(Multiplayer) Is it ever going to become a good multiplayer

[PixelWAD]

As far as i know, Doom works in peer to peer mode which causes quite some lags for some. It's it ever going to be able to put a dedicated host and let it handle all the multiplayer stuff?

[leileilol]

It's not as trivial as you think it is, and a client/server model doesn't guarantee lag free online gaming automatically either.

the "ever" here happened nearly two decades ago with the old zdoom fork csdoom. There's been a few others since.

[Kinsie]

There are mumblings about giving GZDoom some form of client/server multiplayer architecture, but at the moment these currently remain mumblings.

[PixelWAD]

I do understand that it is easier said than done, but we already have slopes, models, voxels, 3D, VR, even PBR support. One would think that multiplayer would be solved ages ago

As long as I'm playing with someone from the same country it's allright, but trying to play with someone from UK results in a lag for everyone... as soon as that person is gone, it's smooth again.

[Kinsie]

I do understand that it is easier said than done, but we already have slopes, models, voxels, 3D, VR, even PBR support. One would think that multiplayer would be solved ages ago

We already have ketchup, mustard, bread, diced beef and even a grill. One would think that perpetual motion would be solved ages ago!

[PlayerLin]

Look at EDuke32 port(yes, I know it's Duke port), it currently has no multiplayer at all, just totally broken because years of changes with like adding features, engine changes etc. Its C/S architecture MP development just rely someone not appeared in front of Duke community but know a lot about networks, it already many years and still in WIP(not sure if it'll happened on Ion Maiden or not). But at least there is a fork of EDuke32 called "Old-MP", for those who still want the original shitty Duke MP.

It's not "one would think it can be solved ages ago", it's lack of somebody who would commit himself/herself to make a better network code like C/S architecture. Also, since GZDooM engine has a lot of new features and engine keep changes, they may also affect how the multi-player works, and caused more problems to solve...without dedicated MP developer(s), I don't know others would like to mess with that.

[phantombeta]

I do understand that it is easier said than done, but we already have slopes, models, voxels, 3D, VR, even PBR support. One would think that multiplayer would be solved ages ago ;)

models

Which only support vertex-based animation, with no skeletal animation support, meaning models are bloated and annoying to work with.

3D

???

VR

Which doesn't work very well due to Doom using sprites, and the HUD and menus are also pretty much unusable. (At least in my experience)

even PBR support

Which is unfinished. It's missing environment maps, so it doesn't look very good.

And that's not counting the fact that coding graphical features is completely different from coding multiplayer.

[PixelWAD]

Of course there is a ton of space for improvement, but I'm surprised what Doom looks like in 2018.

By 3D i meant that we can render Doom in sbs mode for 3D tv or even anaglyph glasses. Probably used by very few, but it does work and it looks great. Even mobile version has support for 3D (Delta Touch)

As for VR, i just use minimal hud to display ammo health and that's it. No need to clutter your view.

I spent about 30 hours in Doom vr so far, and honestly it's the best vr time i had in 2018. Many people here don't seem interested in vr, but at the same time i have no interest playing such a "simple" game on gaming pc. VR makes you connected to the world.

I forgot to mention 3D Sound! It does feel VERY accurate when it comes to position in an open space, when played through the walls it does not get any distortion I think, but I'm super impressed by what I hear. Reminds me of COD4 times where I could play "with my eyes closed", the sound engine was just so well done with a pair of good headphones.

[TheMightyHeracross]

Is Zandronum too inadequate for you? The only issue with it is that it's only up to date with GZDoom ~2013 or so but that's still plenty of advanced features.

[Matt]

Is Zandronum too inadequate for you?

Yes.

[rchrdcrg]

Of course there is a ton of space for improvement, but I'm surprised what Doom looks like in 2018.

By 3D i meant that we can render Doom in sbs mode for 3D tv or even anaglyph glasses. Probably used by very few, but it does work and it looks great. Even mobile version has support for 3D (Delta Touch)

As for VR, i just use minimal hud to display ammo health and that's it. No need to clutter your view.

I spent about 30 hours in Doom vr so far, and honestly it's the best vr time i had in 2018. Many people here don't seem interested in vr, but at the same time i have no interest playing such a "simple" game on gaming pc. VR makes you connected to the world.

I forgot to mention 3D Sound! It does feel VERY accurate when it comes to position in an open space, when played through the walls it does not get any distortion I think, but I'm super impressed by what I hear. Reminds me of COD4 times where I could play "with my eyes closed", the sound engine was just so well done with a pair of good headphones.

Absolutely agree, Doom in VR with motion controls is the most fun I've had with gaming in general in a loooooong time. I would absolutely love to see some sort of native support rather than a fork/hack so we aren't stuck in the stone ages with GZDoom 3.2 (I'm absolutely dying to try some of these mods in VR!!!)

[jdagenet]

Is Zandronum too inadequate for you?

Yes.

No one is using GZDoom P2P and I’m pretty sure ZScript isn’t even developed around multiplayer anyway, including P2P so it doesn’t matter.

[phantombeta]

Is Zandronum too inadequate for you?

Yes.

No one is using GZDoom P2P and I’m pretty sure ZScript isn’t even developed around multiplayer anyway, including P2P so it doesn’t matter.

ZScript is very much developed with some MP related things. A pretty big one being the complete playsim-UI separation.
And we VERY MUCH do use GZDoom P2P. People play Hideous Destructor MP extremely frequently.

[IvanDobrovski]

And we VERY MUCH do use GZDoom P2P. People play Hideous Destructor MP extremely frequently.

And how well does that fare with high latency? Big ping difference betweel players? Does it run smooth? I doubt it, but I can see it has improved over the years definitely.

If there is to be definitive multiplayer method of playing your favorite mods with fewest problems developers of GZDoom and Zandronum must unite. Otherwise you'll get nowhere. This will end up like Eduke32 as PlayerLin already said (I'm an old time Duke modder, I've quit it in favor of Doom just because of the better modding + multiplayer) and I remember exactly how it all was at the time. This is going the same route.

But alas, nobody will change their ways. Relevant people have shown their attitude quite often in the past and people never change. Your best bet is to hope one of the Zandronum devs has a genius idea for the future or just a random netcode expert feels like helping Zandronum.

Final note: While ZScript is all nice and well it is still not a finished product, changes often and things can become obsolete at any point. And most of what you can do in ZScript is somewhat doable in just ACS. Unless you care that much about your screen rolling or fancy shadow effects or whatever that don't contribute to the gameplay whatsoever.

[Arctangent]

Final note: While ZScript is all nice and well it is still not a finished product, changes often and things can become obsolete at any point. And most of what you can do in ZScript is somewhat doable in just ACS. Unless you care that much about your screen rolling or fancy shadow effects or whatever that don't contribute to the gameplay whatsoever.

this is an awfully great way to admit that you're not actually making any attempt to actually say anything meaningful, but rather just want to take the high ground to feel smug over everyone else