[WIP] Bloodshot [New! Screenshots 3/7] [Please look?]

New maps, and other projects whose primary focus is new maps, belong here.

NOTE: This forum, and all forums below it, are NOT for questions or troubleshooting! Threads here are for active projects only! Please use the Editing subforums or General for questions.
Forum rules
The Projects forums are ONLY for YOUR PROJECTS! If you are asking questions about a project, either find that project's thread, or start a thread in the General section instead.

Got a cool project idea but nothing else? Put it in the project ideas thread instead!

Projects for any Doom-based engine (especially 3DGE) are perfectly acceptable here too.

Please read the full rules for more details.

Re: [WIP] New Project: Bloodshot [New! Not dead!]

Postby Onslaught Six » Mon Feb 18, 2008 8:11 pm

It's not tomorrow, but it's screenshots! Check the second post.

EDIT: I'd much rather just bump the topic, since this is totally new information and all, but I know that's frowned upon and so is double posting. I'm still doing tons more work on Map01 before it's truly "ready."

I redid the generators a fair bit (or more specifically the rooms they're housed in) with some new BLUECOMP textures (I think? The blue computery lines with the grey panels around them, y'know) surrounding an inner sector of the blue thing--it's hard to describe, I guess, but it looks much more detailed and Better.

I also finally seem to have fixed the goddamn polyobj bleeding that the sliding door in the blue key room, mostly by making it open slower, open less, and repeatedly increasing the size of the sectors the doors slide into. (There's actually still a little bit of bleeding, but it's through a wall that's right next to the door with a length of maybe two.) There's also some very slight bleeding on the polyobjs in the generators, but it's nothing more than a two or three pixel wide line. Ignore it, I guess.

The first Bloodied Up Computer Room (originally accessed by the Yellow Key and housed the Exit Door switch) was also almost entirely redone to bring it in line with the generator room, and looks way better. If I have one complaint, it's that I can't find anything better to use for the base of the desks than SHAWN2. (You'll see what I mean.)

I also replaced all the existing Commandos (Machinegunner guys, have Strifeguy sprites) with more powerful Rebels. The reasoning behind this is to better control the player's flow of weapons. There's still two Commandos in the map, but they only show up after you should have the Machinegun. (There's also a Chaingun in the level, but it's hidden well.)

For all intents and purposes, I'm fairly sure the level's done. If there's anything I'd do to it, it'd be some more difficulty balancing (HMP and UV aren't different enough) and maybe dress up the second Red Key Forcefield Generator switch. I'm also considering putting some kind of fancy-looking tech construct around the forcefield itself, just so it feels less "there" and more like part of the actual level.

What do you guys say? Interest in another demo?
Onslaught Six
Oozing of Onslaughttitude
 
Joined: 11 Dec 2005
Location: Hell.

Re: [WIP] New Project: Bloodshot [New! Screenshots 8/18]

Postby Onslaught Six » Thu Feb 21, 2008 12:41 am

Added some more screenshots. Somebody please give me feedback?
Onslaught Six
Oozing of Onslaughttitude
 
Joined: 11 Dec 2005
Location: Hell.

Re: [WIP] New Project: Bloodshot [New! Demo Released 8/23]

Postby Onslaught Six » Sat Feb 23, 2008 2:53 am

Alright, due to lack of feedback, I'm releasing the new Map01. This is almost an entirely different beast from last time, so really, guys--give it a try? Please?

There's one slight bug, in the pallete translations of the Zombieman--haven't quite worked that out yet. So for now, they're all brown instead of just some of them. Oh well.
Onslaught Six
Oozing of Onslaughttitude
 
Joined: 11 Dec 2005
Location: Hell.

Re: [WIP] Bloodshot [New! Demo Released 8/23] [Please look?]

Postby Onslaught Six » Fri Feb 29, 2008 1:54 pm

Useless bump. Can 'somebody' please try this out and play it? It's one map. Maybe five or ten minutes out of your life. Please?

EDIT: Wow, that was stupid. No wonder nobody was responding. The title said 8/23...
Onslaught Six
Oozing of Onslaughttitude
 
Joined: 11 Dec 2005
Location: Hell.

Re: [WIP] Bloodshot [New! Demo Released 2/23] [Please look?]

Postby Penguinator » Fri Feb 29, 2008 5:07 pm

I'll try it out on Sunday, the screens look nice.
User avatar
Penguinator
Resurrect
 
Joined: 22 May 2006
Location: Hell

Re: [WIP] Bloodshot [New! Demo Released 8/23] [Please look?]

Postby Unknown_Assassin » Fri Feb 29, 2008 5:55 pm

Onslaught Six wrote:Useless bump. Can 'somebody' please try this out and play it? It's one map. Maybe five or ten minutes out of your life. Please?

EDIT: Wow, that was stupid. No wonder nobody was responding. The title said 8/23...


Since its the weekend, most likely I'll play it tomorrow, if not tonight. I've been crammed with schoolwork lately. :(
User avatar
Unknown_Assassin
Bow down to the Protoss Race!!
 
Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Location: Where dead carcasses lie

Re: [WIP] Bloodshot [New! Demo Released 8/23] [Please look?]

Postby Onslaught Six » Mon Mar 03, 2008 1:25 pm

Unknown_Assassin wrote:
Onslaught Six wrote:Useless bump. Can 'somebody' please try this out and play it? It's one map. Maybe five or ten minutes out of your life. Please?

EDIT: Wow, that was stupid. No wonder nobody was responding. The title said 8/23...


Since its the weekend, most likely I'll play it tomorrow, if not tonight. I've been crammed with schoolwork lately. :(


We all are. I've only been editing it during my off-time when I'm not doing English papers or Java assignments...

I will say this--now that I've taken a couple programming courses, ACS is 'nothing.' The only thing I've had problems with is that I keep trying to use "print(s:" in Java programs :roll:
Onslaught Six
Oozing of Onslaughttitude
 
Joined: 11 Dec 2005
Location: Hell.

Re: [WIP] Bloodshot [New! Demo Released 2/23] [Please look?]

Postby Unknown_Assassin » Mon Mar 03, 2008 10:13 pm

This level is certainly an improvement from the last in terms of detail. The gameplay was fun at Ultra-Violence. :D

A couple of things I noticed (I might have missed some things):
-In coordinates (1253, -2127), when you open the door to get out, the wall disappears and you can see the door going outward. I believe it's a bug.
-Dehumanarmoured has no sound for death.
-I felt that during this level, there were too many doors, thus making me a bit confused at times.
-The Strife monsters didn't really match with the Doom monsters. Perhaps you could split them up into different levels?
-Since there were many hitscan enemies, I felt that there was an overload in ammo.
-No music. I assume you'll fix that. :P

The new DECORATE monsters was a good addition to the wad. :)
User avatar
Unknown_Assassin
Bow down to the Protoss Race!!
 
Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Location: Where dead carcasses lie

Re: [WIP] Bloodshot [New! Demo Released 2/23] [Please look?]

Postby Onslaught Six » Tue Mar 04, 2008 11:46 am

Unknown_Assassin wrote:This level is certainly an improvement from the last in terms of detail. The gameplay was fun at Ultra-Violence. :D


Well, that's good to know. I usually test on HMP, so I've been wondering if it's at all balanced better on UV.

A couple of things I noticed (I might have missed some things):
-In coordinates (1253, -2127), when you open the door to get out, the wall disappears and you can see the door going outward. I believe it's a bug.


Yeah. Damned polyobjects. The real problem here is that, from what I've read and experimented with, you need to have a convex room on both sides of the polyobject--that means you can't have a door, and then open up the wall in front of where the door is supposed to open up. This is exactly what I did, since I built this polyobject like six months ago and didn't know about that limitation. Fixing it would basically require some serious renovation to the "cage" room--which I really don't want to do, but it looks like I'll have to.

-Dehumanarmoured has no sound for death.


I...didn't notice that. I'll have to fix it.

-I felt that during this level, there were too many doors, thus making me a bit confused at times.


There 'are' a lot of doors, and there's a lot of backtracking involved many times, so I could see how it'd be easy to get confused. Playing through it two or three times should get you used to it, though.

-The Strife monsters didn't really match with the Doom monsters. Perhaps you could split them up into different levels?


Ehh. I keep hearing this, but I like 'em together, so. >.>

-Since there were many hitscan enemies, I felt that there was an overload in ammo.


There 'is' a fair lot of ammo available--particularly in Bullets. Mind, there's probably not a whole lot I can do about it without severely reducing the number of enemies in the level--and who wants to do 'that?' :roll:

-No music. I assume you'll fix that. :P


Yes.

The new DECORATE monsters was a good addition to the wad. :)


Thanks for the feedback in general. I'm glad it's not horribly intolerable or anything!
Onslaught Six
Oozing of Onslaughttitude
 
Joined: 11 Dec 2005
Location: Hell.

Re: [WIP] Bloodshot [New! Demo Released 2/23] [Please look?]

Postby Enjay » Tue Mar 04, 2008 5:40 pm

OK, I've played through again and rather than keep bugging you via PM, I'll just post the few additional points I found here (they may have been mentioned already - but I'm not going back to read the whole thread :P ):

At least one of the switches to lower the forcefields can be used again after the forcefield has lowered. This doesn't break anything, as far as I can tell, but you do get the message about the forcefield getting switched off again, so it looks silly. You can clear the line's special in the script using "clearlinespecial ();"

The minigun is in a hidden cupboard, but there is no secret credit for finding it.

The room with the start spot is very plain.

The demons behind the green forcefield are definitely reluctant to come out. I stood and watched them for ages and none of them came out. After I killed one, the others could get out.

You have made quite a bit of floor detailing - just be careful with these. Even though the player can happily run over the top of these, to an enemy, some of them will look like steps that are too big to cross.

A few doors (at least the very first one and the soulsphere secret) the door tracks move with the door. Particularly obvious with the soulsphere because the texture is a stone wall not a doortrak.

I noticed quite a few lines that should be x-aligned (particularly in the area with the dark grey/ black startan-like textures).

When you load the WAD into DeePSea, it lists the following:

Spoiler:


Those may not cause any problems, I haven't actually checked the lumps in question.

Also, just for the hell of it, here's DeePsea's map checker results:

Spoiler:


Some of those will not be serious, and may even be wrong (I think the line type 202 errors are fine for example). Also, some of them are the result of a few vertices sharing the same place and me selecting to merge them to allow the error checker to continue.

Specifically:
line 930 and 883 share the same vertices
912 and 880
908 and 878
890 and 868
886 and 866

Vertex 880 is on line 875
869 is on 417
891 is on 416
901 is on 929
1736 is on 145
1758 is on 2725

Lines 416 and 923 are superimposed
882 and 2721 are superimposed
903 and 2720
937 and 2721

Some lines are only 1 sided but not set as impassable (although this will not cause a problem in game as 1s lines are treated as impassable even without the flag set)

Some lines have 2 sides but are not flagged as 2 sided. Again, I don't think this is actually a problem.


Like I said, a lot of that won't actually be a problem. DeePsea's error checker is quite strict and it has no way of knowing about things like deliberate "bugs" in a level. But I thought I'd let you see it anyway.
User avatar
Enjay
Everyone is a moon, and has a dark side which he never shows to anybody. Twain
 
 
 
Joined: 15 Jul 2003
Location: Scotland

Re: [WIP] Bloodshot [New! Demo Released 2/23] [Please look?]

Postby Unknown_Assassin » Tue Mar 04, 2008 8:19 pm

Enjay wrote:The demons behind the green forcefield are definitely reluctant to come out. I stood and watched them for ages and none of them came out. After I killed one, the others could get out.


I haven't had this problem. They came out after I killed the units that transported.
User avatar
Unknown_Assassin
Bow down to the Protoss Race!!
 
Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Location: Where dead carcasses lie

Re: [WIP] Bloodshot [New! Demo Released 2/23] [Please look?]

Postby Onslaught Six » Wed Mar 05, 2008 4:16 pm

Enjay wrote:OK, I've played through again and rather than keep bugging you via PM, I'll just post the few additional points I found here (they may have been mentioned already - but I'm not going back to read the whole thread :P ):


Feedback is always welcome, yes--even if it's a duplicate of someone else's complaint, that at least shows me that it's happening to more than one person.

At least one of the switches to lower the forcefields can be used again after the forcefield has lowered. This doesn't break anything, as far as I can tell, but you do get the message about the forcefield getting switched off again, so it looks silly. You can clear the line's special in the script using "clearlinespecial ();"


Huh. I haven't actually tried to switch the switches again after the forcefields have lowered. If it's anything, it's probably because the switches allow you to repeat calling the script (so that, if you hit the switch and the generator isn't turned off, you can switch it again once the generator's off). I'll try what you said.

The minigun is in a hidden cupboard, but there is no secret credit for finding it.


There isn't? I explicitly made that area secret, so I dunno. I'll test it when I get home.

The room with the start spot is very plain.


Yes, sadly, it is. Mostly because originally you started in the big hub room with the Shotgun, but then I added enemies to it and, well.

The demons behind the green forcefield are definitely reluctant to come out. I stood and watched them for ages and none of them came out. After I killed one, the others could get out.


Unknown_Assassin wrote:I haven't had this problem. They came out after I killed the units that transported.


Though U_A is implying he killed the Acolytes that spawn after you pick up the key, this isn't the actual intended behaviour. Anyway, the fact that the Demons have problems coming out is oddly variable--if you quickly run into the room and hit the switch, they'll notice you right away and won't have time to get stuck against each other, and will be able to come out--but if you spent some time with them active before undoing the cage, they'll get stuck.

The reason they keep getting stuck is because I've got different numbers of them there for different difficulty levels, and for some reason I positioned them so they were all seperate while looking at all difficulty levels. I've moved them around to give them all more room now, so this should be fixed.

Incidentally, I've toyed with the idea of expanding that whole area to have several forcefielded prison cells--but I think I'm gonna save that idea for another level. No use in cramming all the good ideas into one level, right? :p

Enjay wrote:You have made quite a bit of floor detailing - just be careful with these. Even though the player can happily run over the top of these, to an enemy, some of them will look like steps that are too big to cross.


I was worried about this, but I tried to position the enemies in such a way that this wouldn't happen. I'll run some tests.

A few doors (at least the very first one and the soulsphere secret) the door tracks move with the door. Particularly obvious with the soulsphere because the texture is a stone wall not a doortrak.


Oops. I'd always planned to do a full check and make sure all the doortracks were lower unpegged, but I guess I haven't gotten around to it yet.

I noticed quite a few lines that should be x-aligned (particularly in the area with the dark grey/ black startan-like textures).


That's because the version of the textures you have aren't actually the correct size--they're two or three pixels short. This is a result of (stupidly) looking at the TEXTURE1 lump of the original STARTAN texture, printscreening, and using that as my base. This cut off a pixel or two on every edge, causing it to be massively misaligned. I've redone the black STARTAN texture now, so it should line up properly.

When you load the WAD into DeePSea, it lists the following:


Simple way to get rid of that error: Use Doom Builder. :D

Spoiler:


Those may not cause any problems, I haven't actually checked the lumps in question.


Those are actually some of the patch graphics for those many monitors of the planets (I forget what texture it is originally), just copied over as textures so I can use them as well graphics. Likely, DeePsea thinks there's some kind of conflict, but there really isn't. ZDoom doesn't give me an error either, as far as I can see.

Also, just for the hell of it, here's DeePsea's map checker results:

Spoiler:


Some of those will not be serious, and may even be wrong (I think the line type 202 errors are fine for example). Also, some of them are the result of a few vertices sharing the same place and me selecting to merge them to allow the error checker to continue.


This is likely because of the light panel things in the blue key room--they're hella messed up and I just haven't gotten around to fixing them yet. (Incidentally, I only learned how to manually change the sectors of lines in the last week or two.) This is one of those developer-level issues that doesn't affect the end user, though. I'm well aware that my maps have a 'ton' of really awful problems--this is because I started most of them half a year ago and I was stupid.

Specifically:
line 930 and 883 share the same vertices
912 and 880
908 and 878
890 and 868
886 and 866

Vertex 880 is on line 875
869 is on 417
891 is on 416
901 is on 929
1736 is on 145
1758 is on 2725

Lines 416 and 923 are superimposed
882 and 2721 are superimposed
903 and 2720
937 and 2721

Some lines are only 1 sided but not set as impassable (although this will not cause a problem in game as 1s lines are treated as impassable even without the flag set)

Some lines have 2 sides but are not flagged as 2 sided. Again, I don't think this is actually a problem.


Like I said, a lot of that won't actually be a problem. DeePsea's error checker is quite strict and it has no way of knowing about things like deliberate "bugs" in a level. But I thought I'd let you see it anyway.


I'll look into those errors today, I suppose. I agree with you, though, most of them won't affect gameplay or anything.
Onslaught Six
Oozing of Onslaughttitude
 
Joined: 11 Dec 2005
Location: Hell.

Re: [WIP] Bloodshot [New! Demo Released 2/23] [Please look?]

Postby Enjay » Wed Mar 05, 2008 7:57 pm

Onslaught Six wrote:Those are actually some of the patch graphics for those many monitors of the planets (I forget what texture it is originally), just copied over as textures so I can use them as well graphics. Likely, DeePsea thinks there's some kind of conflict, but there really isn't. ZDoom doesn't give me an error either, as far as I can see.


All those particular errors are telling you is that there is more than one lump in the WAD with the names listed. On checking myself, you have 2 identical copies of all the listed patches in the WAD. This will not cause a problem with the game, but it is a little untidy and takes up a (small) bit of space. What's more, it can get confusing because the second copy overrides the first copy when you load the WAD into Zdoom. So, if at some point in the future you decided to replace the patch and replaced the first copy, thinking that it was the only one, the second copy would actually be used by the game and it would look like you hadn't made a replacement at all.
User avatar
Enjay
Everyone is a moon, and has a dark side which he never shows to anybody. Twain
 
 
 
Joined: 15 Jul 2003
Location: Scotland

Re: [WIP] Bloodshot [New! Demo Released 2/23] [Please look?]

Postby Onslaught Six » Thu Mar 06, 2008 1:29 am

Enjay wrote:
Onslaught Six wrote:Those are actually some of the patch graphics for those many monitors of the planets (I forget what texture it is originally), just copied over as textures so I can use them as well graphics. Likely, DeePsea thinks there's some kind of conflict, but there really isn't. ZDoom doesn't give me an error either, as far as I can see.


All those particular errors are telling you is that there is more than one lump in the WAD with the names listed. On checking myself, you have 2 identical copies of all the listed patches in the WAD. This will not cause a problem with the game, but it is a little untidy and takes up a (small) bit of space. What's more, it can get confusing because the second copy overrides the first copy when you load the WAD into Zdoom. So, if at some point in the future you decided to replace the patch and replaced the first copy, thinking that it was the only one, the second copy would actually be used by the game and it would look like you hadn't made a replacement at all.


Ah, but. These are default Doom 2 patches, and all I've done is copy them into my WAD as textures (between the TX_START and TX_END lumps). I suppose I could edit my TEXTURE1 lump to actually utilize the original patches, and I might go back and do that eventually, but for the time being, I won't.

I understand the concern over doing this, though, and if it were any other textures I'd be sure to rename them. As-is, I don't make a habit of overwriting the original textures (Although many of my new ones have similar names just to keep them nearby) so this is the exception rather than the rule.

Incidentally, have either of you (or anyone else trying this out) noticed the new secondary Demon death sequence? What do you think? Decent? Needs work? Hm?

I'm also in the process of making a small website for this, mostly just to show off a bunch of new screenshots.
Onslaught Six
Oozing of Onslaughttitude
 
Joined: 11 Dec 2005
Location: Hell.

Re: [WIP] Bloodshot [New! Demo Released 2/23] [Please look?]

Postby Enjay » Thu Mar 06, 2008 5:17 am

I hadn't actually noticed that one copy was in the TX name space. That does decomplicate things a bit. Personally I don't like using lumps of the same name even in different name spaces - possibly mainly because DeePsea complains about it and it can complicate the editing process.

To pic an example, TSCRN2 is in your WAD as entry number 638, used as a patch, and 711 as a TX. It's not a big deal, but you don't need that. Remember, if you want to use the graphics individually on a wall (or floor) Zdoom can use textures, patches or TXs (or pretty much anything else too IIRC - including sprites) so the second copy isn't needed at all. If you delete the TX copy, the main texture that uses tscrn2 as a patch (planet1) still works. If you put tscrn2 directly on a wall, that also works because Zdoom will happily use the patch directly.

You can't do it the other way though. If you delete the patch, Zdoom will not use tscrn2 on the planet1 texture (even if, maybe, your editor will still show it there) because it won't use a TX as a patch. So, to keep things neat inside the WAD, you could delete all the duplicates from the TX name space and things will still work as you want. Or you could just leave it. :)
User avatar
Enjay
Everyone is a moon, and has a dark side which he never shows to anybody. Twain
 
 
 
Joined: 15 Jul 2003
Location: Scotland

PreviousNext

Return to Levels

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests