions:
Spoiler:

Tested on: GZDoom v3.7.2 (Make sure to update to at least this version! Fixes an aiming problem on certain enemies.)

While Doom is probably my favorite shooter of all time, I've had my gripes with some of its gameplay. The Cyberdemon and Spider Mastermind are too easy to kill, certain weapons aren't as satisfying as they could be, hitscan is annoying, partial invisibility just is, etc. So, instead of sitting around with a bunch of "what ifs" in my head, I decided to implement a lot of the changes I'd like to see. And thus, we have Doom Rebalanced, a mod that aims to tweak some aspects of the game without adding features like new weapons, enemy attacks, etc.

While these are all changes I like, I'd love to get feedback on certain aspects. That includes:

  • Bugs - I want to make sure I don't leave the game more broken than how I started.
  • Feedback on current changes - Maybe you feel the BFG is too strong? Or perhaps Revenants are just too annoying now. Let me know so I can make some tweaks. While this is a project I'm mainly doing for myself, I'm ultimately curious in what you guys think.
  • Future suggestions - Got an idea you'd like to see in the game? Let me know and I'll see what I can do.
There's no images to show here because, well, it's just Doom with some tweaks. You already know what it looks like. However, you do probably want a change log.

Note: A GLDEF lump is also included to make sure all the new projectiles/enemies glow properly. I'll be separating this into its own pk3 at release so that it can be used optionally.

The shotgun is currently not able to use custom sounds due to the way weapon switching can cut it off. However, an option that can be used at your own risk may be added if wanted.

A version without the Wolfenstein SS will be released at launch to allow old WADs that used the dehacked method of replacing enemies to not break.

If you're using GZDoom's althud, make sure to switch back to normal or armor won't display.

Until then, make sure to report any weird issues with either if there are any.

Beta 4 change log:
Spoiler:

Beta 3 change log:
Spoiler:

Beta 2 change log:
Spoiler:

Beta 1 change log:
Spoiler:

Credits:
Spoiler:

Enjoy! My final semester just started for me so it's going to be a busy workload for the next 3 months. I'm not sure how often I'll be able to update it, but I'll try and get tweaks out in a somewhat timely manner.
Last edited by Boondorl on Fri Jan 25, 2019 1:55 pm, edited 6 times in total.
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Re: Doom Rebalanced - A simple vanilla-styled rebalance mod

Postby TheNoob_Gamer » Wed Jan 16, 2019 10:51 am

For some reasons, the chaingun felt too OP for me, I could easily clear a zombiefied room with only 5-7 seconds without taking damage. Can you please nerf the firerate a bit?
Also, will this get Smooth Doom-compatible?
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Re: Doom Rebalanced - A simple vanilla-styled rebalance mod

Postby Get Phobo » Wed Jan 16, 2019 7:50 pm

Man, this all sounds highly interesting. Just this one thing makes me wonder:
Certain health and armor items are no longer always picked up. This includes:
•Health bonuses unless below 200 health
•Armor bonuses unless below 200 armor
•Beserk packs unless the player hasn't picked one up yet or is below 100 health
•Soulspheres unless below 200 health
•Megaspheres unless below 200 health or armor
•To compensate, none of these items are now counted towards the item score
If you cannot pickup any more health or armor bonuses once you've reached 199%, then how could it even be possible to get to, or over, 200%?
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Re: Doom Rebalanced - A simple vanilla-styled rebalance mod

Postby Dklark » Wed Jan 16, 2019 9:45 pm

Great stuff Boondorl. Really enjoying the projectile based weapons instead of hitscan. From a cursory few bits of testing, the first weird issue that jumps out to me is that the pistol firing sprite has become very abnormal and hideous. Missing entire frames. This probably stems from increasing its firing rate. Would really appreciate it if you could get a handle on it or find an alternative way to modify the rate of fire without breaking the animation.
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Re: Doom Rebalanced - A simple vanilla-styled rebalance mod

Postby Boondorl » Thu Jan 17, 2019 4:20 am

TheNoob_Gamer wrote:For some reasons, the chaingun felt too OP for me, I could easily clear a zombiefied room with only 5-7 seconds without taking damage. Can you please nerf the firerate a bit?
Also, will this get Smooth Doom-compatible?

The Chaingun is the one weapon I was most worried. I was hoping the inaccuracy would help balance it out a bit but it's a monster in close quarters when it comes to clearing rooms. I might drop its fire rate to match the Plasma Rifle's and tweak pain chance a little on enemies to dial it back.

I'll likely just port over the Smooth Doom stuff and add it as an option in the future. That's unfortunately the only way to add compatibility like that since this mod pretty much replaces everything.

Get Phobo wrote:If you cannot pickup any more health or armor bonuses once you've reached 199%, then how could it even be possible to get to, or over, 200%?

Keep in mind that Doom has functionality built-in to make sure you don't go over the threshold. If you have 199% armor and pick up an armor bonus, the game will only increase your armor by 1% to reach 200%. The inability to pick it up only occurs when you reach the actual threshold value (200 in this case).

Dklark wrote:From a cursory few bits of testing, the first weird issue that jumps out to me is that the pistol firing sprite has become very abnormal and hideous. Missing entire frames. This probably stems from increasing its firing rate. Would really appreciate it if you could get a handle on it or find an alternative way to modify the rate of fire without breaking the animation.

Ha, that's exactly why the animation is broken at the moment. I'll be experimenting around with it more to make it less hideous since it's a weapon actually worth using now. :lol:
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Re: Doom Rebalanced - A simple vanilla-styled rebalance mod

Postby Dklark » Thu Jan 17, 2019 11:23 am

Thanks for the reply. I have my own view on the chaingun, TheNoob_Gamer doesn't speak for everyone :). I actually quite enjoy the way the chaingun is now. I think the inaccuracy does balance it out nicely as its effectiveness drops off sharply at a distance where the pistol can take up its slack and actually serve a function for once instead of being rendered useless by it. This more nuanced dynamic is much more balanced and enjoyable imo. I also think the current chaingun doubles as some help against slaughter maps where enemies are so numerous you cant help but fire point blank.

TL;DR I like the way the chaingun functions currently, hope you don't nerf it :P
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Re: Doom Rebalanced - A simple vanilla-styled rebalance mod

Postby Get Phobo » Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:04 pm

The chaingun should have the same accuracy as per default, or perhaps even better. Compare this, for a very rough example, to a real-life M134D minigun. It has an accuracy of 87 out of 200 rounds (43.5% accuracy) as shot from 300 meters distance at a 3x6 ft large target, see this video.

In Doom, that distance would be equal to almost 11,000 map units, and the M134D would still manage to hit a target the size of the doom guy with a probability of more than 40%.

In map 01, if you go to the window opposite the exit and take a look into the outside area, the surrounding wall you can see behind the water is almost eight times nearer than that, at around 1,300 map units. I'd say, it should be possible to hit a target the size of an imp with almost perfect accuracy here.
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Re: Doom Rebalanced - A simple vanilla-styled rebalance mod

Postby Thedarkcube » Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:47 pm

i kind of wish you would add reload to some of the weapons but since it is a balance mod and not a realism mod i can appreciate what you did
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Re: Doom Rebalanced - A simple vanilla-styled rebalance mod

Postby Whoah » Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:55 pm

Oh shit, this is a neat little mod! I've always dug rebalance mods like this. I do have a suggestion regarding the plasma rifle that I've always wanted to see in this sort of mod: Slower rate of fire, but stronger projectiles that either have deal a small amount of splash damage, or higher damage in general. I think this could help define the plasma rifle as it's own thing, rather than just a chaingun replacement. I think it would make it feel much more satisfying to use, as well.
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Re: Doom Rebalanced - A simple vanilla-styled rebalance mod

Postby Boondorl » Fri Jan 18, 2019 9:59 am

Beta 2 is out! A quick update to some of the more problematic aspects so far. Change log in the main post. Some thoughts on some of the changes:

  • I opted to drop the Chaingun's damage down as opposed to lowering the fire rate since I don't find it as satisfying when it fires slower. My ideal role for it would be for fighting medium enemies in close quarters (to make good use of the stuns) and for clearing rooms of smaller enemies like Grunts and Sergeants. Slowing down the fire rate would make it little more than a crappier Plasma Rifle so I'm trying to give it a defined purpose. Hopefully the hit to the ammo economy and time to kill will balance it out a bit better.
  • I tweaked the explosion on Pain Elementals by lowering the damage significantly alongside the range (to compensate I removed damage fall-off so it actually deals damage). I did some testing and found it works out pretty well. The only way to take damage from it is by intentionally body-blocking them since the radius isn't big enough to damage anything nearby when walls block it. These changes should hopefully make them far more forgiving to fight in small areas without readding the ability to exploit them.
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Re: Doom Rebalanced - A simple vanilla-styled rebalance mod

Postby Dklark » Sat Jan 19, 2019 2:54 pm

Boondorl wrote:Beta 2 is out! A quick update to some of the more problematic aspects so far. Change log in the main post. Some thoughts on some of the changes:

  • I opted to drop the Chaingun's damage down as opposed to lowering the fire rate since I don't find it as satisfying when it fires slower. My ideal role for it would be for fighting medium enemies in close quarters (to make good use of the stuns) and for clearing rooms of smaller enemies like Grunts and Sergeants. Slowing down the fire rate would make it little more than a crappier Plasma Rifle so I'm trying to give it a defined purpose. Hopefully the hit to the ammo economy and time to kill will balance it out a bit better.
  • I tweaked the explosion on Pain Elementals by lowering the damage significantly alongside the range (to compensate I removed damage fall-off so it actually deals damage). I did some testing and found it works out pretty well. The only way to take damage from it is by intentionally body-blocking them since the radius isn't big enough to damage anything nearby when walls block it. These changes should hopefully make them far more forgiving to fight in small areas without readding the ability to exploit them.


Thanks for the update. One thing though. Not too fond of the sound replacement choices for the shotgun, I read the changelog and understand why you did it. I replaced them with de-coupled vanilla versions.

if you would like to include them in your future updates. Just pm me

Speaking of the changelog, Really loving the 'pseudo magazine' and reload cancel system on the shotties, but don't really like the note that comes with it:

"Note: Currently these weapons won't be skipped in the weapon cycle if they're out of ammo"

This little note kind of breaks the game, for instance, when I run out of ammo with my pistol while already having ran out of shot-shells, It autoswitches to the empty shotgun, Not the fist. Leading to accidental deaths.

Finally, firing the pistol quickly seems really inconsistant, what I mean by that is it doesn't register every click I make. It'll skip between a few and feels really awkward to shoot.

All in all, good update. This little number is really coming together. Look forward to seeing more from ya.

Oh yeah, thanks for not nerfing the chaingun to oblivion. 8-)
Last edited by Dklark on Tue Jan 22, 2019 6:32 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Doom Rebalanced - A simple vanilla-styled rebalance mod

Postby Boondorl » Sat Jan 19, 2019 10:52 pm

Good stuff with the shotgun sounds!

The shotgun issue is caused by the fact that AmmoUse is 0 meaning weapon select always views the weapons as available to fire. I'll be implementing my own version of picking a new weapon to account for this. I didn't realize it would be an issue until I awkwardly came across it while playing Scythe 2 and can hopefully have it fixed up here soon.

I find the Pistol can be a bit unresponsive if you tap fire in the awkward middle ground between holding and spamming. I'm actually abusing the Hold state to check if the player held down their shot or not so maybe I can find something a bit better. If there's a way to check if the player is holding the attack button that would solve the issue quickly.
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Re: Doom Rebalanced - A simple vanilla-styled rebalance mod

Postby Boondorl » Tue Jan 22, 2019 2:15 pm

Beta 3 is here! Includes some fixes for weapon swapping (including those pesky shotgun issues), improvements towards the Pistol, and the options menu. Quite a few things to tweak in it, but some highlights are:

  • Vanilla or rebalanced style armor system and BFG
  • Enemies and/or player RNG damage toggles
  • Turning off damage from blocked Lost Soul spawns from Pain Elementals
  • Hitscan toggles for player melee/weapons and hitscan enemies

Make sure to let me know of any options you'd like to see added.
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Re: Doom Rebalanced - A simple vanilla-styled rebalance mod

Postby Boondorl » Tue Jan 22, 2019 4:15 pm

Quick hotfix put out to fix Lost Souls when RNG damage is turned on. Make sure to redownload it if you already downloaded beta 3.
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Re: Doom Rebalanced - A simple vanilla-styled rebalance mod

Postby Dklark » Tue Jan 22, 2019 6:01 pm

Really exceptional work here. Can't play without it. Just gets better and better with each update, love that the pistol is nice and responsive. Great work Boondorl.

A few bugs I have yet to mention are due to the Summonfriend command. Summonfriend Archvile for instance would crash the game, along with a bunch of others e.g.summonfriend chaingunguy and summonfriend doomimp.

Not gamebreaking bugs per se, but ones I've noticed nonetheless. Thanks for the steady updates. Really enjoy what you've done so far. :D
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