[WIP]Colourful Hell 0.97ccc (+brown Beta )

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What do with black shotgun spawn?

Poll ended at Fri Feb 19, 2016 8:24 am

keep as they are
0
No votes
modify a little for ranged options
0
No votes
Remake the crew for better variance
2
29%
Remake with focus on the leader as the boss
5
71%
Rehaul and scrap the concept, make something else shotgunny instead
0
No votes
 
Total votes : 7

Re: [WIP]Colourful Hell 0.96 cyanide

Postby bowserknight » Thu Feb 21, 2019 6:04 pm

Beezle wrote:Do the cyan monsters multiply when you 1st see and don't kill them quick enough? Slippery little bastards hehe.


not to my knowledge, the only thing I know is that the regular cyan Zombies spawn in packs of 3. Or did that happen to you with other monsters?
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Re: [WIP]Colourful Hell 0.96b cyanide

Postby Hege Cactus » Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:38 pm

Yeah they spawn in a ground

A quick fix update;
0.96b
Download

-Fixed an oversight where supershotgun dropped soulsphere instead

- blood colour for cyans should no longer be red
-Added boss flag to white lostsoul and spectre
-Removed a few boss flags from things that arent boss directly or part of boss directly
*Boss parts / phases were not effected
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Re: [WIP]Colourful Hell 0.96 cyanide

Postby Beezle » Sun Feb 24, 2019 6:56 pm

bowserknight wrote:
Beezle wrote:Do the cyan monsters multiply when you 1st see and don't kill them quick enough? Slippery little bastards hehe.


not to my knowledge, the only thing I know is that the regular cyan Zombies spawn in packs of 3.

Ah ok, that explains it, thank you bowserknight, and no, only the cyan monsters. Thanks for the update HegeCactus!
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Re: [WIP]Colourful Hell 0.96b cyanide

Postby Kellion » Mon Feb 25, 2019 5:44 pm

Goodness. So I gave this mod a few more runs... And boy does it bring in the pain fun.

Excellent for spicing up any selection of gameplay mods. Specially the more overpowered ones.

I had lots of fun with your new WhiteCybie, brilliant. Though I could only beat him legit with a fully upgraded dragon from Guncaster, and even then he's a tough cookie. I can only imagine how horrifying the EX version of that guy is going to look like.

Though I do have a few complaints. Minor stuff mostly
-The Fireblue variants look awful, looks lazy and mashed together.
-Hard to tell colored hellknights from colored Barons. Idk, the easiest solution I can think of is giving them something like a crown on their heads or a visual effect that is consistent for all Barons, except maybe bosses.
-Orange Revenant's Lost souls use hitscan attacks, though they look identical to the normal ones at a glance.
-Little customization on the monster rarities etc. I do know there's an addon for this. But its currently outdated, and I suggest it to be part of the regular mod. Possibly in a separate menu to avoid cluttering up the other options.

Now a few feature suggestions.
-Have an option to always "force" a Boss spawn every 1/2/whatever levels. (Whenever I mention "Bosses", I mean enemies important enough to warn the player at the start of a level) Guaranteeing Boss Battles every so often.
-Option to spawn EX Bosses as a random event whenever a boss is killed. My reasoning behind this is that it reduces the chance of an overly powerful boss spawning at random at a bad location, posing as a roadblock that can hardly be countered. If EX Bosses only appear from resurrections, then it guarantees that the player is capable of killing the boss in the first place. Instead of avoiding it if it had a bad spawn location.
It also increases dread whenever fighting boss type enemies ;)

In any case, great work! Looking forward to see your progress on this :D
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Re: [WIP]Colourful Hell 0.96b cyanide

Postby YasuoProjectX » Tue Feb 26, 2019 5:25 am

Those black and white monsters reminds me from Complex-Doom LCA (Nemessis and Vex Monsters)

Hey at least i can defeat them using Russian Overkill
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Re: [WIP]Colourful Hell 0.96b cyanide

Postby UTNerd24 » Tue Feb 26, 2019 9:30 pm

I feel as if there needs to be an extensive override to the White/Black Drops. Even with Boss drops set to none, Monsters such as the almighty Benellus drop waaay too many pickups. This is coming from someone using Guncaster and Russian Overkill. I am aware that these mods are meant to be OP, but its also implied that there needs to be a "Snowball Effect" in them, so getting the best things off the bat can break the flow imo.

By the way, those Yellow Revenants are properly spooky.
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Re: [WIP]Colourful Hell 0.96b cyanide

Postby fakemai » Wed Feb 27, 2019 12:43 am

UTNerd24 wrote:I feel as if there needs to be an extensive override to the White/Black Drops.

The item drops in general are necessary as a hedge against RNG totally screwing the player. The upgraded higher-end monsters can be trouble and all of the white-tiers spell disaster, and so, should have payoff for taking them on. Admittedly the extra drops across the board can be a major advantage depending on the weapon mod, but that's often more to do with the mod being imbalanced. It's also a really hard thing to balance across weapon mods because they all have different ideas for the items they replace and aren't necessarily balanced against the Doom equivalent. Take Berserk packs for example which in vanilla are pretty mediocre but different mods will do anything from making them into overall damage multipliers to weapons to a permanent buff to basically God, and these are fairly common from the lower red/abyssal enemies.

Kellion wrote:-Have an option to always "force" a Boss spawn every 1/2/whatever levels.

This I'd like to second.
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Re: [WIP]Colourful Hell 0.96b cyanide

Postby PFL » Wed Feb 27, 2019 9:26 pm

I find the best way to spawn your bosses comes from the console; changemap mapXX or changemap eXmX as much times required until you get as many bosses as you wish. You will keep your inventory too.
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Re: [WIP]Colourful Hell 0.96b cyanide

Postby bowserknight » Thu Feb 28, 2019 2:12 pm

I've been messing around with the bosses for a bit and wanted to share my thoughts on them:

Zombie (black): perfect!
Zombie (white): really like the idea, the skeletons add a whole new element to maps

Shotgunner (black): with invisibility, a really cool boss. Without it, they deal a little too much damage for being hitscan imo (if that's even true)
Shotgunner (white): hate him and always will. It's just the attack where he throws exploding shotguns at you, it happens way too fast, you can't really avoid anything he does and deals way too much damage for being the boss version of the 2nd weakest enemy in the game

Chaingunner (black): love this guy!
Chaingunner (white): hard to hit and spawns tons of stuff but I think she's fine, even tho she can be annoying

Imp (black): awesome boss!
Imp (white): also awesome boss, he seems harder than he actually is

Lost Soul (black): even tho she is annoying as all hell, I actually like her. You just have to kill the queen as soon as possible
Lost Soul (white): one of my favourite bosses!

Pinky (black): can be pretty brutal, especially when he spawns too many dogs but he's cool
Pinky (white): also very cool and intimidating boss, love how you can hear him walk around with his heavy footsteps

Spectre (black): very sneaky guy, if you don't pay attention he can assassinate you quickly but his low HP makes it pretty fair
Spectre (white): no idea where the sprite is from but I like this one, just takes ages to kill

Cacodemon (black): very devastating attacks, which have a larger hitbox than they look like because of the AOE. Still neat version of the Hades Elemental
Cacodemon (white): as horrifying, but also horribly fun boss!

Pain Elemental (black): tbh, I think this one should have some kind of cooldown on the skull cube move, it doesn't take long and the map is filled with all kinds of Lost Souls
Pain Elemental (white): this one is like the Pain Elemental's version of the white Shotgunner... way too fast, you can't really damage it with any weapon other than the Rocket Launcher or BFG since the drones absorb most of the other weapons' damage. I'd personally like if it was a little slower, or didn't spawn drones so rapidly. One of my least fav bosses, 2nd phase is fun tho

Revenant (black): I'm a little biased on this one, since it's inspired from a boss in WoW that is one of my fav bosses in the game. Cool mechanic with his shield and also a nice 2nd phase, nothing too overpowered
Revenant (white): really like this new one! Cool touch that you can't interrupt his attacks with hitscan weapons

Hellknight (black): one of the best bosses imo, I've also always loved this sprite
Hellknight (white): pretty annoying moves but still fine boss. I like how it's a reference to the Barons in E1M8

Baron (black): wonderful boss!
Baron (white): can't wait to see what this guy's gonna be...

Mancubus (black): if you stay close, he's really easy because he'll just keep using the breath which is easy to avoid. His other attacks seem harmless but can actually rack up quite some damage
Mancubus (white): a real MILF (Mancubus I love fighting). I was really frustrated of her shockwave attack until I noticed she only uses it when you're close. At close range, she's impossible tho cause that attack will kill you and you almost can't avoid it

Archvile (black): amazing design, actually seems easier than the red one sometimes
Archvile (white): I used to find this one really overpowered. Now I fought him again and it seemed he became much more passive, almost didn't summon any eye portals or use the scream at all. Maybe I just got lucky but it didn't seem NEARLY as bad as it used to be, even a little too easy.

Arachnotron (black): doesn't look special but is pretty deadly. Like this one, expect for that bouncing grenade thingy
Arachnotron (white): annoying, but with the right weapons you can deal with it quite easily

Mastermind (red): Pretty easy if you keep moving until it reaches low HP... then it spawns these sparks everywhere and it just gets too much after a short time. Red Cybie has a similiar problem
Mastermind (black): I think this may be my favourite boss of them all. The sound effects are dope it doesn't seem to have any unfair attacks
Mastermind (white): very hyped for this one...

Cyberdemon (red): At first he's a very fair and cool boss but as soon as he reaches low HP, he just becomes ridiculous. He spawns way too much shit, but the cracks in the floor spitting out fireballs are what I hate the most.
Cyberdemon (black): Really like this boss but he has some attacks that are quite troublesome. Especially the orange spheres that keep sending out flame lines in all directions
Cyberdemon (white): Amazing new boss! I just don't understand the orbiting shield, he can use it on you and just make you stuck. What do you do against it?
Last edited by bowserknight on Sun Mar 03, 2019 9:43 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: [WIP]Colourful Hell 0.96b cyanide

Postby zitro1987 » Sat Mar 02, 2019 9:25 am

I'm loving the choice to reduce item drops (and overall drops appear more balanced across the board).

I'm playing with no optional monsters nor bosses but I think my original more punishing color ratio from 0.94 remained in memory, bringing a very fun and surprisingly balanced (for this kind of mod) experience so far.

Pistol formers: good
shotgun formers: good
chaingunner formers: purple one is too accurate/damaging for a hit-scan attack, but I noticed green/blue are more reasonable now. I would expect this kind of purple devastation for red-tier, not purple, yet the red version is even more devastating Please lower damage and/or accuracy
Imps: good
Demons: good
Lost Souls: I'd love it if their hp is down 33-50% across the board. I never liked how 'tanky' the normal variant is given their purpose and color variants are therefore hardier because they have to be.
Caco: I don't think I've ever failed to dodge an attack from these. I don't find them too much of a threat (same for orange).
Hell Knight: hard to tell from baron, but good
Baron Knight: hard to tell from hell knight. Green version damage output is rather low.
Revenant: good (love some of the variants like blue)
Arachnotron: good (purple is scary, but a high-level hit-scan enemy is interesting gameplay)
Mancubus: purple is probably too difficult and may need bouncing ball duration reduced (think of combat in tight space)
Archvile: fine
Boss versions so far appear good, not game-breaking, with the spidermastermind variants being particularly inspired in design and combat. Red cyberdemon seems to stray too far in design from normal version (looks very duke-nukem)

Abyssal: please lower their chance of spawn to about 1/2 or 2/3 of red chance. They are near boss-like.

I have a lot of criticism for the optional variants (visually, thematically, and gameplay), but given they are optional I can turn them off. Abyssal are generally well designed however.
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Re: [WIP]Colourful Hell 0.96b cyanide

Postby bowserknight » Sun Mar 03, 2019 9:43 am

bowserknight wrote:Revenant (white): really like this new one! Cool touch that you can't interrupt his attacks with hitscan weapons (at least from my experience)


I think I found a bug with this one. It seems if you kill him while he's casting certain attacks, the attack will just go on forever. Happaned to me on the portal thing that shoots out electricity, I killed him and it just stayed there. Don't know if it happens with other attacks as well.
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Re: [WIP]Colourful Hell 0.96b cyanide

Postby bowserknight » Tue Mar 05, 2019 5:12 pm

Okay guys I've finally found the will to work on the test map again and I'm pretty happy how everything turned out! This should be in its nearly final state, depending on if anything else gets added other than the remaining white bosses. I really missed doing this so I hope you have some fun with this. I also removed all the messages that appear before each fight in the arena, I figured it just distracts you and if wanna find out about their HP and stuff, you can still look at them in the showcase hall.

So what does this map have?
+an arena/gauntlet where you fight through each color of each enemy one after another (designed for vanilla weapons). Most bosses have unique rooms that fit their fighting style
+a big zoo-like hall where you can take a look at all of the 136 regular monsters and read about their stats and my personal ratings for them
+4 rooms for the optional monsters with random fights, 1 for each tier. It's just to mess around a little
++as requested, I've remade the "test area" into a gladiator-like room (image below) where you can select and watch specific monsters kill each other.
And if you want, you can teleport down to the battlefield and join the action yourself



However, there are still some things that I might need to improve:
-the cyan, abyssal and gray rooms sometimes spawn fireblu Zombies and I don't know why
-the gladiator room doesn't work for black & white monsters, you can spawn them but they won't infight. For these you have to improvise by going down to them and try to make them infight yourself
-some of the arena/gauntlet fights can still be pretty unfair with vanilla weapons
-maybe add the optional tiers to the gladiator room, if anybody is interested in that
-add something for the Ex monsters

LINK:
http://www.mediafire.com/folder/w4r82azezlnaq/CH
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Re: [WIP]Colourful Hell 0.96b cyanide

Postby PFL » Sun Mar 10, 2019 8:21 pm

Cool stuff and well done. I accidently punched instead of activating a switch and everyone woke up. Soon after I got killed by the white Spectre. The bosses are stronger than their prison :) I love the monsters pedigree. The white Mancubus is surprisingly strong against Cybies.
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Re: [WIP]Colourful Hell 0.96b cyanide

Postby bowserknight » Mon Mar 11, 2019 2:20 pm

PFL wrote:Cool stuff and well done. I accidently punched instead of activating a switch and everyone woke up. Soon after I got killed by the white Spectre. The bosses are stronger than their prison :) I love the monsters pedigree. The white Mancubus is surprisingly strong against Cybies.


oh crap. You mean the monsters in the testing area woke up? I thought I put some "block sound" lines there. Only the monsters in the show area are supposed to wake up, but not able to leave. But thanks!

I updated the file in the link, the monsters shouldn't be able to be activated any more. It worked before, but I changed the linedefs and forgot to check if they still work. Also you're supposed to play with ZDoom or GZDoom rather. Not sure if this would work correctly in other programs.
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Re: [WIP]Colourful Hell 0.96b cyanide

Postby PFL » Mon Mar 11, 2019 3:31 pm

Yeah, with GZDoom and yes again they woke up both in the show room and in the testing area, moving slightly from their places. The Spectre that killed me was from the showroom and he got me there while I was watching other stats. I also see that there's only one killing switch in the testing area, being the right one; intentional ?
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