GMOTA: Fantasy arcade action, UPDATE 11/15/2019 [V1.3]

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Re: GMOTA: Fantasy arcade action, NEW UPDATE 3/16/2018 [V1.0

Postby Agitatio » Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:07 pm

Combine_Kegan wrote:The problem is if I add a music option for Doomslayer, I have no idea what to give him, future updates of GMOTA will introduce additional characters with their own playlists. Plus I was going for fitting music for each hero, Blaz gets SNES music, Kustam will get NES, and Samson will get Genesis tunes.

Doomslayer is the odd man out in many ways, seeing as he's the only character that carries more than two weapons, he's mainly a DOS/PC theme going on for his weapons and sound effects, and trying to give him a randomized playlist revolving around THAT would be a hell of an undertaking

No need for that. Maybe just have an option that lets us override Doomslayer's default music with someone's else custom music?

Options example:
Default
Blaz
Kustam
Samson
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Re: GMOTA: Fantasy arcade action, NEW UPDATE 3/16/2018 [V1.0

Postby DemonSlayer » Fri Mar 16, 2018 6:01 pm

Combine_Kegan wrote:The problem is if I add a music option for Doomslayer, I have no idea what to give him, future updates of GMOTA will introduce additional characters with their own playlists. Plus I was going for fitting music for each hero, Blaz gets SNES music, Kustam will get NES, and Samson will get Genesis tunes.

Doomslayer is the odd man out in many ways, seeing as he's the only character that carries more than two weapons, he's mainly a DOS/PC theme going on for his weapons and sound effects, and trying to give him a randomized playlist revolving around THAT would be a hell of an undertaking


Since you worked with Terminusest13 for Doomslayer the first thought I had was to incorporate midi tracks from Demonsteele for Doomslayer as his random music mode as he would be associated with Hard Rock and Heavy Metal in general as was the influence for DooM originally.
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Re: GMOTA: Fantasy arcade action, NEW UPDATE 3/16/2018 [V1.0

Postby Combine_Kegan » Fri Mar 16, 2018 10:42 pm

DemonSlayer wrote:
Combine_Kegan wrote:The problem is if I add a music option for Doomslayer, I have no idea what to give him, future updates of GMOTA will introduce additional characters with their own playlists. Plus I was going for fitting music for each hero, Blaz gets SNES music, Kustam will get NES, and Samson will get Genesis tunes.

Doomslayer is the odd man out in many ways, seeing as he's the only character that carries more than two weapons, he's mainly a DOS/PC theme going on for his weapons and sound effects, and trying to give him a randomized playlist revolving around THAT would be a hell of an undertaking


Since you worked with Terminusest13 for Doomslayer the first thought I had was to incorporate midi tracks from Demonsteele for Doomslayer as his random music mode as he would be associated with Hard Rock and Heavy Metal in general as was the influence for DooM originally.


Actually the Doomslayer was primarily me, Term didn't have much to do with him, other than helping me adjust the music system to make sure it's class specific. I did the sound design, weapon sprite editing, and the player sprite editing. But still, I think what I COULD do in the future is just make the Doomslayer's jukebox draw from all of the other hero's jukeboxes
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Re: GMOTA: Fantasy arcade action, NEW UPDATE 3/16/2018 [V1.1

Postby affandede » Sat Mar 17, 2018 1:25 am

Thanks for the fix, Keagan.

By the way, for a medievalistic Doom Slayer, I think you may try listening to Haggard's tunes for inspiration.
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Re: GMOTA: Fantasy arcade action, NEW UPDATE 3/16/2018 [V1.1

Postby Somagu » Sat Mar 17, 2018 3:36 am

If Blaz dies during his ATATA, his corpse, uh, just keeps doing it. Maybe only affects gzdoom co-op but still worth investigating and also I'm sorry you have to fix such an incredible bug.

[edit]It also seems to mess with your next one, as you'll finish your combo earlier than you normally would when you do it again.

[edit 2x]Also, Doomslayer's rockets (and thunderbuss shot) should probably go through other players like most of the rest of the projectiles do.

[edit 3x]Just had a desync in gzdoom multiplayer when my friend threw a lightning bomb. I know Zandronum is the intended sourceport and zdoom's multiplayer is cursed and all that, but it's still worth fixing, I think. Might not have been the lightning bombs, but will keep an eye out anyway.
Last edited by Somagu on Sat Mar 17, 2018 4:53 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: GMOTA: Fantasy arcade action, NEW UPDATE 3/16/2018 [V1.1

Postby Bigger C » Sat Mar 17, 2018 3:47 am

he is already undead
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Re: GMOTA: Fantasy arcade action, NEW UPDATE 3/16/2018 [V1.1

Postby Captain J » Sat Mar 17, 2018 5:46 am

Maybe he's already dead, but his hokuto shinken is invincible. So he would still punch things for next 2000 years.
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Re: GMOTA: Fantasy arcade action, NEW UPDATE 3/16/2018 [V1.1

Postby Someone64 » Sat Mar 17, 2018 7:39 am

Holy bloody hell this is damn awesome!

Also, bug report: if you activate the unleasher while holding the Sunder, the Sunder idle sound keeps playing and won't stop until you select and deselect the Sunder again.

I noticed you can throw subweapons a lot faster when unarmed. Is that intentional?

Lastly, I think the mod is a little too easy. Boss enemies are complete pushovers and can be killed way too quickly in any manner and fighting them unarmed keeps them in an almost permanent stunlock. Normal enemies aren't all that damage resistant and are killed way too easily. Doomslayer's Thunderbuss is INSANELY ammo efficient with the extreme damage it deals and seems to trump the Morning Star in every way except fire rate. Can even be used at extreme ranges. If a powerfantasy type mod is what you're going for, I'm all for it. But for now, I don't like how the only way to get a challenge is to play Knightmare mode with respawning enemies.
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Re: GMOTA: Fantasy arcade action, NEW UPDATE 3/16/2018 [V1.1

Postby KarolineDianne » Sat Mar 17, 2018 12:23 pm

Loving this so far! Though I ran into a few weird things that seemed off.

First, while I was playing as Blaz, I started to pick up 'Dark Gems' everywhere, with no real way of using them. As I found out, they're ammo for Doomslayer's rocket launcher equivalent, but I'm not sure if they're supposed to be showing up for Blaz. If they are, do they even do anything? I couldn't figure out anything that makes use of them.

Second, while I was playing as Doomslayer, I ran into a Bonelord (which was super cool btw, I love his evil laugh). No issues the first time, but the second Bonelord I ran into in the same room started flooding my screen with errors. I wasn't smart enough to save logs or screenshots, but it was something about missing sound files, I think. It primarily happened when I shot him. I was using the Thunderbuss at the time.
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Re: GMOTA: Fantasy arcade action, NEW UPDATE 3/16/2018 [V1.1

Postby Funky Gnoll » Sat Mar 17, 2018 3:48 pm

For Blaz, dark gems are ammo for his Blazter's subweapons.
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Re: GMOTA: Fantasy arcade action, NEW UPDATE 3/16/2018 [V1.1

Postby Chloroxite » Sat Mar 17, 2018 10:26 pm

Due to Blaz's new, smaller size, some maps that have keys placed up on a pedestal (such as Epic2's) have the potential to become completely broken, as you are too short to reach the keys. Only way around this is to cheat and use "fly" in the console. Please fix this.
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Re: GMOTA: Fantasy arcade action, NEW UPDATE 3/16/2018 [V1.1

Postby Asenji » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:58 am

Pretty damn fun mod. The amount of effort that went into this is impressive and just the presentation alone gives off that vibe. Playing Blaz is just pure bliss; whether its slashing something, throwing something, shooting something, punching something, its feels right. He's really simple but I'm surprised by the bit of depth he has.

Doomslayer is also super rad. Its nice seeing how you incorporated ideas from Doom 2016 into his playstyle as well as his character (like the Night Sentinels appearing during Berserk and the armor itself). The few things I'm not fond of are the shotgun and chaingun replacement. The chaingun feels a tad bit weak (might be the Q3 machine gun sound I'm accustomed to...) and the Morning Star Shotgun in particular doesn't look very appealing (its the alpha rifle and Firemace combined) and loses viability once the player gets the Thunderbuss Cannon. Otherwise, its fun shooting things with it honestly!

This mod is great and I'm hoping Kustam and Samson become welcome additions. Awesome work, Kegan.
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Re: GMOTA: Fantasy arcade action, NEW UPDATE 3/16/2018 [V1.1

Postby Combine_Kegan » Sun Mar 18, 2018 4:03 am

Someone64 wrote:Holy bloody hell this is damn awesome!

Also, bug report: if you activate the unleasher while holding the Sunder, the Sunder idle sound keeps playing and won't stop until you select and deselect the Sunder again.

Woops, added that one to the fix list.
Someone64 wrote:I noticed you can throw subweapons a lot faster when unarmed. Is that intentional?

Yes actually!

Someone64 wrote:Lastly, I think the mod is a little too easy. Boss enemies are complete pushovers and can be killed way too quickly in any manner and fighting them unarmed keeps them in an almost permanent stunlock. Normal enemies aren't all that damage resistant and are killed way too easily. Doomslayer's Thunderbuss is INSANELY ammo efficient with the extreme damage it deals and seems to trump the Morning Star in every way except fire rate. Can even be used at extreme ranges. If a powerfantasy type mod is what you're going for, I'm all for it. But for now, I don't like how the only way to get a challenge is to play Knightmare mode with respawning enemies

While Blaz is pretty much a dedicated boss killer, I am going to be tweaking things a little to make sure he can no longer do it effortlessly.


Thank you all for your feedback so far. I'll have quite a bit of work to do to sort some of this stuff out, primarily nerfing the fists, putting a range limit on the thunderbuss, a few bugs and oversights, and fixing the 100 crack fist.
I'm also going to implement an extra element into the Blazter to prevent endless subshot spam as well as make the the wave buster consume ammo, which at first my kneejerk reaction to that suggestion was a flat out no, though after thinking it over it will certainly stop bullet gems getting piled up everywhere in a level, though I'll still let players fire it if they have no bullets, but at the cost of overheating the Blazter.
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Re: GMOTA: Fantasy arcade action, NEW UPDATE 3/16/2018 [V1.1

Postby nax » Sun Mar 18, 2018 2:11 pm

keep in mind when giving balancing feedback to take into account the wads you're using. i would definitely recommend that if you have a certain criticism about the mechanics of certain items / weapons that you use said items / weapons on vastly different wads to make sure that your criticism is a consistent one about GMOTA itself, and it is not necessarily something that is critical of how GMOTA handles on a certain wad. i'd recommend when giving balance feedback that the wad(s) being played are mentioned so as to also give a good range of testable feedback.

doomslayer particularly was not meant to be one of the more challenging aspects of the mod. I've gone back and forth with Kegan on this pretty specifically, and due to the vastly different playstyles of each character (eventually), each character will more or less have its own sort of "base difficulty" due to what kits they have. the enemies of GMOTA were *generally* designed with blaz in mind - enemies like iron dukes for example are much less dangerous to the doomslayer whereas a single mistake on Blaz could result in instadeath. So doomslayer definitely has a "safety" advantage over Blaz and trying to adjust his weapons too much for the sake of challenge may negatively impact his playstyle and fun factor.
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Re: GMOTA: Fantasy arcade action, NEW UPDATE 3/16/2018 [V1.1

Postby Someone64 » Sun Mar 18, 2018 6:37 pm

Funnily enough I actually find Doomslayer harder to play on any wad as it's not nearly as easy to clear enemies at an extreme rate as it is with Blaz. Blaz seems to be extremely difficult on maps that separate ranged enemies from you using small slits through terrain and blockers, forcing you to stand at very specific angles to shoot through them and disallowing you from hooking your enemies. Experienced a lot of this on Sunlust. Otherwise Blaz is better at both crowd control and taking on single big opponents to me.

One thing that makes Doomslayer quite overpowered is quick switching, though. I don't know what it's called in games like Unreal but you can do this thing where you use the fast switch time to bypass the reload of a weapon so you can alternate firing 2 weapons to fire extremely fast since when you switch back, instead of continuing the cooldown or reload sequence it just allows you to fire again. An easy one to do is switching between Morning Star and Thunderbuss and firing every switch. Can also try Thunderbuss and the rocket launcher equivalent for more damage. The only disadvantage to doing this I've found so far is that it eats ammo. But getting ammo as the Doomslayer is pretty easy when you get enhanced melee and a Sunder.
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