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[WIP] Retribution (or the TNT Experiment?)

PostPosted: Mon Dec 31, 2018 6:41 pm
by Maniac
Only requires TNT to run as of Alpha 4a

Here's an ancient map pack dusted off from the SkullTag days. I was originally going to let this project die back in 2010 after then 6 years off and on (mostly off) development, but was recently convinced by blzut to rejuvenate it and push it out because it's "just levels and not another gameplay mod".

In terms of style, Xaser put it perfectly as "the TNT Experiment" back when he was testing it years ago. I'd describe the style as enhanced but classic (it's an old project after all), so don't expect anything groundbreaking (visuals or gameplay). Difficulty settings are not implemented yet, so it's all Hurt Me Plenty at the moment. That having been said, it shouldn't be too difficult as I made sure I could comfortably complete each map from a pistol start, but you might need to know when to optimally use certain power-ups.

Due to the demands of part-time Grad school plus full-time work, I'm not expecting to get this project done anytime soon (it's already been 14 years as of 2018 so what's the hurry :P), but I'm hoping that I can keep the progress steady so it doesn't sit for almost a decade like it has. Here are the links:

Alpha 4a - 2019 Jan 03
Alpha 4 - 2018 Dec 31

Screenshots:

http://maniacsvault.net/dumpster/RETRIBA4/SCREENSHOT1.png
http://maniacsvault.net/dumpster/RETRIBA4/SCREENSHOT2.png
http://maniacsvault.net/dumpster/RETRIBA4/SCREENSHOT3.png
http://maniacsvault.net/dumpster/RETRIBA4/SCREENSHOT4.png

Re: [WIP] Retribution (or the TNT Experiment?)

PostPosted: Mon Dec 31, 2018 11:12 pm
by Gideon020
Why does it need two IWADs to run?

Re: [WIP] Retribution (or the TNT Experiment?)

PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2019 12:55 am
by Rachael
I'm guessing probably because it uses resources from both.

Re: [WIP] Retribution (or the TNT Experiment?)

PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2019 4:55 am
by Tango
hot diggity, looks awesome. I am a sucker for liberal METAL* usage! really love the environment in that first shot, and the heavy contrast in the second especially.

quite pleasantly surprised to see you around still Maniac :D

Re: [WIP] Retribution (or the TNT Experiment?)

PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2019 7:39 am
by SiFi270
Loading Plutonia with gameinfo doesn't seem to work. Maybe things would work better if it set the iwad to Wadsmoosh instead?

Re: [WIP] Retribution (or the TNT Experiment?)

PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2019 8:01 am
by _mental_
You need to select TNT: Evilution as IWAD. Plutonia will be loaded automatically.
GAMEINFO wrote:IWAD = "TNT.WAD"
LOAD = "PLUTONIA.WAD"

Re: [WIP] Retribution (or the TNT Experiment?)

PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2019 8:10 am
by Enjay
SiFi270 wrote:Loading Plutonia with gameinfo doesn't seem to work. Maybe things would work better if it set the iwad to Wadsmoosh instead?


And make it need an IWAD that requires the user to download an additional program, set it up tom work, run it and take the resulting file and use it as an IWAD? That seems way too clumsy if you want a lot of people to play your map. I know that quite a few people will have a WADSmooshed IWAD, but plenty of other won't. I only made one to see if it would work and then binned it pretty quickly, so I don't even have one.

There are much easier, much more portable ways of doing it.

Any way, simply adding PLUTONIA.WAD to the command line before RETRIBA4.PK7 works just fine (like people might do with a more traditional required resource WAD). (The GAMEINFO doesn't work for me either simply because of how my setup is.)

Re: [WIP] Retribution (or the TNT Experiment?)

PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2019 10:03 am
by _mental_
Enjay wrote:(The GAMEINFO doesn't work for me either simply because of how my setup is.)

Plutonia.wad needs to be loaded explicitly via -file switch only if it's not in the list of WAD search paths (it may include a directory with the executable and/or the current directory).
I guess your setup falls into this category.

Thanks to archviles and pain elementals I ended E1M6 with 752 monsters killed while their initial count was 403 ;)
BTW, is the secret sector #351 on this map reachable without noclip?

Re: [WIP] Retribution (or the TNT Experiment?)

PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2019 10:52 am
by Enjay
_mental_ wrote:I guess your setup falls into this category.

Yarp. I have most of my IWADs in a directory not in any of the search paths and I use ZDL to set up the associations for each base game (which uses the -iwad parameter). I almost always launch via ZDL and I almost never double-click the GZDoom exe so this setup does exactly what I want. However, it does mean that cases like this fail. (I say cases. This is the first time that I remember it failing and I expected it, so I knew the solution immediately anyway.)

Re: [WIP] Retribution (or the TNT Experiment?)

PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2019 3:02 am
by Maniac
Wow, I didn't think requiring 2 IWADs (specifically, it uses texture patches from both) would cause any issues. Now that I think of it, it wouldn't be a problem for me to delete GAMEINFO, include the plutonia textures, and just require TNT.wad. I'm all ears if anyone has better ideas too, and I agree with Enjay about the problem of requiring a Wadsmooshed IWAD.

I'll post an Alpha 4a update soon to eliminate the 2 IWAD requirement.

Tango wrote:hot diggity, looks awesome. I am a sucker for liberal METAL* usage! really love the environment in that first shot, and the heavy contrast in the second especially.

quite pleasantly surprised to see you around still Maniac :D


Heh, university and career have kept me more than occupied - When I faded out from the community, your latest project at the time was the Redemption series I think :wink:

_mental_ wrote:Thanks to archviles and pain elementals I ended E1M6 with 752 monsters killed while their initial count was 403 ;)
BTW, is the secret sector #351 on this map reachable without noclip?


Dang, I rarely finish E1M6 with more than 500 kills at 100%

Regarding secret sector #351, there are at least 2 ways you can do it without noclip...

Spoiler:

Re: [WIP] Retribution (or the TNT Experiment?)

PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2019 8:34 am
by _mental_
In E2M3 sector #170 to #173 leave small halls like this one when raised
Screenshot_Doom_20190102_152134.jpg
Honestly, this map is a bit annoying with lots of monsters on high ground.

Re: [WIP] Retribution (or the TNT Experiment?)

PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2019 3:42 am
by Maniac
The Alpha 4a quick update is now out and only requires TNT to run (no more 2 IWAD requirement)!

Thanks for spotting that, _mental_! I typically use the software renderer hence why I didn't see them. It also appears that E1M1 has a giant hole near the start that doesn't show in software renderer too... I'm not quite sure what's going on with that one though.

Those holes in E2M3 should be gone now in the latest release. I also made a few other changes to E2M3 such as removing those high ground imps near the exit, which really weren't contributing anything. Hopefully these tweaks make the map a little less annoying and a little more challenging.