Heretical Doom v1.3 - Options Upon Options!

Projects that alter game functions but do not include new maps belong here.
Forum rules
The Projects forums are ONLY for YOUR PROJECTS! If you are asking questions about a project, either find that project's thread, or start a thread in the General section instead.

Got a cool project idea but nothing else? Put it in the project ideas thread instead!

Projects for any Doom-based engine (especially 3DGE) are perfectly acceptable here too.

Please read the full rules for more details.

Re: Heretical Doom v1.3 - Options Upon Options!

Postby Ryuhi » Wed Aug 14, 2019 10:11 pm

Since Corvus is traveling from dimension to dimension, any setting is Lore friendly! If you're looking for more of an occult theme, my main recommendations would be Memento Mori 2 and Scythe 2.

Also sorry for the radio silence everyone, I am still working on the project, though real life has gotten in the way a lot lately. I'll try to drop a bit more info when I'm ready to drop my next versions
User avatar
Ryuhi
 
Joined: 21 Feb 2017

Re: Heretical Doom v1.3 - Options Upon Options!

Postby Alptraum » Thu Aug 15, 2019 6:10 am

Ryuhi wrote:Since Corvus is traveling from dimension to dimension, any setting is Lore friendly! If you're looking for more of an occult theme, my main recommendations would be Memento Mori 2 and Scythe 2.

Also sorry for the radio silence everyone, I am still working on the project, though real life has gotten in the way a lot lately. I'll try to drop a bit more info when I'm ready to drop my next versions


That seems fair. I am not that good with Heretic's lore ^^
User avatar
Alptraum
 
Joined: 22 Apr 2019
Discord: Alptraum#6909
Operating System: Windows 10/8.1/8 64-bit
Graphics Processor: nVidia (Modern GZDoom)

Re: Heretical Doom v1.3 - Options Upon Options!

Postby Renzokuken » Fri Aug 23, 2019 11:50 pm

I absolutely adore this mod and basically marathoned all of Heretic over the course of a few nights with it. I've still yet to try it extensively with proper Doom maps beyond a bit of Scythe 2 to make sure it works.

A few observations, though:

1: The lack of a proper flight powerup makes things a bit trickier in some cases. IIRC there's a few secrets that might require it, and oddly enough, it's required in E5M8 of Heretic to actually progress. You -can- just jump onto the platform, though..

2: The Sidhe's Wrath is busted. It's basically a screen nuke for 10 ammo and almost always more appealing than the normal phoenix rod. On the other hand, it's powered up version seems underwhelming. It's normal altfire spawning basically bots is also extremely powerful and allowed me to basically ignore enemies whenever I could access it.

3: The Firemace feels undertuned. It feels like it does fairly low damage for something with such a high risk to use due to its projectiles so often bouncing back. The mine altfire also seemed fairly pointless, but I might just not have utilized it well. Considering that you're locked into its reload, and how dangerous it is to the user, I found myself never using it unless I literally had no ammo for anything else.

Not exactly a bug with Heretical Doom, but rather a conflict. A Heretic hub map called Faithless was released a few months ago, and unfortunately, it is incompatible with Heretical Doom due to various issues involving the key it adds and the HUD, which is a shame because otherwise it seems like it'd pair perfectly with Heretical Doom. Something to do with the LOCKDEFs lump maybe?
The HUD itself is also a little whack: If Faithless is loaded after Heretical Doom, the HUD is overwritten with a nearly-default version. If Faithless is loaded before Heretical Doom, this happens: https://i.imgur.com/9zz5h9W.png
Renzokuken
 
Joined: 23 Aug 2019

Re: Heretical Doom v1.3 - Options Upon Options!

Postby Ryuhi » Sat Aug 24, 2019 5:18 pm

Renzokuken wrote:I absolutely adore this mod and basically marathoned all of Heretic over the course of a few nights with it. I've still yet to try it extensively with proper Doom maps beyond a bit of Scythe 2 to make sure it works.

A few observations, though:

1: The lack of a proper flight powerup makes things a bit trickier in some cases. IIRC there's a few secrets that might require it, and oddly enough, it's required in E5M8 of Heretic to actually progress. You -can- just jump onto the platform, though..

2: The Sidhe's Wrath is busted. It's basically a screen nuke for 10 ammo and almost always more appealing than the normal phoenix rod. On the other hand, it's powered up version seems underwhelming. It's normal altfire spawning basically bots is also extremely powerful and allowed me to basically ignore enemies whenever I could access it.

3: The Firemace feels undertuned. It feels like it does fairly low damage for something with such a high risk to use due to its projectiles so often bouncing back. The mine altfire also seemed fairly pointless, but I might just not have utilized it well. Considering that you're locked into its reload, and how dangerous it is to the user, I found myself never using it unless I literally had no ammo for anything else.

Not exactly a bug with Heretical Doom, but rather a conflict. A Heretic hub map called Faithless was released a few months ago, and unfortunately, it is incompatible with Heretical Doom due to various issues involving the key it adds and the HUD, which is a shame because otherwise it seems like it'd pair perfectly with Heretical Doom. Something to do with the LOCKDEFs lump maybe?
The HUD itself is also a little whack: If Faithless is loaded after Heretical Doom, the HUD is overwritten with a nearly-default version. If Faithless is loaded before Heretical Doom, this happens: https://i.imgur.com/9zz5h9W.png


Glad you're enjoying it! Taking out the flight powerup was a conscious decision, but future versions will have it back into the normal item rotation (rather than as a spell like in previous version) The pole vault is unlocked super early so that the player should always have it by the time the flight powerup is required for any maps. I've been going back and forth on this one a lot lately, because the flight ability + fire mace was beyond busted even by my standards in most cases. that said, the firemace is a more strategic weapon: Bouncing it around corners or over walls (fun fact: ceiling bounces will cause it to detonate on ground impact) can be incredibly powerful, as well as using the protection spell to completely negate the friendly fire damage and just fill the entire room with explosions. On the other hand, if you try to use it like a rocket launcher, it doesnt work out very well. The altfire ties into this very well, as you can use it to cluster enemies and then use the primary fire to guarantee a volley of explosions on each of them, making it a great crowd control weapon.

As for the Sidhe's Wrath, I've been on and off about changing and tuning it more. It is more expensive in the next build, which paired with decreased overall ammo gains will make it a lot more costly for its nuke status. It will continue to be tweaked and revamped (including its powered fire and the powered alt when its finished.)

As for Faithless, I haven't tried it yet, but I look forward to doing so! the conflicts you mentioned are likely due to the wad using custom hud replacements, which can sometimes cause conflicts in such cases. I'll give it a try and likely either make a patch to fix it, or integrate the fix into the next version. I'll also look into the custom key situation, as Heretical Doom doesnt use any key changes outside of the voxels replacing the sprites
User avatar
Ryuhi
 
Joined: 21 Feb 2017

Re: Heretical Doom v1.3 - Options Upon Options!

Postby Ravielsk » Sun Aug 25, 2019 3:23 am

Great mod, really enjoying it. However, I just wanted to ask whether there is a way to carry over levels from episode to episode when playing heretic.wad?
Ravielsk
 
Joined: 25 Aug 2019
Operating System: Windows Vista/7 64-bit
Graphics Processor: nVidia (Modern GZDoom)

Re: Heretical Doom v1.3 - Options Upon Options!

Postby Renzokuken » Sun Aug 25, 2019 4:25 am

Ryuhi wrote:Glad you're enjoying it! Taking out the flight powerup was a conscious decision, but future versions will have it back into the normal item rotation (rather than as a spell like in previous version) The pole vault is unlocked super early so that the player should always have it by the time the flight powerup is required for any maps. I've been going back and forth on this one a lot lately, because the flight ability + fire mace was beyond busted even by my standards in most cases. that said, the firemace is a more strategic weapon: Bouncing it around corners or over walls (fun fact: ceiling bounces will cause it to detonate on ground impact) can be incredibly powerful, as well as using the protection spell to completely negate the friendly fire damage and just fill the entire room with explosions. On the other hand, if you try to use it like a rocket launcher, it doesnt work out very well. The altfire ties into this very well, as you can use it to cluster enemies and then use the primary fire to guarantee a volley of explosions on each of them, making it a great crowd control weapon.

As for the Sidhe's Wrath, I've been on and off about changing and tuning it more. It is more expensive in the next build, which paired with decreased overall ammo gains will make it a lot more costly for its nuke status. It will continue to be tweaked and revamped (including its powered fire and the powered alt when its finished.)


I played way too much of this mod over a pretty short period and I somehow never noticed that there was a pole-vault or that I could 'force' the firemace grenades to detonate that way. With that knowledge, the firemace is a lot more useful.

I think that even just doubling the ammo cost of the Sidhe's Wrath is probably a good idea. IIRC a pickup is enough for a full use of it if you're willing to blow it all, but when I played, I would see Phoenix Rod ammo and think "cool, that's one free room." I only ever used the Phoenix Rod against things like Iron Liches or other bosses.

Also, I think that the sabreclaws might be a bit -too- deadly in the Heretical Monsters addon, especially if they're meant to replace pinkies. Pinkies are fairly dumb and you can easily bait them into melee, but the Heretical sabreclaws seem to move much more quickly and their stealth makes dealing with rooms of them, where you're expected to fight pinkies, much more unmanageable. Most of my deaths in Heretic were from sabreclaws. A lot of my difficult was that there wasn't many weapons that could seem to oneshot them. The most reliable I found was the dual-bolt crossbow using the Tome, and that's not something that can be brought out consistently because of how expensive that becomes. However, I -was- playing on Madman, which I didn't know at the time turned off monster infighting. And my dumb ass somehow never noticed that they weren't killing each other.
Renzokuken
 
Joined: 23 Aug 2019

Re: Heretical Doom v1.3 - Options Upon Options!

Postby Ryuhi » Sun Aug 25, 2019 9:48 pm

Madman is actually the difficulty i use for testing the most, its basically "Nightmare-Lite" rather than just UV. That said, if you need a reliable way to take out sabreclaws, try using the altfire for the crossbow in dual bolt mode. No tome required and tons of damage for a moderate ammo cost. You can also adjust their stealth AI in the options if its too much.

For the Phoenix Rod vs Sidhe Wrath, the rod is much better in certain situations: Big enemies that are a distance off (Mancubuses, arachnotrons, etc) and its tomed mode is very cost efficient vs groups of enemies close up (stunlocks em to hell, too) Its powered alt fire can also create walls of fire you can use to create or engulf choke points, and the normal alt fire has some pretty strong shock combos that can wipe rooms at the cost of mana and other weapon ammo. With the next version ammo is being decreased across the board in addition to some cost increases, and its been really showing with the sidhe wrath in testing.
User avatar
Ryuhi
 
Joined: 21 Feb 2017

Re: Heretical Doom v1.3 - Options Upon Options!

Postby AvzinElkein » Sun Aug 25, 2019 10:41 pm

In Strife, would Corvus have different dialogue responses and such?
AvzinElkein
 
Joined: 17 Nov 2010
Discord: AvzinElkein#8621

Re: Heretical Doom v1.3 - Options Upon Options!

Postby Ryuhi » Sun Aug 25, 2019 11:17 pm

AvzinElkein wrote:In Strife, would Corvus have different dialogue responses and such?


Eventually. One day I will learn the proper way to rewrite all the dialogue in the game.
User avatar
Ryuhi
 
Joined: 21 Feb 2017

Re: Heretical Doom v1.3 - Options Upon Options!

Postby bricks041059 » Sat Sep 14, 2019 7:56 pm

Are there any guides for how to use the staff combos? I really can't tell what the timing is.
bricks041059
 
Joined: 24 Jun 2019
Operating System: Windows 10/8.1/8 64-bit
Graphics Processor: nVidia with Vulkan support

Re: Heretical Doom v1.3 - Options Upon Options!

Postby Ryuhi » Sun Sep 15, 2019 11:02 am

there is a small hourglass that appears at the bottom of the screen during the frames where you are supposed to do the next input. After a while you'll get the feel for the timings, though.

The next version is going to be considerably more difficult, so I plan to make a video going over some of the more advanced techniques to help people along :D
User avatar
Ryuhi
 
Joined: 21 Feb 2017

Re: Heretical Doom v1.3 - Options Upon Options!

Postby bricks041059 » Thu Sep 19, 2019 2:32 pm

Ryuhi wrote:there is a small hourglass that appears at the bottom of the screen during the frames where you are supposed to do the next input. After a while you'll get the feel for the timings, though.

The next version is going to be considerably more difficult, so I plan to make a video going over some of the more advanced techniques to help people along :D


Yeah, I started really getting it down so now I can do it pretty consistently. Is there an ETA for the next version?? I love this mod and would love to see more updates :)
bricks041059
 
Joined: 24 Jun 2019
Operating System: Windows 10/8.1/8 64-bit
Graphics Processor: nVidia with Vulkan support

Re: Heretical Doom v1.3 - Options Upon Options!

Postby Ryuhi » Thu Sep 19, 2019 5:29 pm

Since the next update is going to address balance and difficulty more, I am being extra thorough in playtesting and mix-matching with various mapsets and complimenting mods. There are a few issues I'm still trying to work out as well, so its hard to give an expected release date. As soon as I'm in the home stretch, I'll be sure to let everyone know!
User avatar
Ryuhi
 
Joined: 21 Feb 2017

Re: Heretical Doom v1.3 - Options Upon Options!

Postby Tekmon_Xonic » Thu Sep 19, 2019 6:28 pm

Hey Ryuhi! I just want to say that I'm enjoying the crap out of your mod, and I'm having an absolute blast with it. I feel like the way you've set up the weapons in this mod make them feel like true parallels to Doomguy's weapons, and it's pretty neat to see that Corvus' magical weapons on par with Doomguy's. Keep up the good work! :thumb:
Tekmon_Xonic
Who want-a some wang?
 
Joined: 03 Dec 2012
Location: Personal Matrix

Re: Heretical Doom v1.3 - Options Upon Options!

Postby JasmairoQY » Mon Nov 25, 2019 10:50 am

The torch spell isnt working. It barely lights the rooms at all. Ran heretic vanilla just to be safe its not something to do with my setting but Torch works fine there.
JasmairoQY
 
Joined: 07 May 2017

PreviousNext

Return to Gameplay Mods

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Majestic-12 [Bot], Simple Pie [RSS] and 15 guests