[WIP] Project MSX - Beta 2 (v0.2a) July 22, 2013 Update!

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Re: [WIP] Project MSX - Beta 2 (v0.2a) July 22, 2013 Update!

Postby Steve1664 » Sun Oct 06, 2013 10:32 am

The completely invisible Specters still irk me, especially in ambush-heavy stuff like Speed of Doom - trying to make a quick escape only to get stuck and then chomped on while everything else toasts me gets pretty annoying. If you could make them barely visible so you can be situationally aware of them would be nice. I agree with the Karbo nerf, too; those things are just as bad both up close and at range.
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Re: [WIP] Project MSX - Beta 2 (v0.2a) July 22, 2013 Update!

Postby DEDLI » Sat Oct 12, 2013 11:29 am

Steve1664 wrote:The completely invisible Specters still irk me, especially in ambush-heavy stuff like Speed of Doom

I just came back to this thread specifically to acknowledge this, haha

But yeah, I also agree that it's very bothersome that they have no visual presence unless attacking, being damaged, or being killed. And I wouldn't say that it's total invisibility is the only part of the problem; it's that with their total invisibility combined with really fast movement speeds (and also often used by mappers as ambush monsters) they can flock you and destroy you before you even have a chance to begin a moan of frustration

As for ideas if some visual presence were to be added, I only remember seeing one that already exists and I don't remember what mod features it: visible (possibly bright-mapped) eyes.

If that idea doesn't seem original enough, an idea I just thought of would be something along the lines of, with each step the Spectre takes, a small stomp cloud appears where it's footsteps are, so if the player hears Spectres get alerted, he'll instinctively look to the ground and check for the small stomp clouds? Maybe even add in a very subtle thump sound effect for each footstep? Just spitballing.
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Re: [WIP] Project MSX - Beta 2 (v0.2a) July 22, 2013 Update!

Postby Valherran » Sat Oct 12, 2013 5:38 pm

Brutal Doom had the glowing eyes on the Specters.
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Re: [WIP] Project MSX - Beta 2 (v0.2a) July 22, 2013 Update!

Postby Mav3rick » Sat Oct 12, 2013 5:56 pm

why no add the same effect or something similiar to the "Stealth Grunt" from megaherz mod?? or another type of effect
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Re: [WIP] Project MSX - Beta 2 (v0.2a) July 22, 2013 Update!

Postby Patriot1776 » Sun Oct 13, 2013 12:06 pm

Something you could do, as an interim measure, this won't directly address the visibility problem with the spectres, is that if you haven't, go back through the thread and find the fixes that I implemented in my own copy that made the mod a little more balanced, key among them upping the damage on the autoshotgun so it's now a whole lot more useful, if you're handy with Decorate editing. I'm not going to go through the trouble of uploading my edited copy unless the mod author says its okay. But anyway, buffed shotgun gives you a means to drop the spectres a lot quicker so they are now not so much of a serious headache, since there is always a plethora of shotgun ammo to be found for the auto-shotgun on 99% of levels played with this mod.
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Re: [WIP] Project MSX - Beta 2 (v0.2a) July 22, 2013 Update!

Postby Tomawis » Thu Nov 14, 2013 1:31 pm

More stripped down HUD would be nice. While the black edges don't really block anything, it feels like it does. An option to remove them would be very nice. On that note, the low shields beeping can get pretty annoying. Again, options please.

For actual gameplay, the pistol doesn't have any reason to exist. The assault rifle has replaced all of its ammo drops and is by all means better. For Taurus, forced burst is rather impractical. It prevents me from moving to cover when I want and sometimes wastes ammo and I don't like it.

Don't let my negativity discourage you thought, otherwise I like it.
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Re: [WIP] Project MSX - Beta 2 (v0.2a) July 22, 2013 Update!

Postby DEDLI » Sun Nov 17, 2013 10:24 am

Tomawis wrote:For actual gameplay, the pistol doesn't have any reason to exist.

I have plenty of use for it. Ammo conservation for the more versatile and powerful weapons, and quick kills on Marines and Kabros. An idea for even more pistol usefulness would maybe be something like a much faster ready-up after melee, faster than the ready-up of all other firearms?

Tomawis wrote:For Taurus, forced burst is rather impractical. It prevents me from moving to cover when I want and sometimes wastes ammo and I don't like it.

Tap the trigger faster and you'll find that you are able to fire off just one shot instead of the typical two-burst.
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Re: [WIP] Project MSX - Beta 2 (v0.2a) July 22, 2013 Update!

Postby Valherran » Sun Nov 17, 2013 1:48 pm

Pistol is not useless in the slightest. If I were to modify it, I would give it uber fast weapon switch speed and a faster melee attack.
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Re: [WIP] Project MSX - Beta 2 (v0.2a) July 22, 2013 Update!

Postby Yholl » Sun Nov 17, 2013 1:49 pm

Yeah, I use the pistol more than any other weapon, it's amazingly powerful and fun to use.
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Re: [WIP] Project MSX - Beta 2 (v0.2a) July 22, 2013 Update!

Postby Tomawis » Mon Nov 18, 2013 1:19 pm

Dreadflame wrote:I have plenty of use for it. Ammo conservation for the more versatile and powerful weapons, and quick kills on Marines and Kabros. An idea for even more pistol usefulness would maybe be something like a much faster ready-up after melee, faster than the ready-up of all other firearms?

[...]

Tap the trigger faster and you'll find that you are able to fire off just one shot instead of the typical two-burst.


I did notice those things as I played a bit more, but I assumed my posts still have to be verified as I just joined..

What I said about the pistol was poorly worded. It isn't bad, but the damage doesn't make up for slower rate of fire or smaller magazine size and you don't get all that much ammo for it either. One shotting marines is fun and all, but against enemies that are a threat only in large groups there are better weapons, one of those being the assault rifle. Furthermore, I did compared hard and insane difficulty levels (My normal choice being Ultra-Violence) and noticed that on insane it doesn't always take out marines in one hit. Kabros even take three or four shots. Just so I won't sound like an idiot, I'm not complaining about this making the game hard, but rather the pistol being overshadowed by other weapons.

For the Taurus, yeah. I can tap the button faster. But unless it gets a better alt-fire, I'd rather have the option to choose.
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Re: [WIP] Project MSX - Beta 2 (v0.2a) July 22, 2013 Update!

Postby DEDLI » Mon Nov 18, 2013 3:37 pm

Tomawis wrote:What I said about the pistol was poorly worded. It isn't bad, but the damage doesn't make up for slower rate of fire or smaller magazine size and you don't get all that much ammo for it either.

I agree with the ammo part. Typically I use the pistol until I find that I'm out of ammo for it, and then I have to go through typically a whole one or two levels just so it can gather up enough ammo to use it prominently again.

Tomawis wrote:One shotting marines is fun and all, but against enemies that are a threat only in large groups there are better weapons, one of those being the assault rifle.

That's why I often use it to conserve ammo for other guns. If I'm only up against a small squad shuffling around or a few Kabros, out comes the Pistol.

Tomawis wrote:Furthermore, I did compared hard and insane difficulty levels (My normal choice being Ultra-Violence) and noticed that on insane it doesn't always take out marines in one hit. Kabros even take three or four shots.

I just checked this out, on Insane difficulty:
  • Grunt (zombieman) = one pistol shot to kill, any range
  • CQB Grunt (shotgunguy) = two pistol shows to kill, any range
  • Heavy Grunt (chaingunguy) = three pistol shots to kill, any range
  • Heavy CQB Grunt (spectre random spawn) = four pistol shots to kill, any range
  • Kabro (doomimp) = three pistol shots to kill, any range
I haven't looked at the DECORATE code yet, but it seems to me like damage output is a set number every shot (no random, approximate numbers).
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Re: [WIP] Project MSX - Beta 2 (v0.2a) July 22, 2013 Update!

Postby -Ghost- » Mon Nov 18, 2013 5:54 pm

Yeah I like the pistol in MSX. It's got good stopping power for the weaker enemies, allowing you to save ammo for the bigger guns for tougher ones. In earlier iterations of the mod where ammo was a lot more scarce it came in handy because the ammo for it was more common and it was reliable.
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Re: [WIP] Project MSX - Beta 2 (v0.2a) July 22, 2013 Update!

Postby Mav3rick » Mon Nov 18, 2013 8:53 pm

the only thing i may want is that the enemies drop pistol ammo too ;)
since the ammo that you find is no even a full clip :P
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Re: [WIP] Project MSX - Beta 2 (v0.2a) July 22, 2013 Update!

Postby Tomawis » Tue Nov 19, 2013 1:02 am

Dreadflame wrote:I just checked this out, on Insane difficulty:
  • Grunt (zombieman) = one pistol shot to kill, any range
  • CQB Grunt (shotgunguy) = two pistol shows to kill, any range
  • Heavy Grunt (chaingunguy) = three pistol shots to kill, any range
  • Heavy CQB Grunt (spectre random spawn) = four pistol shots to kill, any range
  • Kabro (doomimp) = three pistol shots to kill, any range
I haven't looked at the DECORATE code yet, but it seems to me like damage output is a set number every shot (no random, approximate numbers).


There definitely is some deviation on the damage as I managed to get some blood decals and pain sounds out of them with a pistol. It might be locational, as it happened more often when my aim was off-center.
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Re: [WIP] Project MSX - Beta 2 (v0.2a) July 22, 2013 Update!

Postby Valherran » Tue Nov 19, 2013 1:50 am

Mav3rick wrote:the only thing i may want is that the enemies drop pistol ammo too ;)
since the ammo that you find is no even a full clip :P


I think the extra baddies addon gives extra pistol ammo in drops, not entirely sure though.
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