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Re: Accessories to Murder (ww-doomnukem): on Github

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 11:54 am
by loismustdie555
jdredalert wrote:Well, but they are different mods with different approaches. Brutal Doom is supposed to be what it is: a gore festival. Probably has a lot of inspiration from trash/horror movies and that kind of stuff, that's why we have that much blood and gibs flying around. AtM has another approach. You have the blood, but it's not in a exaggerated amount. Enemies don't lose limbs or guts because that's not what WW intended for his mod. And when you say that you're missing "The headshots, the fatalities, the shooting off the legs of a zombieman, the variable destruction of a half dead cacodemon", you're basically saying that you miss - guess what? - playing Brutal Doom, even if it's not your intention. You can suggest Weasel to implement locational hitboxes so you can score headshots for instant kills or limbshots so you can incapacitate the enemy for example. That would be a valid way to hint what is "missing" to his mod, however you basically described what made Brutal Doom be what it is, and i doubt Weasel would implement the ludicrous gore features from BD into AtM. But that's just what i think.
I understand they are different mods. I get that. But all I'm saying, is if not implement a plugin/addon, maybe make an alternate version that works in conjunction with brutal doom. As I do love this mod. But I love the massive excessive gore of Brutal Doom. And together, they would be perfect in my opinion.

Re: Accessories to Murder (ww-doomnukem): on Github

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 12:01 pm
by Ferguson
I've had (having) a great time with this mod. For me, the Brutal thing was interesting, but got old fast. I did like the faster, more lethal bad guys and doomguys' buffed damage, but the excessive gore, IMHO, was a novelty that lost it's shine.

If someone could make a Brutal Tetris, we'd have something. ;)

Re: Accessories to Murder (ww-doomnukem): on Github

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 12:13 pm
by loismustdie555
Ferguson wrote:I've had (having) a great time with this mod. For me, the Brutal thing was interesting, but got old fast. I did like the faster, more lethal bad guys and doomguys' buffed damage, but the excessive gore, IMHO, was a novelty that lost it's shine.
Honestly, the gore isn't a novelty for me. (Not saying this applies for everyone.) It's become doom for me. Doom without brutal doom isn't fun for me anymore. Doom without this mod isn't fun for me anymore. Picking this mod or Brutal Doom for me is impossible. As they both add content that perfects the game. If they could be used together in a way like a suggested (a plugin, so as to be compatible with any variation of BD), it would be absolutely perfect.

Re: Accessories to Murder (ww-doomnukem): on Github

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 12:18 pm
by -Ghost-
Headshots are actually my favorite part of BD, locational damage is a cool thing that not many other mods do. It's a good way to get around just having bullet sponge 8000HP monsters since you can still make them tough, but then give the player a way to drop them faster if they're carefully aiming. And to be honest, I think the reason people always want compatibility stuff is because BD set a new standard for blood and gore for a lot of people, so it can feel like a step back to go back to a few splashes and puffs and blood. Doesn't mean it's right, but it's the perception people have; they don't care about the coding or anything, just the effects. I don't want to derail your thread though, so that's the last I'll say on it.

To get back on topic, does the Github version have any major changes, or is it mostly just fixes at the moment?

Re: Accessories to Murder (ww-doomnukem): on Github

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 12:21 pm
by loismustdie555
-Ghost- wrote:Headshots are actually my favorite part of BD, locational damage is a cool thing that not many other mods do. It's a good way to get around just having bullet sponge 8000HP monsters since you can still make them tough, but then give the player a way to drop them faster if they're carefully aiming.
I agree with this completely.

Re: Accessories to Murder (ww-doomnukem): on Github

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 1:16 pm
by NeuralStunner
I don't believe this mod needs that kind of feature cruft to become interesting. It's already made workable changes to gameplay without throwing everything out of sort.

Sorry, but this weird obsession with mod cross-compatibility has just become silly. Why should we be overrun by dozens of basically interchangeable mods?

Re: Accessories to Murder (ww-doomnukem): on Github

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 1:27 pm
by Zhs2
That actually sounds like a cool idea, NeuralStunner. Not realistic in the slightest, but if everything worked interchangeably then everyone would be happy!

But as for what I was actually going to post: what, is Droplets not good enough for you people? (Though this is native only to Github versions.)

Re: Accessories to Murder (ww-doomnukem): on Github

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 1:31 pm
by loismustdie555
Zhs2 wrote:but if everything worked interchangeably then everyone would be happy!
I agree with this bit.
Zhs2 wrote:But as for what I was actually going to post: what, is Droplets not good enough for you people? (Though this is native only to Github versions.)
For me? No.
There's not massive unrealistic gory explosions and huge huge amounts of gibbing, which for me (and maybe some others) doom isn't as much fun without them.

Re: Accessories to Murder (ww-doomnukem): on Github

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 1:38 pm
by wildweasel
So, basically what I'm gleaning from this discussion is that I honestly don't need to bother, then. Headshots would probably be nice in any other mod, but I'd need to rebalance significant parts of the gameplay to suit them (shotguns would become massively overpowered, for example). Maybe in some future mod.

Re: Accessories to Murder (ww-doomnukem): on Github

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 1:39 pm
by Zhs2
So, learn some DECORATE and then dive into Brutal Doom's horrible, horrible code mess, extract the code and sprites for bloody gore bits with a livesaver device, and then create a wad to patch on top of a project that replaces the blood and possibly monster deaths?

Re: Accessories to Murder (ww-doomnukem): on Github

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 1:43 pm
by loismustdie555
Zhs2 wrote:So, learn some DECORATE and then dive into Brutal Doom's horrible, horrible code mess, extract the code and sprites for bloody gore bits with a livesaver device, and then create a wad to patch on top of a project that replaces the blood and possibly monster deaths?
I've been trying non stop the entire time this conversation has been going today, and for a few hours last night.
I always end up with some errors. :(

Usually it says it's trying to register literally everything under the weapons section of the DECORATE more than once. Which is weird because I triple checked and there's no dupes.

And I'm stuck basically there.

Re: Accessories to Murder (ww-doomnukem): on Github

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 1:56 pm
by loismustdie555
Think I *might* have gotten somewhere a bit further. Here's my massive mess of an attempt to merge BDJ (Brutal Doom J) and WWDoomNukem http://www.mediafire.com/download/erhpp ... WDM555.pk3


But I get this right after the texture manager init.
Spoiler:
Could someone shed some light on what I should do?

Re: Accessories to Murder (ww-doomnukem): on Github

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 2:13 pm
by xenoxols
I could care less about brutal doom's gore, It's locational damage would work very well with this.

Re: Accessories to Murder (ww-doomnukem): on Github

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 2:15 pm
by jdredalert
loismustdie555 wrote:Think I *might* have gotten somewhere a bit further. Here's my massive mess of an attempt to merge BDJ (Brutal Doom J) and WWDoomNukem http://www.mediafire.com/download/erhpp ... WDM555.pk3


But I get this right after the texture manager init.
Spoiler:
Could someone shed some light on what I should do?
Maybe you can get something in the "How do i..." thread. That's exactly the right place for solving problems around.

Re: Accessories to Murder (ww-doomnukem): on Github

Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 2:15 pm
by Ed the Bat
From what I understand, its location-based damage, like most things in its code, is a broken, slapdash mess that barely works (and breaks a lot of other things; in this case, auto-aim). I am strongly opposed to adopting Brutal Doom's code for this.