Netronian Chaos V.3.57: The Final, Last, Concluding Update

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Captain J
 
 
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Re: Netronian Chaos V.3: Cosmic Adventures With no Tendencie

Post by Captain J »

Don't know what caused such problem, but i'm sure Insight's right. You should've checked the First Page;
Captain J wrote:P.S: Do not get confused with Default ZDoom Drop Weapons key and the mod's Drop key. They're completely different and pressing Default one will cause the error. Press F1 for Help.
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Re: Netronian Chaos V.3: Cosmic Adventures With no Tendencie

Post by IDKrisis »

I've been having a go at playing with this mod with the map pack "Community Chest 2". I'm finding it incredibly hard. I'm only four levels in and I am completely overwhelmed. A full clip of ammunition in my most powerful weapon is not enough to fight off even a small group of enemies, and they can easily kill me in the time it takes to reload. By far the deadliest enemies I have so far encountered are the small, flying robots, which I've come to dread far more than the big, walking tanks.

I'm not actually sure what's wrong. I don't know whether its a balance problem with the mod, or whether its something about the way its meant to be played. All of the weapons seem too weak to be useful. Even the bombs barely make a dent in the enemy ranks. I keep running out of ammunition. Am I doing something wrong, or does this need to be fixed?
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Re: Netronian Chaos V.3: Cosmic Adventures With no Tendencie

Post by Gorec »

do weapons that has armor piercing in their description deal more damage to armored enemies such as tanks?
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Re: Netronian Chaos V.3: Cosmic Adventures With no Tendencie

Post by Captain J »

Nope. But still effective thanks to its hefty damage.
IDKrisis wrote:I've been having a go at playing with this mod with the map pack "Community Chest 2". I'm finding it incredibly hard. I'm only four levels in and I am completely overwhelmed. A full clip of ammunition in my most powerful weapon is not enough to fight off even a small group of enemies, and they can easily kill me in the time it takes to reload. By far the deadliest enemies I have so far encountered are the small, flying robots, which I've come to dread far more than the big, walking tanks.

I'm not actually sure what's wrong. I don't know whether its a balance problem with the mod, or whether its something about the way its meant to be played. All of the weapons seem too weak to be useful. Even the bombs barely make a dent in the enemy ranks. I keep running out of ammunition. Am I doing something wrong, or does this need to be fixed?
Seems like the Map Pack you're running with NC, Community Chest 2 has some problem of narrow areas filled with hordes and such. Sadly the whole gameplay balance really depends on what map pack you're running with. You'll have to lower the difficulty if it's hard for you.

However i can tell you about some tips;

- Small flying robots you mentioned are very vulnerable against explosive weapons, shotgun or automatics. Aim for the hull and Strafe as fast as you can when it's about to run you over.

- Bombs are very useful against the horde and the bosses, up close. However you might need to be precise how you can set the bomb at them safely, effectively. When the certain enemies are about to attack, there's a chance to set the bomb.

- To use each weapons efficiently, you have to aim by pressing Weapon Zoom key and shoot, or drop the current weapon and pickup a new one. This is far the most important strategy, hence to fill your ammo up.

- Stronger weapons are not actually powerful, you say? Sweeper's Double Barrel fire deals a good amount of damage, even can kill a Riotman in one point blank shot. Anti-Armor Rifle is most the strongest, but also the slowest. Also it's very reliable when you have to fight the enemies in some narrow spaces.

- Obviously weapons takes time to be reloaded. You have to dodge or cover to reload without dying or switch to other weapons when fighting gets busy.
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Re: Netronian Chaos V.3: Cosmic Adventures With no Tendencie

Post by PlayerLin »

I'm sure try playing massacre-style of mapset with NC would be bad idea, very bad idea. :P

And sadly, it's not easy to balance everything for every mapset WADs.
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Re: Netronian Chaos V.3: Cosmic Adventures With no Tendencie

Post by Captain J »

It's hard to satisfy both hardcore doomers and mild gamers. At least i hope it's still fine and playable enough, because... I have fixed some features and added the gore prop replacements(finallio) to the mod.

I'm going to release the new version next Monday. Because overcoming Trauma is still a thing here Haha
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Re: Netronian Chaos V.3: Cosmic Adventures With no Tendencie

Post by IDKrisis »

Example situation: I enter a large, open room with 100 health, 200 armour, a service pistol, a riot shotgun, an assault rifle with only one clip of ammunition, an anti-armour rifle and one bomb. As soon as I enter the room I am locked in and 10 enemies spawn, consisting of 4 rangers and 6 SWIDGAs. There is no cover.

Attempt 1: I score 3 direct hits with the riot gun on one SWIDGA, destroying it. By the time this is done I have died in a hail of machine gun fire.

Attempt 2: I manage to dodge enemy fire for a little while, but only manage to destroy 2 SWIDGAs before reloading. I am cornered and killed by the remaining SWIDGAs while reloading.

Attempt 3: I switch to the pistol, which proves much more effective than the shotgun. I kill all rangers and 3 SWIDGAs before running out of health.

Attempt 4: I draw the enemies towards me and deploy the bomb. I manage to get out of range of the blast, which kills 3 rangers and 2 SWIDGAs. Amazed at how many enemies have survived the blast, I try to use the riot gun to finish off the survivors, but I am quickly surrounded by the SWIDGAs and ripped apart, unable to move anywhere to dodge them.

Attempt 5: I use the anti-armour rifle, targeting the SWIDGAs first. Since I can't always get out of the way, I am forced to shoot two of them at point blank range. I win the fight and exit the room with 25 health remaining.

Bear in mind that I have managed to beat the map pack "Sunlust" in vanilla Doom on Ultra Violence difficulty without cheating.
I think the problem may be that Netronian Chaos is designed around a very different style of gameplay to classic Doom. It requires you to make use of your surroundings and take cover when reloading. However, nearly all Doom map packs that I have played frequently feature areas where there is no cover at all, forcing you to rely on constant dodging and swerving to survive. In Netronian Chaos, enemies have the advantage in the open, as they are much faster and more aggressive than vanilla Doom enemies. SWIDGAs are the strongest example of this that I have encountered. They are like flying chaingunners, but a bit tougher, more powerful, much faster and FAR more accurate. You need plenty of cover or somewhere more secure to retreat in order to survive an encounter, so if you're caught out in the open with them, you die.

I really like the style of Netronian Chaos and it does work well with the original Doom 2 maps, but I honestly think that no other map pack would work for it unless it was designed specifically for the mod.
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Re: Netronian Chaos V.3: Cosmic Adventures With no Tendencie

Post by Captain J »

It's hard at first time, but i'm sure you'll get used to it eventually. There are plenty of map packs that could work well with NC in harmony, and I know this mod is challenging and such, but at least you're not playing this mod with nuts or something!

Also the next update will slow the swidga down and will charge slowly upon death. And bomb will propel more further now, without killing you.
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Re: Netronian Chaos V.3: Cosmic Adventures With no Tendencie

Post by Gorec »

i noticed that railgun is useless against cyberdemon or spidermastermind but there is a lot of levels where they give you plasmarifle so u could kill them
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Re: Netronian Chaos V.3: Cosmic Adventures With no Tendencie

Post by Captain J »

It does damages the bosses just like other energy weapons, however it has very slow rate of fire and are not useful against the horde surrounding you to 180 degree.

However the update will make the Coil Carbine more powerful. Coil Carbine's shot deals 190 damage, however. But i've increased the damage of the explosion.
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Re: Netronian Chaos V.3: Cosmic Adventures With no Tendencie

Post by IDKrisis »

Glad to hear you're slowing the SWIDGAs down a bit. That ought to make them much more balanced, but I think more rebalancing will be needed.

I think the bombs and the riot shotgun ought to be powered up a bit. Since the bombs are so rare and you can carry so few of them, I really feel that they should be much more effective. As it stands, bombs weaken enemies, but don't kill very many of them, making them seem a little underwhelming. Also, the riot shotgun seems to be much less powerful overall than the pistols. The riot shotgun seems to do about the same damage as the vanilla pump-action shotgun. However, the simple fact that it needs to be reloaded makes it vastly inferior, so I tend to use it only when I am running dangerously low on all other ammunition. A small damage buff could make it more balanced.
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Re: Netronian Chaos V.3: Cosmic Adventures With no Tendencie

Post by Captain J »

I'm considering about this. I'm going to officially release the new version Next Monday. Be prepared!
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Re: Netronian Chaos V.3: Cosmic Adventures With no Tendencie

Post by IDKrisis »

Captain J wrote:I'm considering about this. I'm going to officially release the new version Next Monday. Be prepared!
That's great to hear. One last thing I'd like to suggest is the ability to unload any weapons you can't carry, so if you have the hand sweeper, you can nab the shells from the riot shotguns dropped by the rangers. Perhaps you could hold a key to unload a weapon you walk over instead of picking it up.

By the way, you mentioned that certain map packs work with Netronian Chaos better than others. Can you recommend a few?
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Re: Netronian Chaos V.3: Cosmic Adventures With no Tendencie

Post by Captain J »

Back to Saturn X Episode 1~2, Doom 1~2 the Way ID did, The Alfonzone etc. Find some random map pack you would like to run together really!
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Re: Netronian Chaos V.3: Cosmic Adventures With no Tendencie

Post by PlayerLin »

I remember the weapons system in NC doens't works like DooM, so IDKrisis, your idea of pick the ammo that weapons you don't have isn't easy to achieve.
(I think it had to rewrite the code or something, not sure)

Beside, "Disable weapon limit" menu option would fix this problem once for all, and you're freely to turn on or off if you feel like.

Playing NC like Duke3D/Quake style(no weapon limit, with all weapons on hand) is really fun! :P
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