[Project] "Knee-Deep in ZDoom"

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Re: [Project] "Knee-Deep in ZDoom"

Postby DoomKrakken » Fri Oct 24, 2014 6:50 am

TheMightyHeracross wrote:I think the new monsters would break mods, too.


I doubt it. There were several other places that had monsters that were incompatible with Brutal Doom/Project MSX, but they didn't break the mods.

I'll have to see for myself, though. I'm downloading a modified version of KDIZD (or is it a patch? It's 48.9 MB...) by Ed The Bat, so I'll get back on it...

*EDIT: Ok... just tried it with Project MSX. So far, the game doesn't seem to be broken. There are a couple of aesthetic problems, but it's still playable.
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Re: [Project] "Knee-Deep in ZDoom"

Postby demo_the_man » Fri Oct 24, 2014 10:30 am

you may need to delete the ' next to the 04 on line 941 fyi
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Re: [Project] "Knee-Deep in ZDoom"

Postby wildweasel » Fri Oct 24, 2014 1:14 pm

The primary issue that KDIZD has with weapon and gameplay patches is that its weapon lay out is different. They reuse the same editor numbers, but you are seriously messing with balance because what used to be a plasma rifle and BFG are now a grenade launcher and an infantry rifle.

I gotta tell ya, having a BFG-like weapon replacing the rifle kinda seriously breaks the gameplay here.
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Re: [Project] "Knee-Deep in ZDoom"

Postby DoomKrakken » Fri Oct 24, 2014 1:44 pm

Earlier, there was a fixed version of KDIZD by Ed The Bat which I downloaded... if you guys want to run weapon mods, then you can use that. I wouldn't suggest playing it vanilla, though...
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Re: [Project] "Knee-Deep in ZDoom"

Postby Clownman » Fri Oct 24, 2014 4:09 pm

wildweasel wrote:The primary issue that KDIZD has with weapon and gameplay patches is that its weapon lay out is different. They reuse the same editor numbers, but you are seriously messing with balance because what used to be a plasma rifle and BFG are now a grenade launcher and an infantry rifle.

I gotta tell ya, having a BFG-like weapon replacing the rifle kinda seriously breaks the gameplay here.

Unless it's Brutal Doom ((The hellknight at the gate of Z1M6 is especially irritating.))

BTW I'm actually making a tiny lil' edited version of KDiZD to work with BD but I've noticed The Chaingunners and Hellknight's graphics really clash ((Especially when they are in alternate death states.)) Should I just replace the sprites with the original doom 2 ones or make it so you run it with both Doom 1 and 2? ((Doom 2 first and then Doom after)) I don't wanna have any legal issues.
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Re: [Project] "Knee-Deep in ZDoom"

Postby Zhs2 » Fri Oct 24, 2014 9:09 pm

Actually, the weapons are directly replaced. This was pretty smart because it means you can comment out the line "#include "Decorate/Weapons.txt"" in Decorate.txt and voila, the normal Doom 2 weapons appear instead (but without the sprites because lol Doom 1).
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Re: [Project] "Knee-Deep in ZDoom"

Postby DoomKrakken » Fri Oct 31, 2014 12:53 pm

Zhs2 wrote:Actually, the weapons are directly replaced. This was pretty smart because it means you can comment out the line "#include "Decorate/Weapons.txt"" in Decorate.txt and voila, the normal Doom 2 weapons appear instead (but without the sprites because lol Doom 1).


This fix will bring back the plasma rifle and BFG-9000?
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Re: [Project] "Knee-Deep in ZDoom"

Postby Gez » Fri Oct 31, 2014 1:33 pm

It's not a fix. But yes, it should.
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Re: [Project] "Knee-Deep in ZDoom"

Postby Siberian Tiger » Fri Oct 31, 2014 4:14 pm

All this trouble, - just for Brutal Doom? Why?
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Re: [Project] "Knee-Deep in ZDoom"

Postby Ed the Bat » Fri Oct 31, 2014 4:16 pm

My motives had nothing to do with Brutal Doom. I just wanted to be able to play my weapon/character mods, and since there's no way to patch over setslot and clearplayerclass, my only option was to make a new version of KDIZD without those. I simply opted to also roll all three files into one package for simplicity.
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Re: [Project] "Knee-Deep in ZDoom"

Postby -Ghost- » Sat Nov 01, 2014 9:49 am

Thanks for making that fix, Ed. It's been fun playing through this again with the Aliens mod and a few others. It's a nice set of detailed maps that goes well with a lot of different gameplay mods now that it's open to it.
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Re: [Project] "Knee-Deep in ZDoom"

Postby Ed the Bat » Sat Nov 01, 2014 10:26 pm

You're welcome. I originally did it for myself, but I was seeing that other people here were facing the same problem that I did. I've had to make custom revisions of so, so many projects* just to remove setslot and clearplayerclasses, since there's nothing that can override them. They've been deprecated, with good reason, since February 19th, 2009, and September 19th, 2010, respectively, so not only are they harmful to compatibility, they're grossly outdated, and using them is terribly sloppy if nothing else. Projects that came out before those dates (such as the original release of KDIZD) have an excuse, since there were no alternatives back then, but anything newer should be ashamed. I found it highly embarrassing when KDIZD 1.2 came out to fix the parser bug, but continued to use these commands.

*I've never released the vast majority of them to the public, because I figured I should procure approval/permissions of some kind first, and my crippling social anxiety has stopped me from moving forward with that.
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Re: [Project] "Knee-Deep in ZDoom"

Postby Average » Sun Nov 02, 2014 5:32 am

It would be great if this could be added t othe OP and uploaded to Id Games... What do you say Torm?? :)

Also,, Ed, just curious but what other mods have you tweaked? I know you can't share them without permission but I'd love to know... I like your work! :)
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Re: [Project] "Knee-Deep in ZDoom"

Postby Ed the Bat » Sun Nov 02, 2014 10:42 am

Aw, I really appreciate that! :D

I've probably made revised personal copies of close to 200 mods by now, to varying degrees (some of them just remove a couple of problem bits, like my KDIZD revision, while others completely rewrite things from the ground up). I keep copies of them on my webspace along with a downloads page, mainly to help myself organize a little. Once I make sure it's up to date, I could put a link to it in my forum profile, assuming I'm not overstepping too many boundaries with that. I'm also open to requests if there are mods out there that I've missed that need similar cleanup.
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Re: [Project] "Knee-Deep in ZDoom"

Postby DoomKrakken » Mon Nov 03, 2014 5:02 am

Hey, Ed the Bat...

Your version of K-DIZD still has the rifle and grenade launcher. When I play with Project MSX, I am not able to obtain a Chimaera Pulse Rifle (the plasma gun) or the Sniper Gauss Cannon (the BFG). Could you tweak it some more so that plasma guns/plasma gun replacers and BFGs/BFG replacers work properly in the mod?

But, anyway, at LEAST the game is still playable with Project MSX. I guess it'll be a little more faithful to the E1 aspect of the game in that way (as there are no plasma guns/BFGs in the first episode of Doom). Thanks for that. :D
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