MetaDoom v5.1 "Klave" (Artipatch! p98)

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Re: MetaDoom v4.1 "Fred" (Link Restored)

Postby Kinsie » Sat May 26, 2018 1:48 pm

Some interesting ideas here.

I'm willing to be a bit flexible with Doom 3's bestiary's behaviour because frankly, a lot of the new boys were pretty samey and melee focused. I have a couple of ideas that mostly entail borrowing behaviours from other Id games, but as always sprites are the problem. A problem with more solutions than there were when v4.1 was released, for sure, but still a problem.

I like the idea of a Level Enhancement Script as yet another separate PK3 for playing with WadSmoosh, there's some fun routes that could be taken with that. Scattering Deep Cuts everywhere could get a bit cheesy, though, so it'd have to be used sparingly, so that any changes are a pleasant surprise rather than an eye-roll.

I'd kind of like to return to this at some point in the forseeable future (no promises, mind!) to make some tweaks and tie the ends off of the sausage, so further suggestions and ideas (and bug reports!) are greatly appreciated.
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Re: MetaDoom v4.1 "Fred" (Link Restored)

Postby whatup876 » Sat May 26, 2018 1:55 pm

Since we're listing some ideas for this mod, i might as well make up a huge list of what could or could not be good ideas for this mod.
Some of these are bad, some are good but probably don't even mix and this list might end up being needlessly long for what should be someone's suggestions for someone else's mod, but i'll see what i can come up or pick up and add it here.

On the Subject of gameplay changes
    * I've heard people complain that MetaDoom has a ammo wasting problem, which might be tied to how weapons or enemies work: I thought a suggestion could be decreasing the number of bullets required for micromissiles from 6 to 3, for example.
    * The Hellrazers seem to be another cause for this situation since they have more health than a zombieman, so i wonder if they could have had less health or for the fun of it, drop bigger ammo boxes? (never said these would have been good ideas)
    * The fire extinguisher could have had the primary fire a bit more extended in terms of reach and maybe have it, where some enemies get "blind" by the foam and become more innacurate, but still won't recieve damage. Something to make it a bit more usefull
    * BFG and Chainsaw could show up first on their slots, for more "vanilla styled gameplay" or at least the Unmaker could show up after the BFG, since that weapon starts off weak.
    * Melee weapons could have had a progression based randomization like other weapons.
    * Maybe make the demon keys for the Unmaker show up more often, since i'm pretty sure in the original D64, picking them up meant it happening first before you even get the weapon. (might be wrong though)
    * Backpacks could give BFG ammo, depending how maps expect you to have your ammo, even if it's BFG ammo laying next to it.
    * In D64, Arachno's could shoot two plasma balls at once, maybe this could be an additional ability for Spiborgs, for the sake of vanilla+ gameplay, accuracy to their game and the fact we won't get another spiderbrain rep ever. (their current attack would still be kept, obviously)
    * Since i once wanted to keep both QD and infinite Berserk, i was wondering if Quad could have been another blursphere replacement, since Haste makes it as if the original power up wasn't that usefull and works better as a slot for better power ups. (i don't even know why berserk was timed in the first place, but i guess that's just me not paying enough attention)
    * Maybe give the barons a normal fireball, without ditching the splitting one they currently have and nerf (just a bit) their smash attack, i guess.

Inventory items
The weaponry in itself is already big enough, but on the subject of intentory items, i thought of at least two
    * Kinetic mines seem easy, since they really are that: mines that jump to their targets. There SHOULD be a limit on how much should be put. (5 should be enough)
    * Personal teleporters were something i heard Kinsie wanted to add, so i thought he'd have to add some custom key bind for a teleport action, while setting the thing meant simply using it in the inventory. That and a limit of 1 teleporter at a time and something to indicate where the item would be set. (even if it's an arrow with the letters PT above it)

Enemies
Considering how the mod's enemies try to have their own specifics spots and the limitations of the mod's concept of adding stuff from Doom games, plus whether or not the codex feature would happen, i thought there could still be enough room for a few enemies. I thought of at least 9, which is too much, but at least each one goes for a different type if it helps.
    * I already mentioned the Impling and Wraith as a new Imp and Specter spawn.
    * Belphegor: The D4 Pinky has an unique idea for a gameplay factor, which could be some shield/hitbox system where he could recieve less damage in the front and more in the back, but if it's hard to pull off, i once thought of last resort ideas like a mix of stats and parts from other melee monsters or something out of LegenDoom where the more hurt he gets, the angrier and aggressive he becomes.
    * Depending on how stronger he can get, a downside could be a longer pain state.
    * Nightmare: The D4 Lost Soul seems easy enough but these monsters need to be fun to fight, either by making them active their explosive mood when they get close to death or make them scream and take a while before hitting the player, to indicate they're at it.
    * Druj: The D3 Fatso has sprites in that D3Mod, which make him just some white Mancubus with tentacles mouth.
    * Ability-wise, he could just shoot the fireballs from his arm cannons individually rather than both at the same time, even if this needs reworking to make more of a difference.
    * The D4 Mancubi were able to smack their arms on the floor, which was made in D4T in the form of them jumping, so i wonder if that could work.
    * Ghoul: The Doom RPG original has enough material that he's even available in Realm667 but sadly he would be just another red skeleton, much like the Fiend (and it might be too late to switch names, i guess), so if his sprites were to be based off a D3 Revenant (model rips or not) he would have his transparent skin removed for obvious reasons but i wonder if he could have had green blood pants to make him more unique, while the Fiend could make get some edits on his own, like having his armor painted gray.
    * Gameplay-wise, the D3 Revenant was able to shoot two rockets at once and "side step" but moved slower and originally was meant to drop a rocket, if a new creative move isn't needed.
    * A new Archvile rep: I heard Kinsie bringing up saving the red Archie with horns for a variant, then i heard someone bringing up Hellion from Realm667, who despite the tail and orange color, he has enough differences from an Archvile to be different, but still fitting for the idea of what the Archvile is, aside from not being blue or red and, you know, the tail.
    * Gameplay and even sounds could be taken from Doom 3, such as a move that consists of a fire trail on the ground.
    * Possessed soldier: Maybe another zombie guy could be allowed, with these ones probably making a bit more sense than the Hellrazers, since those are used to replace chaingunners in other mods.
    * Sprites? He has them from some D4T addon, even if they're ugly but they're serviceable enough i guess?
    * Gameplay: Shoots a simple plasma ball as a primary attack, with the second one being a projectile that stops in mid air and explodes shortly after.
    * Bruiser: A variant for the Hellknights could be neat, specially if it's the teletubby demons.
    * Sadly, no sprites and there was an unfinished set using what i believed to be parts from a Cybruiser from Realm667, but i heard their models were in Hunter's Moon.
    * Gameplay wise, we could get creative: shooting three fireballs at a time, charging both cannons for a big fireball... whatever works, a downside could be him not being able to jump, unless he pretend he has rockets in those metal legs of his.

And in terms of new features, i was thinking of the marineguy dolls working as secret treasures that spawn next to some of the sphere power ups, that are hidden, that could give the player an amount of score points and play the E1M1 jingle.

Hopefully, that should be more than enough, so i apologize for the huge amount of text and the quality of most of these ideas in general.
So yeah, oops.
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Re: MetaDoom v4.1 "Fred" (Link Restored)

Postby Miru » Sat May 26, 2018 4:05 pm

I also have some cool enemy ideas.

Ogre: A very-late-game Imp replacement, Ogres are akin to vanilla Barons, but faster. Ogres may also throw an exploding, arcing fireball.
* Sprites? I think recoloring vanilla Barons would be sufficient.
** Maybe for lulz we can have a super-rare variant named Shrek.
Marine-Bot: A Hell Knight replacer enemy that is a robotic Marine. These robots fire machine-gun bursts at players, before shooting mini-rockets. Maybe, like in 64, there’s three kinds of Marine-Bot? Each with different tactics? Watch out, upon death they may explode 10 seconds after they die.
* The sprites would obviously be from Doom 64.
Vagary: Baron replacement monster that attacks using sticky webs and sharp claws. Can crawl on walls and ceilings. One of her attacks is to spawn Ticks, simple, small monsters. She also has a psychic throwing ability, able to toss monsters and objects, or even an unfortunate player. Upon death, spawns a Mancubus and a Trite.
* Sprites are the tricky part about this monster. Of course, a Mancubus would have to be in her abdomen. The Ticks would simply use the spiders from Blood.
Sentinel: Modeled after the Sentinel from the pre-release Doom RPG2, Sentinel is a Revenant replacement monster that focuses on defensive combat. Sentinels can create barriers around themselves, which are hard to penetrate as they scamper and shoot off magic bolts. Holy Water does a number on these things, though.
* Sprites? Likely a Corvus edit.

I’ve already discussed the Vulgar and Harbinger before, on the last page. Didn’t really go into detail on the Harbinger, but Vulgar has a damage-over-time poison and can open locked doors, and suddenly turn tail on a fight. Now that I think about it, Harbinger would probably have the ability to shoot off spread shots that home in on their targets.

EDIT: Maybe the Wolf SS could have various other Id Tech 1 game monsters as replacements, such as Maulotaurs, etc. and about the “deep cut” bosses, I think having at most one of each per game would be good.

Edit: Okay, a few more monster ideas, some of which are rather fanfictiony:

Nightmare: Based on the D3 Lost Soul appearance, Nightmares move slowly, but have a set of blue fireballs surrounding them that spin quickly. Think the Gohla from Sonic Adventure. As a bonus, Nightmares have a tendency to spawn from any ex-human enemy. The full sprites for this one don’t exist yet, though. (I have found a reference sprite for it) Another Lost Soul replacer.

Former Martian: Something based loosely on the novels, where the monsters were aliens. This was once a Martian, before the demons infected him. Former Martians spit napalm-like mucous that ignites upon contact with a surface.
I think editing the imp to have a greenish pigment and bigger eyes would work. Probably replaces the Chaingunner.

Skater Bot: A nod to Doomguy’s role in a Tony Hawk game, these robots use skateboards to speed around quickly. Would probably replace the Wolfenstein SS.

Wheeler: It’s a Pinky Demon, on wheels! Like in the movie. Faster than a normal Pinky, these wheeled horrors are otherwise little different. In other words, I agree with the reference you proposed.

I also think about the D3 melee guys being differentiated from one another, and so...

I think Maggot could eat items and corpses, healing itself. The Maggot could also use a poison attack like the Vulgar. There would be two or three Cherubs spawning instead of one, and of course they fly, like the Flemoidus Cycloptis. Perhaps have them stay airborne until they dive down to attack! Maybe civilian zombies would spawn in groups if they appear, and having the fat, flaming, and chainsaw versions would be more exciting to have than just standard cannon fodder ones. Perhaps also have cues from the RPGs and 4? Fat ones would have good stealth and stamina, while maybe the flaming ones can explode?

EDIT: Now that I think about it, 4’s Posessed would be very interesting enemies compared to a lot of the basic D3 zombies, which already are more or less covered by the Unwilling for now. But seeing at least some (though not every single type has to be included) would be a fun early-game encounter. Maggot does look like it could also have a sprint mode or a jump ability.
Last edited by Miru on Sat Jun 02, 2018 1:09 am, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: MetaDoom v4.1 "Fred" (Link Restored)

Postby whatup876 » Sat May 26, 2018 4:37 pm

Marine-Bot sounds like a weird choice, since i don't think it's something that actually existed in a Doom game.
Or maybe you're mentioning something obscure i didn't know existed.
But i once thought that if a Doom 64 former human were to be in the mod, he could replicate the burster rifle in D4's multiplayer, even if that means another chaingunner type of enemy.

Ogre is basically a green baron in DRPG, so i think he could work better as variants for those
Spoiler:


The Sentinel/Watcher monsters seem too unusual looking for their sprites to be an edit of Corvus, but they do look interesting.
At least with the Sawcubi, their designs seemed easier for them to get sprites in this mod at all.

The Wolf SS part might not be that much of a good idea since MetaDoom was meant to play close to Doom's core gameplay, which means replacing a basic enemy with a boss type (Maulotaur) might be too much.

Although i would love to see other Wolfenstein variants based off Return to Castle Wolfenstein and later games.

Speeaking of the Harbinger, if you meant the Wolfenstein RPG monster, he doesn't really come from a Doom game, but i think the real issue is whether or not his sprites would be based off the D64 Cybie or the classic one, depending on the existing sprites out there.
I just looked up and saw someone named raymoohawk working on that D64 "naked" Cyberdemon.
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Re: MetaDoom v4.1 "Fred" (Link Restored)

Postby Miru » Sat May 26, 2018 5:12 pm

whatup876 wrote:Marine-Bot sounds like a weird choice, since i don't think it's something that actually existed in a Doom game.
Or maybe you're mentioning something obscure i didn't know existed.
But i once thought that if a Doom 64 former human were to be in the mod, he could replicate the burster rifle in D4's multiplayer, even if that means another chaingunner type of enemy.

Ogre is basically a green baron in DRPG, so i think he could work better as variants for those
Spoiler:


The Sentinel/Watcher monsters seem too unusual looking for their sprites to be an edit of Corvus, but they do look interesting.
At least with the Sawcubi, their designs seemed easier for them to get sprites in this mod at all.

The Wolf SS part might not be that much of a good idea since MetaDoom was meant to play close to Doom's core gameplay, which means replacing a basic enemy with a boss type (Maulotaur) might be too much.

Although i would love to see other Wolfenstein variants based off Return to Castle Wolfenstein and later games.

Speeaking of the Harbinger, if you meant the Wolfenstein RPG monster, he doesn't really come from a Doom game, but i think the real issue is whether or not his sprites would be based off the D64 Cybie or the classic one, depending on the existing sprites out there.
I just looked up and saw someone named raymoohawk working on that D64 "naked" Cyberdemon.


Marine-Bot appeared in the title map of Doom 64. Sentinel’s design is taken from the green light trailer of Doom 2 RPG. Watcher would indeed use the design seen in the final game instead.

https://youtu.be/StftBCgxHUk

And I think Ogre having a Cyberdemon head would work. And the Harbinger I saw was based on the original Cyberdemon. And also, I think we could have Undead Warrior and the like replacing Wolf SS, not Maulotaur. And speaking of Heretic, maybe editing that game’s Gargoyle could make a monster based on how the Doom Bible describes the Imps (small flying enemy that shoots spikes and fire).

Edit: Ogre being an Imp is because he is a very late-game spawn and doesn’t have a lot of defensive bulk.

EDIT2: And also, I had another idea for an original enemy based loosely on the Movie; the Shadow Genin. This is a former human that has gained more and more dark traits over time. However, it is a slow-moving creature. Also, the Reaver Mutant, based on the “cannibal mutants” mentioned in Doom 2 but never fought. And perhaps the Sentry Bot could be both an item and an (Shotgunner-class) enemy? Perhaps if the enemy isn’t too damaged it can be picked up as an item?

EDIT3: I mainly created the Shadow Genin and Reaver Mutant to demonstrate the map enhancement script. They’d show up in the Earth levels of Doom 2.

EDIT4: I suggest the bayonet from the alpha version as a weapon. Jabbing with secondary fire would drop bonuses, while the shots themselves will use the ammo pool of the machine gun and do a fair bit of damage and have great range.

EDIT5: The Dark Claw from the Doom Bible would be a good melee weapon to add. Primarily a melee weapon, its secondary fire could be a powerful blast of dark clouds that costs souls. Slicing enemies with it does plenty of damage. Someone also mentioned the Sig-Cow from the novels, I could see it working if we got a gasoline ammo to help it fire quickly. Probably make it a zombie drop only weapon.

EDIT6: If we do get novel enemies, a Human Traitor (“Clyde”) would be a fun enemy, using voice clips from Blood, and also have a “Fred” (maybe F.R.E.D.) enemy based on the Duke Nukem Advance Greys that could replace Hell Knights and come with exclusive weapon drops, the Fred Disc Buster (shoots off a limited supply of disc-shaped drones) and the Fred Ray (a laser beam that disintegrates targets.
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Re: MetaDoom v4.1 "Fred" (Link Restored)

Postby whatup876 » Sun May 27, 2018 1:09 pm

Speaking of the Dark Claw, i know the arsenal is already huge, but if we were to assume there was still some room. i did some speculations on my own about how this weapon could work:
    * Primary fire is how it works in the Doom bible, which means a cloud that damages enemies, that could be similar to the poison gas from the GL, but still different in some areas.
    * Second one could be a tribute to Hexen (since this mod does a lot of little tributes to other games) based off the Wraithverge, which shoots homing souls. (these could be Lost Souls based off the Phantom, since this is a weapon related to cute content from the game)
    * May or may not use the same ammo as the Soulcube, except it uses one soul at a time.

Anyway, i better stop before this page of this thread becomes full of text, since i've already made what could be the biggest post made in a while.

Late edit: in other news, it turns out the Vulgar in Realm667 does not have a tail.
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Re: MetaDoom v4.1 "Fred" (Link Restored)

Postby Miru » Sun May 27, 2018 5:51 pm

I think the Wraithverge-styled attack used by Dark Claw could be a charge-up attack by holding down secondary fire. Primary is a melee attack. And even all but one (That being the Human Traitor) of the non-game enemies do correspond to Doom 2’s flavor text of cannibal mutants and aliens. Also, for me, the Extra add-on doesn’t work for me at all for some reason. One time, a Caco variant dropped a human skull as a gib.

EDIT: I think once we have the 64 Chainsaw, Chainstrosity might be a good choice of an enemy to drop it when fragged.
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Re: MetaDoom v4.1 "Fred" (Link Restored)

Postby austen1000 » Mon May 28, 2018 8:14 pm

I wonder if it be worth it to add any (or more, if some already exist) of the Doom 3 expansion's enemies and weapons, I'm also not sure if the Lost Episodes from Doom 3 BFG added anything new.
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Re: MetaDoom v4.1 "Fred" (Link Restored)

Postby Miru » Tue May 29, 2018 1:51 pm

austen1000 wrote:I wonder if it be worth it to add any (or more, if some already exist) of the Doom 3 expansion's enemies and weapons, I'm also not sure if the Lost Episodes from Doom 3 BFG added anything new.

Forgotten Ones are already spawned by one monster, and Vulgar has been discussed. I also kinda want to see the Grabber, though the Artifact might be a bit too complicated and wonky (but still worth it for the sake of every super-weapon in the series)...

Also, the RoE bosses (along with others from the series) have been discussed as part of a level enhancement script to be placed in select levels. I also think that the Bruiser might work as an alternate Baron. Lost Mission only added alternate versions of the Vagary and Guardian. Perhaps bridge the gap between the two versions of the Guardian?
Last edited by Miru on Tue May 29, 2018 3:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: MetaDoom v4.1 "Fred" (Link Restored)

Postby whatup876 » Tue May 29, 2018 3:50 pm

I didn't even noticed anything new from Lost Mission besides the scientist character being new and some unique sections in hell, that could probably work for inspiration for a MetaDoom themed mapset idea, that may never actually happen.

Meanwhile, i just noticed that Hellion from Realm667 was intended as an Imp monster, meaning he might not have any resurrect sprites to make up for an Archvile spriteset.
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Re: MetaDoom v4.1 "Fred" (Link Restored)

Postby Miru » Thu May 31, 2018 5:26 pm

I have come up with a few more enemy ideas:

[*]Steel Skull: Based on the novel versions of the Lost Sould, using D64 as a base, these are robotic skulls created by the Freds that fly around in patterns until they dive down and strike. They will also explode and deal damage when destroyed.
[*] Goliath: A HK replacer that is larger and wields a chainsaw as a weapon, modeled off of the movie Hell Knight. No ranged attack, though.
[*] Fred Machine: A flying mech driven by a Fred, that is an arachnotron replacer. Shoots spread-shots of plasma balls that then explode, and may also summon Steel Skulls. Perhaps also a stronger boss version?
[*] Neophyte: Based on the Newbies from the novels, these resemble black slugs.
[*] Bone Buster: Taken from the Doom novels, these Fred creations strongly resemble Revenants, but explode after they fire their missiles. A Revenant replacer.
[*] Fire Eater: Similar to the Arch-Vile in appearance, these enemies are like walking bombs that will explode to attack. They radiate flames around their bodies, and may even melt a Bullet shot at them. Taken right from the novels.
[*] Animal Zombies: Taken from the Doom 3 novels, these include a zombie labrador, a monkey (from R667), and maybe some others. Unlike the Hellhounds, they move as slowly as human zombies.
[*] Hell Prince: A baron of hell armed with wrist-mounted blasters that fire rapid plasma blasts. They also toss bigger, slower plasma shots. Based off of their novel designs. Perhaps with heads based on the box art of the first game?
[*] Adiposus: An eyeless Mancubus based on their appearance in the novels. They are fully organic warriors with arms covered in small mouths that shoot white phosphorus at their targets to ignite them.
[*] Styx: A shark-like demon surrounded in toxic mist. A spectre replacement that can suddenly disappear before attacking. Can also swim underwater, with its only sign on land being its ominous dorsal fin. Taken from the novels. It was a one-shot, mysterious enemy.
[*] Gore Nest: Pain Elemental replacer. A stationary enemy that spawns many other demons at foes.
[*] Moloch: A Cyberdemon with a missile rack attached to its back. Fires off missiles that rain from the sky. Taken from the novels.
[*] Kingsman: A weaker version of the Guardian that replaces Barons and can take normal damage rather than have to be hit in the Seeker. A combination of both Lost Mission and the D3 Novels.
[*] Sewer Imp: Oh no. More submersible monsters. These creatures are imp replacements that can swim and grab their victims to drag them down.



And also, the Prowler (Demon class) and Harvester (Cacodemon class) should get in the roster of monsters too.

Maybe have some of the score items based on Doom merchandise, such as the Doom movie figures, plush, the board game, etc? Perhaps some nods to Reelism and other past mods?

And if we do get Sarge in, his second form could be based on the concept art of Sabaoth, where he was sewn to a demon. Another boss idea could be Phobotron, a homage to the “Phobos” character from Q3A and some merch. A robotic, orange marine, (perhaps based on Freedoom’s sprite set?), he would serve as a homage to the Player 2 boss encounter in Reelism. Using a varied arsenal of weapons and often strafing around, the player will have to outwit his actions and fight fire with fire to win. Highly explosive upon death, as well.

Certain objects should be able to be sliced and chopped down with the axe, such as trees, torches, and even cadavers. This could open up new paths, reveal some bonus items (at least point bonuses), or have logs and whatnot fall upon enemies that have the misfortune to be standing behind a tree. The Super Shotgun could have burst fire from D4 as a secondary option. Plus maybe a charge shot for the normal Shotgun’s secondary fire?

And some more weapons:

* Demonic Dagger: A throwing weapon that increases in damage output for the longer it flies. Based on the knives from doom RPG and alpha version. Could also work as an inventory item instead of a weapon.
* The Crucible: An unholy beam sword that has increased effects on non-demonic enemies (human traitors, machinery, Freds, etc.), doing more damage against them, while it sucks up demonic energy from demonic enemies as it slashes them. This is more of a combo-oriented melee weapon. Press attack repeatedly to combo the enemy with a series of strikes of increasing power. Secondary attack could be a thrust that can be used with combos for alternate attacks. Took an item from Doom 4 and weaponized it.


Would the Demon Rune work as an inventory item? It can transform the player into a monster, ensuring stealth and power. These runes would be rare items to collect, perhaps only spawning in secret areas. Perhaps some of the other D4 runes, as well? Seek and Destroy would have to be tweaked significantly to make it work with the lack of GKs, like maybe an increased-power berserk, or a homing projectile endurance to fit the name better. Perhaps just have one Rune with random effects? Maybe an Adrenaline from Doom 3 could be used as a general statistic booster item? Or some kind of flight ability item?



The Fred Ray could have a Hellshot-inspired secondary fire feature. I don’t quite know if the Hellshot is worth it in and of itself, along with the Heavy Assault Rifle. And also, could some weapons have a tertiary fire function?
Last edited by Miru on Thu May 31, 2018 9:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: MetaDoom v4.1 "Fred" (Link Restored)

Postby TheSuperSteve » Thu May 31, 2018 5:49 pm

If there are any more updates to this mod, I feel like something needs to be done about siphon grenades.

When used, they freeze enemies in place while they damage/drain life from the enemy. The issue is, you can spam them and essentially stun-lock any enemy in the game. This makes it far too easy to down Cyberdemons and Spider Masterminds as you can stun-lock them and shoot them as they lay there helpless.
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Re: MetaDoom v4.1 "Fred" (Link Restored)

Postby Miru » Sat Jun 02, 2018 12:43 am

TheSuperSteve wrote:If there are any more updates to this mod, I feel like something needs to be done about siphon grenades.

When used, they freeze enemies in place while they damage/drain life from the enemy. The issue is, you can spam them and essentially stun-lock any enemy in the game. This makes it far too easy to down Cyberdemons and Spider Masterminds as you can stun-lock them and shoot them as they lay there helpless.


I agree that bosses should have a countermeasure against the Siphon Grenades in place. Such as them able to have a chance of deflecting it. And I think the double jump boots from D4 could be used for platforming, mainly if you added a cooldown period to balance them, and turn stages that were once a bit of a slog into an exhilarating joyride of well-timed double-jumps. I think some pickup could also enhance jumping briefly, such as maybe wall jumps or hovering.
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Re: MetaDoom v4.1 "Fred" (Link Restored)

Postby whatup876 » Sat Jun 02, 2018 9:13 am

I think the problem with the novels and maybe other Doom media is, besides not being video games, i don't think there's actual official existing visualization of these concepts (at least that I know of off) which means we'd have to be "too creative" to handle them at all.
And while MetaDoom already does some risks and creativity at executing some elements, you still get the idea some of it was in a Doom game, even if it's references to other games/mods, cut content or concept art. (and somethings also need to have some specific or different roles to fit in, since the Doom series sort of popularized weapon and enemy variety in FPS)

I feel like maybe the Doom novel ideas could be used for a mod focused on that and in MetaDoom, they would be referenced in codex descriptions, along with maybe official level episodes and mapsets that don't offer new items, weapons or enemies.

At least that's how i see it.
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Joined: 27 Feb 2017

Re: MetaDoom v4.1 "Fred" (Link Restored)

Postby Miru » Sat Jun 02, 2018 1:29 pm

whatup876 wrote:I think the problem with the novels and maybe other Doom media is, besides not being video games, i don't think there's actual official existing visualization of these concepts (at least that I know of off) which means we'd have to be "too creative" to handle them at all.
And while MetaDoom already does some risks and creativity at executing some elements, you still get the idea some of it was in a Doom game, even if it's references to other games/mods, cut content or concept art. (and somethings also need to have some specific or different roles to fit in, since the Doom series sort of popularized weapon and enemy variety in FPS)

I feel like maybe the Doom novel ideas could be used for a mod focused on that and in MetaDoom, they would be referenced in codex descriptions, along with maybe official level episodes and mapsets that don't offer new items, weapons or enemies.

At least that's how i see it.


Now that I think about it, stuff like the novels seems too different to really reconcile with the games. Perhaps a “Media Pack” optional add-on for MetaDoom, along with a separate mod that adapts the novels into a game?
Miru
 
Joined: 22 Apr 2015

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