Hideous Destructor 4.10.0b

[mumblemumble]

Interesting : I wonder if there could be uppers / downers, to counteract the heart rate, like you can have uppers, basically the current stims, more energy, higher healing, ect, but obviously a little jittery, and downer, like a pain killer, but slightly slower : might also give healing too, but lowers heart rate, lessens bleeding on average, kills pain... Might actually be fitting as an item into a medpack? Who knows. in the mean time, how bout a simple compromise : allow crouching and holding still to relax the heart rate a bit more, to simulate just sitting down for a moment : not enough to fix everything, but something.

Either way, this new system is a handful : and I still think 2 stims shouldn't be flat out lethal, but should be wonky to use, and have killer (figuratively) hangover afterwards. I also hope an OD system is put in for berserks at some point.

By the way, I really hope you reverse the change on the grenade launchers / rockets : it really messes with balance, considering the range of a typical doom engagement, and I'd much rather get a bit of shrapnel cuts than get mauled by a hoard of babuins. And the rocket doesn't make sense how it could stop, considering the rocket fuel is already ignited : how would the ignition suddenly stop? I figure if the jet fuel is already burning, it crashing alone might set off the explosive charge from the burning jet fuel / the crash combining to crack open the device, and ignite the charge : I just cant see it working in rocket mode, but Im not an engineer. But the biggest takeaway is, even with the damage risk, the current range makes a lot of rooms that WERE possible now impossible : and this is more important, considering its doom, than shrapnel risk (especially since the player can still hit the deck)

So I played more with berserk and I'm...sort of...getting a feeling of how it works. I was on map03 of TNT, and got badly burned by an imp at the big roundabout room with all the teleports, so I popped a berserk : and man is it great, going around like a maniac. I killed a herp while running at it full speed with 4 blasts from the hunter, and had to switch to punching cause I didn't want to unload, and also because I would accidentally fire due the to berserk my 2 shells out of the slayer. On coming down, I began to have a heart attack : not suprising considering how bad I got burnt, and how much I was hauling ass, so I sit down, and try to cool off, only it keeps going down. I started to worry, and at 30 hp I popped another berserk, and this time CAREFULLY cleaned out the rest of the area, going much slower. I come down again, and still have a heart attack, but survive at 40 hp.

I guess I'm getting the hang of it, But I worry about fatigue / heart rate raising being so common, while means to reduce it are almost non existient. Spiritual healing sources most certainly need to be reworked, as does the heart rate : its not a bad idea, but being unable to run due to a slightly high heart rate seems off. I think maybe there should be heart rate and THEN fatigue, assuming this isn't already in, and make the heart rate dictate how much fatigue actions take, while a higher heart rate itself adds a little fatigue : this way getting a higher heart rate helps keep energy in the longer term, and suddenly sprinting from a calm point will tire you out faster than sprinting when worked up. Beyond that, I still think a pain killer / mild sedative could be useful for sniping, the TB (its useless almost if you are jittery) or lowering a nasty heart rate. This model would also fix the current issue of stims breaking sprint, which makes no sense, I would expect a stim to BOOST my ability to sprint.

Beyond that, a few other things I noticed : barrels are currently moved by wall debris from gunshots, which is highly unrealistic. healing rate when moving (just a combat jog, nothing else) could be a bit higher. I can understand it being less than being still, but currently moving around, particularly when it comes to having used a stim, does not heal very much. This could also apply to spheres, once you get around to fixing them : currently they feel useless, short of the wiping off aggravated and lethal damage. Sprint speed is currently same for running backwards and forwards, while diagonal forwards is very slow : shouldn't it be a slow decline in speed based on how forward it is, where forward it max, reverse is minimum, and sprinting at all raises speed just slightly? Beyond that sprint has no effect on stamina or heart rate, which is cool on one hand, but obviously broken. Items which zoom towards you when grabbed can activate teleport lines. This isn't always a problem, but can end up breaking some maps. map 73 on dump doesn't really break, but it does make the key teleport to another part in the map at the yellow skull room, assuming you play on ugly. Stims can be removed from inventory when trying to inject them, without them actually injecting (pull up on mouse when firing, you might lose a stim, but never inject it)

Besides the dud range for rockets, I like the new change with shrapnel : I had an issue where I put a derp down a lift, and the lift got filled with 2 babuins, 2 imps, and 1 chaingunner. I figured my derp dead, so I fired a rocket straight down, killing everything...but my derp. Turns out Bodies can somewhat act as shrapnel shields, saving my derp. Sweet, though the grenades seriously need the old detonation range back, as well as no dud rocket mode.

I know I've stated it elsewhere, but heart rate and fatigue being the same thing is really a mess : it means anything which raises heart rate, even meds makes you tired, means you have more stamina when your blood isn't flowing, and generally makes the stamina metagame far messier than before. I think it would be the best idea to seperate heart rate and fatigue, and maybe make heart rate / fatigue effect each other, and player mechanics in various ways. I figure this could be very interesting and more diverse than the current method, like injuries adding fatigue in general, while having a higher heart rate lowers fatigue gain / regenerated fatigue faster, while still having medical issues / heal rate / jitteryness. This could also adopt 2 playstyles : having a low heart rate, to be cautious and precise, or high heart rate, being agile, swifter, more effected by adrenaline, but shakier and less careful. Could also make managing fatigue more interesting : like you could conceivably stretch fatigue out more IF you got your heart rate up prior, then let fatigue settle with the heart rate up, and THEN did the strenuous thing. Much like real life going in with a high heart rate would do you better than trying to sprint suddenly from a calm standing around heart rate : and it would also potentially fix the issue with stims, if you made stims remove fatige, but raise heart rate. If combined with pain killers / stims (downers and uppers) it could make a very interesting meta where currently its a bit of a bogged down mess.

....I really need to make a format for this crap, rather than just making a million half organized comments.

[Fort of Hard Knox]

Use the spoiler feature, and add little titles.

I agree with the berserk OD mechanic, which I've been hoping for and wondering about for a while. Also a slight tweak to "when you can run and when you're slightly over heart rate" would be awesome

[Matt]

Sprint speed is currently same for running backwards and forwards, while diagonal forwards is very slow : shouldn't it be a slow decline in speed based on how forward it is, where forward it max, reverse is minimum, and sprinting at all raises speed just slightly?

Bug, whoops. Fixed as of latest commit.

Separating out fatigue is a good idea that I will not be implementing today because I'm too tired to think through what would be required at this point.

[Silentdarkness12]

So, I have some bad news regarding the HD playthrough.

My save is kaput because i'm a dumb-dumb, who doesn't seperate out different versions of GZDoom.

Should I update to the latest version and '''''''''''''''''start over'''''''''''''? Or is the game still horribly unstable becauze ZScript compatible?

[AvzinElkein]

When I tried to load under 3.0.1, I got an error, and thus didn't start the game:

---

OS: Windows NT (NT 10.0) Build 15063

M_LoadDefaults: Load system defaults.
Using program directory for storage
W_Init: Init WADfiles.
adding C:/gzdoom-bin-3-1-0a-x64/gzdoom.pk3, 717 lumps
adding ./doom.wad, 2306 lumps
adding C:/gzdoom-bin-3-1-0a-x64/HideousDestructor-3.1.0.1.zip, 205 lumps
adding C:/gzdoom-bin-3-1-0a-x64/HideousDestructor-3.1.0.1.zip:demonicron_pinkies.wad, 60 lumps
adding C:/gzdoom-bin-3-1-0a-x64/HideousDestructor-3.1.0.1.zip:femdmug.wad, 42 lumps
adding C:/gzdoom-bin-3-1-0a-x64/HideousDestructor-3.1.0.1.zip:hdgfx.wad, 202 lumps
adding C:/gzdoom-bin-3-1-0a-x64/HideousDestructor-3.1.0.1.zip:range.wad, 3 lumps
I_Init: Setting up machine state.
CPU speed: 2494 MHz
CPU Vendor ID: GenuineIntel
Name: Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-4710MQ CPU @ 2.50GHz
Family 6, Model 60, Stepping 3
Features: SSE2 SSE3 SSSE3 SSE4.1 SSE4.2
I_InitSound: Initializing OpenAL
Opened device OpenAL Soft on Speakers (High Definition Audio Device)
EFX enabled
Renderer: OpenGL
V_Init: allocate screen.
S_Init: Setting up sound.
ST_Init: Init startup screen.
Checking cmd-line parameters...
S_InitData: Load sound definitions.
G_ParseMapInfo: Load map definitions.
Texman.Init: Init texture manager.
Invalid data encountered for texture HideousDestructor-3.1.0.1.zip:sprites/
ParseTeamInfo: Load team definitions.
LoadActors: Load actor definitions.
script parsing took 355.27 ms
R_Init: Init Doom refresh subsystem.
DecalLibrary: Load decals.
M_Init: Init menus.
P_Init: Init Playloop state.
ParseSBarInfo: Loading custom status bar definition.
D_CheckNetGame: Checking network game status.
player 1 of 1 (1 nodes)
I_InitInput
I_StartupMouse
I_StartupKeyboard
I_StartupXInput
I_StartupRawPS2
I_StartupDirectInputJoystick
GL_VENDOR: NVIDIA Corporation
GL_RENDERER: GeForce GT 745M/PCIe/SSE2
GL_VERSION: 4.5.0 NVIDIA 376.54 (Core profile)
GL_SHADING_LANGUAGE_VERSION: 4.50 NVIDIA

Max. texture size: 16384
Max. texture units: 32
Max. varying: 124
Max. combined shader storage blocks: 96
Max. vertex shader storage blocks: 16
Resolution: 1920 x 1080
]error_fatal Whoops!

Execution could not continue.

Whoops!

[Matt]

SD: I'm hoping to get a release out by the end of this weekend. Besides some tweaks to the new fatigue balance and any game-breaking bugs that come up, I don't have any changes that don't entail a long stretch of unstable devbuilds.

AE: As mentioned in the PM, I can't tell what's going on from that. Also 3.0.1 is no longer supported.

[Silentdarkness12]

So maybe i'll just update my HD when the next version comes out, then, and try to catch back up on the HD playthrough.

EDIT: Granted, I had just started E2, so that won't actually be so bad.

Also, I have a modified WadSmooshed Doom that'll play all the wads through in order. So things are gonna be streamlined now, guys. : P

[Matt]

And here's 3.1.0.2!

Changes:

• Bugfixes:
  • Babuins would be launched 10 feet into the air with every punch.
  • Hand grenades would crash the game on detonation if two were stopped and overlapping each other.
  • The new SlowProjectile could go through walls at certain speeds.
  • Divide by zero error on heart rate tracker.
• Custom loadouts! Go to the player menu for more details.
• Fatigue tracking is once more independent of heart rate. Heart rate is dependent on fatigue tracking, as it should be.
• More side effects from drugs! Ironic that I'm posting this release upon discovering an album called "Life starts at 200bpm".
• Updated ZScript version to 3.1.0.
• Reduced minimum arming distance for gyro-grenades.
• New pickup graphics for the shotguns.

[AvzinElkein]

And here's 3.1.0.2!

Changes:

• Bugfixes:
  • Babuins would be launched 10 feet into the air with every punch.
  • Hand grenades would crash the game on detonation if two were stopped and overlapping each other.
  • The new SlowProjectile could go through walls at certain speeds.
  • Divide by zero error on heart rate tracker.
• Custom loadouts! Go to the player menu for more details.
• Fatigue tracking is once more independent of heart rate. Heart rate is dependent on fatigue tracking, as it should be.
• More side effects from drugs! Ironic that I'm posting this release upon discovering an album called "Life begins at 200bpm".
• Updated ZScript version to 3.1.0.
• Reduced minimum arming distance for gyro-grenades.
• New pickup graphics for the shotguns.

I still get the "invalid data" thing.

[Matt]

That is odd - I get that same warning when I load the zip, but not if I unzip everything into a folder and load the folder.

Everything runs fine besides that, though.

[Leon_Portier]

Great! Now it is even better to make the last stand with the auto pistol while tripping on stimpaks.

[Silentdarkness12]

Ah, cool. I like the look of this.

What is Spooky difficulty tho?

Also, a suggestion for the next update would be to be able to fine-tune the grimdark encumbrance. I like the idea of encumbrance, but it could use some toning down for singleplayer as to be fair.

Additionally, i'm running into a GZDoom crash on the latest dev build when trying to launch HD on the Lost Episodes of Doom.

[mumblemumble]

---

Seems the TB is still very off : the bolt mode doesn't reliably 1 shot cacos or arachnotrons anymore, and spray mode takes around 5 zaps to kill an imp, where it took 1 before. I think some numbers are very off, as the gun is far less beefy than the older versions. On the plus side, its more reactive and easier to fire than before.

Currently the bronto cannon in custom menu also gives a bfg9000. As a side note, expanding the slots for items to 15 wouldn't be a bad idea...

Curerntly theres no way to climb up to the grenadier in my office-assault map, you can climb onto the APC tracks, but not onto the gunner seat. This really messes with the balance, are you are supposed to collect the rocket launcher when he ends up dying

The libby reloads the grenade launcher by holding alt fire for only a couple ticks, but this is obscenely irritating, I've often reloaded when I want to fire bullets, and gotten owned from this. is this a feature, or a bug?

[Matt]

Liberator: no idea why that happens. Patched if not fixed. (i.e., it doesn't do that anymore, but I have not resolved whatever the underlying problem might be)

Bronto/BFG: Fixed.

Extra items: ...turns out it can easily go into 2 digits seamlessly. Will still limit to 20 because fuck trying to maintain that long scroll of spagetti for that menu.

Office Assault: I can climb on to the top of that APC just fine, I just need to switch to fists first.

Thunder Buster: The pre-ZScript damage was originally a bug. Will do something about battery usage.

[Silentdarkness12]

psst

Vae-sempai

How about my question, suggestion and bug report? : P