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PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2007 1:41 am
by Kate
Erm not the original intention. Once I get some better ideas, it'll start turning a lot more interesting. ...As a matter of fact Enjay's post about morphing rooms just gave me some ideas that I really to try.

This level doesn't have much height variation because I originally didn't start with much, if anything, in mind. But now that I think about it, if I start using scripting to change the sectors' heights and textures when they aren't visible, I could achieve a lot better effects... **goes off to tag stuff**

The only problem is that this will completely break noclip, but I guess since it is a cheat it isn't something I need to worry too much about, since you can also just puke the script that handles the floor/ceiling changes.

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2007 2:36 am
by Siggi
wildweasel wrote:I don't believe Firefox loads the images until the spoiler is opened, either...not for me at least.
I am using Firefox.

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2007 2:43 am
by Kinsie
Is it just me or would the "reusing sector definitions" thing screw over the "monsters hearing sounds" AI?

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2007 3:00 am
by Kate
It does because it goes by the actual sector, instead of subsector like rendering does. Old maps use this to wake up monsters that lie in dummy sectors that would otherwise not react. Currently I'm circumventing this by strategically placing monsters so they don't immediately see the player and making them +AMBUSH by default.

It'd be nice though if there was an A_Look3 that was the reverse of A_Look2, I.E. only react by sight and ignore sound, that way it would be possible to sneak up on a monster since +AMBUSH means they see the player from any direction, so currently they will always come after you as long as you're in the same area as them.

PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2007 10:52 am
by Kate
Spoiler: "Screenshots: Master Blaster"
Yep, still only two sectors. I'm a very good illusionist. =p

I've appeared to run into a problem though; When changing the sector heights, the objects move with the sector, most notably the bridge things move to prevent getting stuck under the floor. The result is that when you return to a previous area, suddenly lower floors that you could once jump on you now wind up sinking through instead, because the things are no longer in line with the floor. =S

Edit: I have the problem resolved. I was missing the obvious.

PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 4:03 am
by Cutmanmike
Wait how the crap is it two sectors? If I remember correctly, a sector counts for all those crates, bridge parts and any other details that are seperate shapes... or did I miss something?

PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 4:14 am
by Gez
It's possible to have "fake sectors" through impassable linedefs with midtextures. As long as the player can't jump high enough to see they have no "roof", the illusion works.

There are some neat tricks used in the 2sectors wad.

PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 4:37 am
by Kate
Cutmanmike wrote:Wait how the crap is it two sectors?
Self-referencing is another good trick. Try the "join" button when selecting two identical sectors in Doom Builder. Both areas are now the same sector and both change at the same time when one is changed, have the same flats/heights/tag/light level/etc. and both use the same definition. It comes in handy when you have multiple identical areas that all have identical definitions (like spaces between grates) and want them all to work identically, in case you need to dynamically change them or come back later and just modify one without having to go through them all.

This is why there are no lighting gradients or things of that sort, and what makes it so hard to map for. =P You can only have two floor/ceiling textures, height variations, sector effects, and light levels visible at any given time.

Most of the tricks also use clever decorations and also the midtexture trick mentioned above.

PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 6:51 am
by Cutmanmike
Hmm... if you used GZDoom you might be able to rely on the dynamic lights if you put them in the right places.

PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 9:53 am
by Kate
Cutmanmike wrote:Hmm... if you used GZDoom you might be able to rely on the dynamic lights if you put them in the right places.
I want this to be software-compatible, so I don't wind up leaving the regular ZDoom users in the dark (no pun intended). =)

PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 1:18 pm
by Tormentor667

PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 1:33 pm
by Ryan Cordell
Nobody cares about that. If she wants a 2 Sector challange, let her have one.

PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 2:11 pm
by Kate
Tormentor667 wrote:*points@hisavatar/title*
If you've seen the first post, in case you haven't noticed, this entire project was spawned because of it, and is pretty much a "friendly stab" at such. =P

It's all in how you use them. If used correctly, two sectors can be quite more than enough.

I wanted a challenge that hasn't really been tried before and would prove interesting. As far as this goes, it has been both, as well as giving me an exercise in being creative and refining old tricks, and learning some new ones as well.

And call me mascochistic, but this has been quite fun as well.

PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 3:25 pm
by jallamann
Other issues aside, the project seems like quite a challenge.

PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 3:51 pm
by Belial
SnowKate709 wrote:there has never (to my knowledge) been a fully-playable Single-Player map that demonstrates such a feat