Zombi: The Flesh Moves!

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Retraux Squid
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Re: Zombi: The Flesh Moves!

Post by Retraux Squid »

You could possibly add the original Former Humans as a Chaingunner replacement. They'd shoot three times rapidly and have the same resurrecting behavior but wouldn't infight and would be a little more resilient. Feels like a good way to add hitscan zombies of some kind without totally breaking the flow of gameplay.
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jdredalert
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Re: Zombi: The Flesh Moves!

Post by jdredalert »

NeenerWiener wrote: Also quick question for you all, should the Zombie's health be lower so it can be easier to kill or do you all like their current health.
There are some ways to balance the zombies without the need of nerfing health. I like the fact that they are resilient, that's how zombies are supposed to be. However what is breaking the balance is the fact that the player doesn't have any countermeasures to permanently kill the zeds in early game. I know that you said that the idea is to make the player run for the exit instead of taking every single monster down, but in some maps filled with tight corridors and never ending hordes of zombies (like map02), things go south pretty fast for the player even if you're trying to avoid them.

What i'm suggesting are ways to make the zombies killable for good. First, there's the popular headshot feature. Plain and simple, and faithful to your classic Romero approach. If you think that headshots would be too exploitable and take away the tension of the game, you could try making random critical hits that grants free kills. Since you're using RE 3 sounds, i assume that you're a fan of the game and must be familiarized with the EAGLE 6.0 Custom handgun that randomly explodes zombies heads. It's the same idea, plus would make the pistol more useful than the regular pea shooter. For shotguns, you could go in a different approach, based on the distance that you take the zombie down. Point blank kills could make the zombie explode into a pile of bloody goo (the XDeath would suit fine for now), while zombies killed in a greater distance would fall but rise again.

These are my ideas. If you like them but have some doubts about how to implement, again, feel free to ask me via pm. I'll gladly help.
Last edited by jdredalert on Fri Oct 20, 2017 12:00 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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NeenerWiener
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Re: Zombi: The Flesh Moves!

Post by NeenerWiener »

jdredalert wrote:
NeenerWiener wrote: Also quick question for you all, should the Zombie's health be lower so it can be easier to kill or do you all like their current health.
There are some ways to balance the zombies without the need of nerfing health. I like the fact that they are resilient, that's how zombies are supposed to be. However what is breaking the balance is the fact that the player doesn't have any countermeasures to permanently kill the zeds in early game. I know that you said that the idea is to make the player run for the exit instead of taking every single monster down, but in some maps filled with tight corridors and never ending hordes of zombies (like map02), things go south pretty fast for the player even if you're trying to avoid them.

What i'm suggesting are ways to make the zombies killable for good. First, there's the popular headshot feature. Plain and simple, and faithful to your classic Romero approach. If you think that headshots would be too exploitable and take away the tension of the game, you could try making random critical hits that grants free kills. Since you're using RE 3 sounds, i assume that you're a fan of the game and must be familiarized with the EAGLE 6.0 Custom handgun that randomly explodes zombies heads. It's the same idea, plus would make the pistol more useful than the regular pea shooter. For shotguns, you could go in a different approach, based on the distance that you take the zombie down. Point blank kills could make the zombie explode into a pile of bloody goo (the XDeath would suit fine for now), while zombies killed in a greater distance would fall but rise again.

These are my ideas. If you like them but have some doubts about how to implement, again, feel free to ask me via pm. I'll gladly help.
That actually sounds perfect! I was considering doing a quick fix and just lower the health but from the tests, it made the zombies a cakewalk, which was not what I'm going for. But the random chance of headshots or crit hits could be a great suggestion. And it fits with the George Romero and Resident Evil inspiration. It could give you incentive to stand your ground too.
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NeenerWiener
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Re: Zombi: The Flesh Moves!

Post by NeenerWiener »

So I'm a little at another stump here. I did manage to fix the issue with the XDeath. So the Zombies should now be able to die from explosions (Will post link with that fix soon.) And I've taken jdredalert's suggestion on having random crits. So right now I'm making the Pain state have a random chance of giving the zombie a crit death, instantly killing him (Also yes I can see it's 255, it's like that right now so I can see the effect right away, will change to a more reasonable number later.). Problem is that their dead body is still shootable, as if they aren't dead. And they seem to drop more ammo. I'm wondering if I should change the extra ammo drop or maybe leave it as a little reward for getting a crit.

Code: Select all

Pain:
    NAZI H 0 A_Pain
	TNT1 A 0 A_Jump(255,"CritDeath")
	Goto See
  Melee:
    NAZI E 0 A_FaceTarget
    NAZI E 0 A_Recoil(-2)
	NAZI EF 4 A_FaceTarget
	NAZI F 3 A_MeleeAttack
	NAZI A 15
	Goto See
  Death:
	NAZI I 0 A_PlaySound("zombie/crack",0)
    NAZI I 1 A_Scream
	TNT1 A 0 A_PlaySound("zombie/fall",0,0.4)
	NAZI J 7 A_NoBlocking
    NAZI IJKLMN 2
	NAZI N 512
	NAZI N -1 Thing_Raise(0)  
	Stop
   Raise: 
       NAZI LKJ 5 
       Goto See 
   CritDeath:
	HZOM A 15 A_PlaySound ("Zombie/Headshot",0)
	TNT1 A 0 A_SpawnItemEx("Gore_Gibbed",random(-1,1),random(-1,1),random(4,16),random(-2,2),random(-2,2),random(-2,2),SXF_CLIENTSIDE)
    TNT1 A 0 A_SpawnItemEx("Gore_Gibbed",random(-2,2),random(-2,2),random(12,14),random(-6,6),random(-6,6),random(6,14),0,SXF_CLIENTSIDE,32)
	TNT1 A 0 A_SpawnItemEx("Gore_",12,random(-2,2),random(12,14),random(0,1),0,0,SXF_CLIENTSIDE)
	HZOM B 1 A_Scream
	HZOM C 0 
	HZOM DEFG 2 A_Fall
	HZOM G -1	A_NoBlocking
	Stop
Blue Shadow
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Re: Zombi: The Flesh Moves!

Post by Blue Shadow »

NeenerWiener wrote:Problem is that their dead body is still shootable, as if they aren't dead. And they seem to drop more ammo.
A mere jump to a "death" state isn't enough to kill an actor properly. There are a lot of stuff to take care of to ensure a proper death. Luckily, [wiki=A_Die]you don't need to do all of that yourself[/wiki]. As for multiple drops, it's the repeated calls to [wiki=A_NoBlocking]A_Fall/A_NoBlocking[/wiki] that's causing that.
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EddieMann
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Re: Zombi: The Flesh Moves!

Post by EddieMann »

This raises a very good opportunity for a fun puzzle wad, hell maybe even add robot zombies with weak peashooters that do single-digit damage.
Image
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NeenerWiener
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Re: Zombi: The Flesh Moves!

Post by NeenerWiener »

Hello everyone, here to let you know that I'll upload what my work is so far, don't wanna make you think I'm doing nothing. This mod really has been helping me learn more about DECORATE and the sort and I'm happy about it. Keep in mind that I'm still not perfectly knowledgeable in DECORATE so it can explain why it looks rough around the edges still.

DOWNLOAD HERE ---> http://www.mediafire.com/file/o6zi9flqw ... er2%29.pk3

So far it looks like I have fixed the XDeath issue, if it's still not working let me know. I have also managed to get a temporary remedy for the crit death. Issue is that they won't show on your killcount since I've technically made them just unhittable and cannot be brought back to normal once they are in the crit death state.

I have also put in the Occultist I talked about, he right now replaces the Fatso and Pain Elemental. Hitscan enemy and can summon a zombie. (As I said before, right now he currently just spews out the zombie.) and the zombie he spews out is the new one I'm working on. It's a zombie that will hop towards you at faster speeds. Has lower health though and his damage is lower so it won't be unfair, not able to get back up to keep maps from being overwhelming if they're around. So far it's still really early in the making so I borrowed almost all the code from the generic zombie enemy. Both the Cultist and Zombie are using placeholder sprites. Cultist using the Blood Cultist sprites, hoping to find some good cultist sprites that are not the Blood ones. And the jumping zombie is using the normal zombie sprites.

Sorry if it's not much changes, still new at this and been busy.

Like I said before, any suggestion is welcomed.
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jdredalert
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Re: Zombi: The Flesh Moves!

Post by jdredalert »

Downloaded and tested the new version. Just sent you a PM on with a quick fix for you to use on the death states. Also, do you plan to add custom weapons?
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NeenerWiener
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Re: Zombi: The Flesh Moves!

Post by NeenerWiener »

jdredalert wrote:Downloaded and tested the new version. Just sent you a PM on with a quick fix for you to use on the death states. Also, do you plan to add custom weapons?
Thank you for the quick fix there, was confused why the corpses were disappearing. And no I don't really plan to add custom weapons to this. I'm trying to make this a little enemy replacement mod so you can use any weapon mod of your choice. I could recommend some weapon mods at least if it will help. Sorry.
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Gabbuz85
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Re: Zombi: The Flesh Moves!

Post by Gabbuz85 »

NeenerWiener wrote:Cultist using the Blood Cultist sprites, hoping to find some good cultist sprites that are not the Blood ones.
I found this: http://realm667.com/index.php/en/beasti ... 94-cultist

Also, what you think about this type of zombie?
http://www.realm667.com/index.php/en/be ... bie-fodder
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-Ghost-
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Re: Zombi: The Flesh Moves!

Post by -Ghost- »

I think actual, player aimed headshots might be a better bet. Even just playing regular Doom 2 it's really easy to get boxed in and killed because you just can't put them down quickly enough. Can you do both together, so that a headshot usually puts them down, but there's a chance they still get back up since you just "winged" the brain instead of destroying it or something?
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NeenerWiener
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Re: Zombi: The Flesh Moves!

Post by NeenerWiener »

-Ghost- wrote:I think actual, player aimed headshots might be a better bet. Even just playing regular Doom 2 it's really easy to get boxed in and killed because you just can't put them down quickly enough. Can you do both together, so that a headshot usually puts them down, but there's a chance they still get back up since you just "winged" the brain instead of destroying it or something?
I've considered using the headshot script that jdredalert recommended to me. The issue I'm concerned with is that if the ability to simply aim at the head (Which I think may be a little easy considering the movement speed of the zombies and how they line up most of the time.) will wipe away the threat of the horde, changing the original focus from getting away from them all to the exit to now just wiping them all out.

Also because I'm a little confused on how to implement this mechanic to the enemies.
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Gabbuz85
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Re: Zombi: The Flesh Moves!

Post by Gabbuz85 »

maybe someone will hate me if I say it, but have you thought of using brutal doom monsters as a base? each monster has several hitboxes...

I made this for you. It's a scientific fact that zombies have to bite people. :wink:
Attachments
(credits to horrormovieguy and CaptainToenail)
(credits to horrormovieguy and CaptainToenail)
zombiebite.png (1.22 KiB) Viewed 574 times
Last edited by Gabbuz85 on Mon Oct 23, 2017 5:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
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jdredalert
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Re: Zombi: The Flesh Moves!

Post by jdredalert »

Brutal Doom's hitboxes were made in a very hacky, complicated way. It's a mess, specially for someone that is starting to coding. I believe it would be better for Neener if he used the universal headshot zscript method i have linked a few posts above.
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Gabbuz85
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Re: Zombi: The Flesh Moves!

Post by Gabbuz85 »

yeah, you're right.

oh, I forgot... BOOM, HEADSHOT!!! :D
Attachments
(credits to CaptainToenail and Mike12)
(credits to CaptainToenail and Mike12)
zombieheadshot.png (4.31 KiB) Viewed 553 times
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