[NEW!] Doom Delta v2.0 Released!

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Re: Doom Delta v2.0 BETA TEST!

Postby goodjaerb » Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:02 am

Any chance someone can explain why the hud doesn't show up completely for me?
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Re: Doom Delta v2.0 BETA TEST!

Postby DrPyspy » Tue Jan 16, 2018 1:59 pm

taufan99 wrote:EDIT: Bug report (beta v2.0)! While I was messing around with no-clipping cheat in E2M3: Refinery, I found Thi Barrett's doll in a random spot outside of the map.
Image
Which makes it impossible to finish the level at all (even after I disabled the cheat, I still couldn't pick it).


Has this bug occurred multiple times? I've tried to recreate this bug but I haven't had any luck.

cyan0s1s wrote:I like this mod quite a lot, but I take issue with a few things regarding weapons:

1. The Chaingun says it does 8 dmg (so 1-8?) but it doesn't seem any stronger than the machine gun, and it's only a little bit faster. Add in the wind up time and it's just harder to use reliably.

2. The BFG 2704's projectiles seem to ignore auto-aim, only firing directly where you're facing, not seeking out targets higher than you. Then again, this may of been original behavior?

3. The Unmaker is unbelievably OP, and only takes 4 souls per shot. Even though you can only harvest souls from possessed marines, I think it should take more per shot to justify the insane killing power. Maybe also raise the Dark Claw's soul use to reflect the amount of projectiles it fires, since it is also pretty powerful and able to pierce through multiple enemies.

So far I've played Doom 1 with all four characters (one per episode) and am going to do Doom II, haven't had any problems during the 2.0 branch.

E: The Machine Gun Guy doesn't ever seem to attack, just wander and then threaten to shoot but never actually does.


1. I can't remember exactly how I calculated the value for the damage, but it may be outdated as I switched around the damage values for the Chaingun's bullets. I should probably go back and recalculate these values! I've been considering boosting the damage for the Chaingun a bit to increase its usefulness.

2. Fixed this on my internal build, should be out in the next public build. :D

3. Currently working on rebalancing the Unmaker and Dark Claw, thanks for the feedback!

E. The Machinegunner has been fixed in the internal build, he'll be in the next build as well.

Mere_Duke wrote:
ImpieTwo wrote:
cyan0s1s wrote:Even though you can only harvest souls from possessed marines

I thought the Doom Bible had souls being harvested from demons. The marines already drop pickups, so maybe the demons should drop the unmaker powerups? (and the unmaker should be less op as well)

Yep, exactly, they are for the Unmaker and for the Red Hand, but for no reason you start with 200 (max) souls so you can't collect new. I got confused by this.
And, unmaker is OP as hell


The skulls that the Zombiemen drop are soul pickups. Are you saying that you're starting with 200 souls, rather than 0? When did you first encounter this problem?

whatup876 wrote:I used the stable 1.1 version on Consolation Prize's Doom 64 maps and the mod outright confirms that the Unmaker doesn't show up, while some items don't respawn in the test rooms for weapons and items.
Meanwhile, catching the BFG in the supposed Unmaker room won't open the gates for the three megaspheres (that replace the demon keys).


I'll investigate this issue. I think I may know what the issue is, but I'll have to check for myself.

making4 wrote:I had all the alpha items turned on except for the lost soul behavior, which I left on delta. Playing Lorelei.

Here are the only things that I wrote down:
- Chaingunners aren't dropping souls.
- I don't see enemies, keys, or items on the minimap. Not sure if that is correct or not, but some of the earlier screenshots show them.
- Minimap shows the real level geometry, not what I've explored. Not sure if that is intentional or not, but it is neat for finding secrets.
- Chain gun doesn't seem to stun, at least not archviles. I stopped trying to use it on them. I feel that it might not stun enemies at all. I also think it needs a slight damage buff, maybe 1-2 damage per bullet, or maybe a slightly faster max spin and acceleration. Maybe make it punchier but even less accurate (think Marathon 2 machinegun)?
- The helmet hud shows over my big map (tab) and blocks some things. Even if I expand the view to take it away during gameplay, it comes back on the map. I actually love the helmet hud but I don't think it should cover the map edges.
- I sort of feel that there is a delay with the bayonet between attacking and the animation starting. Was having trouble connecting with it.

One question on history: Was there ever any rationale for why the nice rifle was dropped in favor of the awful retail pistol?

And a feature request:
- I was looking at the doom bible for the first time yesterday night, and noticed heatseeking rockets - any chance of those getting into the mod? They could be an alt-fire on the launcher, though I don't know how inventory tracking or drops would work on them... maybe something the launcher can always do that consumes 2 rockets per shot?

Thanks for the great work!


- Chaingunners should drop souls in the next build, as I forgot to make them do that. Whoops!
- Stuff like enemies and keys were dropped in favor of increasing minimap performance. I've been considering reimplementing them, but I'm still worried about their impact on performance.
- Currently the minimap displays all geometry, as I haven't found a good way to handle 'seeing' the geometry of the level. I might be able to implement hidden-flagged lines, however.
- Damage buff should come in the next build. Thanks for the info about the stunlock not working, I'll have that fixed up. :D
- I haven't found a way to disable/alter the hud when in the minimap, but I'm hoping to have that fixed eventually.
- There are a couple empty tics before the bayonet gets thrust forward, similar to the vanilla fists. I could reduce the delay if its causing issues.

I'm not sure why the rifle was dropped in favor of the pistol, but I'm guessing it happened on the later half of development. As for the heatseeking rockets, maybe! I feel alt-fires on the weapons will over-complicate them in a way. Mods like MetaDoom have the arsenal built around alt-fires, while Doom Delta isn't, so their inclusion might shake things up too much.

goodjaerb wrote:Any chance someone can explain why the hud doesn't show up completely for me?


You appear to be playing in 5:4. Doom Delta does not support 5:4, unfortunately. The supported aspect ratios are 4:3, 16:9, and 16:10.
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Re: Doom Delta v2.0 BETA TEST!

Postby goodjaerb » Tue Jan 16, 2018 2:05 pm

Ugh of course. Always the simplest thing. I figured zdoom scales the HUD. I'll try this out later thanks.
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Re: Doom Delta v2.0 BETA TEST!

Postby taufan99 » Tue Jan 16, 2018 10:13 pm

DrPyspy wrote:
taufan99 wrote:EDIT: Bug report (beta v2.0)! While I was messing around with no-clipping cheat in E2M3: Refinery, I found Thi Barrett's doll in a random spot outside of the map.
Image
Which makes it impossible to finish the level at all (even after I disabled the cheat, I still couldn't pick it).


Has this bug occurred multiple times? I've tried to recreate this bug but I haven't had any luck.

Only once as far as I can remember.
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Re: Doom Delta v2.0 BETA TEST!

Postby Csonicgo » Tue Jan 23, 2018 10:10 am

Absolutely amazing! Just a few things that I noticed that could go a long way in polish:

And before anyone destroys me, I have no idea if this is possible in ZDoom, but dammit, this stuff sounds cool to me!
  • Skin color/build changes for weapons that show the character's hands and arms. Tom Hall made sure this worked in ROTT, so I am assuming he'd do the same for Doom.
  • Small text-based one-liners in the Helmet HUD. Yes, this is totally conjecture, but Tom's original example HUD had Chen commenting on some "cool stuff" she had found. I'm assuming that's not strictly for Co-op since that was so early in development. Could be something cool to throw in.
  • Scoring is way too low. Score multipliers should be added and dependent on skill : x1 for IJWTK, x1.5 for HNTR, x2 for HMP, x5 for UV, and x10 for NM. Wanna play on baby mode? Get baby score!
  • Score item spawning shouldn't be every armor bonus. can you grab thing numbers? have both health bonuses and armor bonuses only appear if their thing numbers are divisible by the number of the skill. that way there's more challenge for higher skills (and more points!) but more health + armor points for lower skill levels. IJWTK would have no score items, since kids can't be trusted with expensive things (except weapons, of course)
  • Bonuses for kills by the player within a certain number of tics. This will encourage use of the RL, SSG or BFG for some easy scoring boosts.
  • "Skill points" (just extra score) for using the environment + infighting to kill monsters instead of introducing them to buckshot.
  • Dimitri Paramo's weight, while true to the Bible, seems off. If he's a heavyweight tank, he sure doesn't have mass like one. Gonna blame Tom for this one.
  • Have Buddy Dacote be "unlockable" as a reward. Not sure how this would be handled - maybe collecting all dolls in Ultimate?
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Re: Doom Delta v2.0 BETA TEST!

Postby James Flasch » Thu Feb 01, 2018 3:17 am

Just tried out the Doom Delta 2.0 mod and it's quite good. However, the helmet HUD's minimap isn't working right - it just shows the player arrow against a blue background without the the level geometry. And I feel that the alternate HUDs should display item and secret counts, too.
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Re: Doom Delta v2.0 BETA TEST!

Postby DrPyspy » Thu Feb 15, 2018 12:51 am

Here is the release candidate build for Doom Delta 2.0! I'm feeling pretty tired at the moment and have some other stuff to work on, so I'll just put up the link and an updated changelog. Let me know if there are any bugs or suggestions you may have.

Doom Delta 2.0 RC Beta

Spoiler: Changelog
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Re: Doom Delta v2.0 BETA TEST!

Postby Lyn » Wed Feb 21, 2018 1:38 pm

As of 2.0RC, I think this is officially my favorite Doom gameplay mod. It's seriously fantastic.

The title screen is also a huge step up. The artwork is really nice!

If there is one thing I could suggest, though, is the ability to set more of the cosmetic changes back to retail. The shotgun and imp fireballs, for example.
(Sorry if it's already in there and I just missed it. I couldn't find anything like that except for the zombies/lost soul.)

I also think it would be a lot more fun if the new weapons were added/balanced as a additions to the roster rather than replacing it, but that's just my opinion.
(If they are in addition sorry then, I tried spawning some but they didn't appear to still exist. Maybe it's just me being dumb lol.)
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Re: Doom Delta v2.0 BETA TEST!

Postby DrPyspy » Thu Feb 22, 2018 6:48 pm

Csonicgo wrote:
  • Skin color/build changes for weapons that show the character's hands and arms. Tom Hall made sure this worked in ROTT, so I am assuming he'd do the same for Doom.
  • Small text-based one-liners in the Helmet HUD. Yes, this is totally conjecture, but Tom's original example HUD had Chen commenting on some "cool stuff" she had found. I'm assuming that's not strictly for Co-op since that was so early in development. Could be something cool to throw in.
  • Scoring is way too low. Score multipliers should be added and dependent on skill : x1 for IJWTK, x1.5 for HNTR, x2 for HMP, x5 for UV, and x10 for NM. Wanna play on baby mode? Get baby score!
  • Score item spawning shouldn't be every armor bonus. can you grab thing numbers? have both health bonuses and armor bonuses only appear if their thing numbers are divisible by the number of the skill. that way there's more challenge for higher skills (and more points!) but more health + armor points for lower skill levels. IJWTK would have no score items, since kids can't be trusted with expensive things (except weapons, of course)
  • Bonuses for kills by the player within a certain number of tics. This will encourage use of the RL, SSG or BFG for some easy scoring boosts.
  • "Skill points" (just extra score) for using the environment + infighting to kill monsters instead of introducing them to buckshot.
  • Dimitri Paramo's weight, while true to the Bible, seems off. If he's a heavyweight tank, he sure doesn't have mass like one. Gonna blame Tom for this one.
  • Have Buddy Dacote be "unlockable" as a reward. Not sure how this would be handled - maybe collecting all dolls in Ultimate?


- Currently the arms reflect the skin color of the character you are playing, but otherwise they are the same.
- This was actually in an early version of the mod, but was taken out due to the helmet HUD being based on 0.3 instead of 0.2. It might see a return, but I can't guarantee anything.
- Good idea! It might be too late to include in 2.0, but I'm fond of the idea.
- Interesting idea, might have to experiment further in order to get it to work that way though.
- Tempting, but I feel it may complicate the scoring system too much. I'll try it out, though.
- I have an idea of how this would work, but I'm not sure if it would actually function correctly.
- His size is a little bit exaggerated in full body pictures to emphasize his tankiness, so it may not be entirely true to what his bio says. Whoops!
- I think Buddy Dacote would be best left as an NPC, like in the Doom Bible, if I ever add story elements like that. Would be a cool easter egg, though!

James Flasch wrote:Just tried out the Doom Delta 2.0 mod and it's quite good. However, the helmet HUD's minimap isn't working right - it just shows the player arrow against a blue background without the the level geometry. And I feel that the alternate HUDs should display item and secret counts, too.


Does this happen in the release candidate build? I'll see if I can fit secret and item counts into the alternative HUDs without disrupting them too much in 3.0.

Lyn wrote:As of 2.0RC, I think this is officially my favorite Doom gameplay mod. It's seriously fantastic.

The title screen is also a huge step up. The artwork is really nice!

If there is one thing I could suggest, though, is the ability to set more of the cosmetic changes back to retail. The shotgun and imp fireballs, for example.
(Sorry if it's already in there and I just missed it. I couldn't find anything like that except for the zombies/lost soul.)

I also think it would be a lot more fun if the new weapons were added/balanced as a additions to the roster rather than replacing it, but that's just my opinion.
(If they are in addition sorry then, I tried spawning some but they didn't appear to still exist. Maybe it's just me being dumb lol.)


Thanks! There have been a lot of requests for changing the appearances of the weapons, but I'm still not sure about it. It's still on my list of things to evaluate. The fireball seems doable, though!

The only weapons that are totally replaced are the pistol and the fist. The other weapons appear in some form or another, although in the case of the Chaingun, you need to have found a Machine Gun first.
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Re: Doom Delta v2.0 BETA TEST!

Postby James Flasch » Sat Feb 24, 2018 11:12 pm

In re helmet HUD automap - I've since discovered that it does work if I decrease screen brightness a few notches, to -0.15.
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Re: Doom Delta v2.0 BETA TEST!

Postby Drake Raider » Sun Mar 04, 2018 12:16 am

Is it possible to release just the status bar/hud interface as its own file? I would like to tinker with it for an idea I have.
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Re: Doom Delta v2.0 BETA TEST!

Postby Retraux Squid » Sun Mar 11, 2018 3:00 pm

Everything seems fantastic so far. This's got to be one of my favorite mods.

Some feedback for the release candidate:
    * The Former Humans still use the old Pistol sound. They should make that "bang" rather than the sharp "POW" of the stock Doom pistol.

    * Former Lieutenants might sound better as Former Marines, since they have a dark green uniform and are equipped with the seemingly standard-issue machine guns. (That calls into question what the Rifle is; my headcanon is that it's a cheap guard's weapon meant for station peacekeeping instead of the actual military operations that the Machine Gun is meant for, hence why the security-trooper/low-ranking Former Humans tote it.)

    * Former Lieutenants could do with a helmet or their old red hair. The green hair seems consistent with Former Humans, but is a little too light, and honestly looks more like anime hair than moldy/radiation-altered hair.

    * Former Lieutenants, now spawning alone, are far less threatening than chaingunners. I suggest that instead of firing three controlled bursts, they should level their gun and release a fusillade of bullets at the normal damage values. This would still make them dangerous, but not as much as commandos. (Think a Chaingun Guy stopping shooting on his own after 10 or so shots and you'd have the right idea.)

    * Former Commandos (or whatever Chaingunners are called at the moment) could have more HP and higher bullet damage, but also have the "spin up" sequence of the Chaingun, turning them into an enemy that pressures you to kill them before they ramp up to full potential.

    * You could rarely replace Sergeants with "Former Officers" (maybe Lieutenants if you choose to rename the current ones to Marines). Former Officers would carry an "Officer's Pistol" that would look like the classic Beretta but would be very powerful, and they would have higher accuracy than other zombies in exchange for only one pellet per attack instead of a Sergeant's three.

    * The Doom Bible's Probiectile and Spray Rifle could be fun in a future version. The Probiectile's role is self explanatory (giving a readout on an enemy's vitals, information, etc.). I'm not sure about what the Spray Rifle could do, but it could become a sort of "rifle+" that occupies slot 2, firing numerous projectiles per shot, or being a sort of slow-firing, highly damaging sniper rifle.

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Re: Doom Delta v2.0 BETA TEST!

Postby Sgt Nate V » Sun Mar 18, 2018 8:28 pm

You should have player sprites where the gun is recolored to match what weapon the player is currently holding as mentioned in the Doom Bible and Press Release document.
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Re: Doom Delta v2.0 BETA TEST!

Postby Papaga » Wed Mar 21, 2018 6:23 am

People have suggested the Probiectile for another update, but it always sounded like a useless weapon to me. What good is it to know exactly how much health an enemy has, when you can spend that time killing them instead? It might be better as a powerup that shows the health of all enemies. Or, you were to add some random traits to enemies that had a huge impact, couldn't be determined without the probe, and you have to treat each enemy very differently depending on said traits. But then you'd be getting a little far from the point.

Edit: Another idea. The weapon could show you an enemy's position through walls with its outline, either by shooting one to mark it, or just scanning the area. That could be very useful, unless the minimap is supposed to show enemies already.
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Re: Doom Delta v2.0 BETA TEST!

Postby Sgt Nate V » Sun Apr 29, 2018 8:42 am

A recent version of GZDoom must've broke the Plasma Rifle. It essentially fires blanks and wastes ammo.

A suggestion would be to have a split up versions of the 0.3 and 0.5 HUDs as fullscreen huds.

EDIT: The plasma rifle didn't start firing blanks. Instead, its projectiles are now invisible. The same goes for the imp.
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