[Project] "Knee-Deep in ZDoom"

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Nmn
Posts: 4614
Joined: Fri Apr 16, 2004 1:41 pm

Post by Nmn »

Curry is just jealous ;) Why play a cool undetailed map when You can play a cool detailed one?
Seriously some people tend to hide conceptual blandness under a really high build quality (meaning they disguise lack of originality under bootiful detail) but definately not Tormentor. I played his e1m8 so I know what I'm saying.
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Tormentor667
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Post by Tormentor667 »

@Nmn & arcticwolf - Thx for your comments, first at all it's nice to hear that and well, I have nothing to say to Curunir about that. I never just add detail to hide that my maps lack of atmosphere, first at all, the atmosphere itself is important and then I build up the eyecandy around that. Nevertheless, back to the topic itself ;) Does anyone else have some screenies?! :)
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Risen
Posts: 5263
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2004 1:02 pm
Location: N44°30' W073°05'

Post by Risen »

Tormentor667 wrote:Well, to be honest, I didn't want to say anything with the stats, just some overview for others (because you always can connect stats with detail if I am working on a map like this, but that sounds arrogant, so please forget about it).
And don't get me wrong, Risen, if I say that some of your and Lexus' parts needed a major touch up. I didn't say that they are bad, I just meant that some areas had places, where I saw that something is missing. And that was no question of "eye for candy", it was a question of episode-1 feeling and effort... damn, that also sounds a bit stupid and offending ;) Well, check the shots and you might see what I mean!
You have an excellent skill for detailing maps and your additions look excellent. While I am unapologetic about the amount of work I was able to put into it, (since my system was down for a fair amount of the work period,) it is a fact that people look up to you in your ability to do this. Your responses came across as somewhat elitist. I'll take it in good faith that you did not mean to be offensive, but I become especially concerned when it appears that detail is getting in the way of the intended gameplay. For instance, the floating parts in that nukage pool now give the player something to stand on where I had really wanted the player to jump across.

As mappers, we have very different focus. Working together, I'm certain we can make some great maps.

I don't have any screenshots yet, but last night was the first night I ot to work on E1M7 at all... and I started from scratch because I was not given any resources. Hopefully I'll have something to show after tonight. I'm working large now, so intricate details will come later in the process.
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Tormentor667
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Post by Tormentor667 »

@Risen - No, I didn't mean to be offensive but it is always hard to explain what you think in a foreign language, so it is often likely that someone misunderstands what I really tried to say ;) Nevertheless, about the floating pieces in the Nukage: I didn't add them just to achieve some more detail, I just thought, that it would be easier for the player to cross the nukage. When I was jumping, I always felt into the nukage before I could reach the other side and well, I thought this addition would make things easier.
As mappers, we have very different focus. Working together, I'm certain we can make some great maps.
This is by far the best sentence you ever wrote (of what I have read so far ;)) because I think you are absolutely right with it ;) The combination of these different focuses make up for great achievements :)
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GeeDougg
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Joined: Fri Jul 16, 2004 2:39 pm
Location: VanCity, British Colonies, Isolated Republic Of Canuckistan

Post by GeeDougg »

Idea #346: Torm., how about you polish all the maps up yourself with help from oh, say, Leha and NMN later when it's all been submitted? That way they will all have a coherent feel to them and they won't vary in quality and looks so much. And besides they'd kick even more ass that way.
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Risen
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Location: N44°30' W073°05'

Post by Risen »

Gee, we're already planning this.
Tormentor667 wrote:...we will add 5 more weeks to the developement of our new episode, in which I want to have the following persons be part of:

- Nmn
- Nightmare
- BioHazard
- cccp_leha
- Risen

Our major aim on this will be to provide a straight style of design and ammo/weapon balance to the maps so they really look like, if they are part of one episode.
Tormentor667 wrote:...it is always hard to explain what you think in a foreign language, so it is often likely that someone misunderstands what I really tried to say ;)
I have stuggled with foreign languages as well so I know where you're coming from. I'll try to keep that in mind in the future.

Okay, that's enough talk.. I have work to do!
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GeeDougg
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Post by GeeDougg »

Risen: Oh sorry sometimes I think I'm blind (well, that, and extremely impatient, too). BTW I got a question: Is there any way that you people would consider adding lighting to your maps for ZDoomGL?
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Nmn
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Joined: Fri Apr 16, 2004 1:41 pm

Post by Nmn »

That's not a good idea IMO. In plain Zdoom lights will appear as extremely disturbing Triangles with "!"s which looks bad. Plus dyn. lighting works at it's best in plain dark locations, a mixture of sector lighting (including lamps, prtty faded lighting) won't look good. Trust me on this one.
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GeeDougg
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Location: VanCity, British Colonies, Isolated Republic Of Canuckistan

Post by GeeDougg »

Sorry but no I disagree. I personally wouldn't care if ZDooM didn't display the lights or is it replaed them with the triangle thing with "!". I want this thing for ZDoomGL. And I think lights would work well anywhere. I mean that the sector lighting should be replaced with dyn. lights.
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Ixnatifual
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Post by Ixnatifual »

You could always make two different versions of your map.
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GeeDougg
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Post by GeeDougg »

I doubt any of the people who're a part of this projexct would be willing to make time for a double-job. Of course I guess we could always wait 'till it's finished and then make a modifed ZDoomGL version! :P
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GeeDougg
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Post by GeeDougg »

I doubt any of the people who're a part of this projexct would be willing to make time for a double-job. Of course I guess we could always wait 'till it's finished and then make a modifed ZDoomGL version! :P
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Graf Zahl
Lead GZDoom+Raze Developer
Lead GZDoom+Raze Developer
Posts: 48377
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Location: Germany

Post by Graf Zahl »

Forget it. This project is for ZDoom, not ZDoomGL. To use dynamic lights efficiently you have to design your map specifically for it. Forcing it into a map that doesn't require it often creates odd effects. And those exclamation marks will be regarded as bugs by everybody who cannot or doesn't want to use ZDoomGL for any reason. Right now it's far to rough and unfinished to force people to use it for a map. With the next official release, maybe, but what is available now is an unofficial pre-release version!
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GeeDougg
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Post by GeeDougg »

I didn't mean with the unreleased version, Graf! :roll:
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Graf Zahl
Lead GZDoom+Raze Developer
Lead GZDoom+Raze Developer
Posts: 48377
Joined: Sat Jul 19, 2003 10:19 am
Location: Germany

Post by Graf Zahl »

geedougg wrote:I doubt any of the people who're a part of this projexct would be willing to make time for a double-job. Of course I guess we could always wait 'till it's finished and then make a modifed ZDoomGL version! :P

You know, the real fun with Doom maps is to make them look good without this modern eye candy. Why do you think I don't care about JDoom much?

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