Is the community out of ideas and motivation?

Discuss anything ZDoom-related that doesn't fall into one of the other categories.
User avatar
Tormentor667
Posts: 13470
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2003 3:52 am

Is the community out of ideas and motivation?

Post by Tormentor667 »

I am now part of the community for almost 14 years which makes up 50% of my whole life. During this time I have mostly been very active with mapping, modding, my website or communty related stuff. Due to my job and my own business, my time got very limited and the frequent work that I had the past years has been drastically reduced. Though, I am still reading news, following threads and keeping myself informed about all the things happening.

But what I noticed in the past 2 years is that the community got less active and less creative. I am not sure if is only me or my point of view, but releases aren't frequent anymore and people also don't seem to come up with ambitious and creative projects anymore. How do I dare saying this? Well, I still remember times when Roger Ritenours or Cyberdreams was released. When ambitious projects like KDiZD and RTC have been worked on. Surprise releases like Void and Nullspace which have been a real art and something we haven't seen before. I remember brilliant total conversions like Darkest Hour and Batman Doom that have been ground-breakting because people went beyond the known borders and frontiers of the engine.

As of now, I have the feeling - besides some exceptions - that these times are almost over. The quality of the releases is still good, but not as frequent anymore as years ago. And... this is what feels strange the most ...there are no surprises anymore. Moments like "Whoa, how has he done that?" or "This is brilliant, how is this possible in Doom?". Moments that you are playing a wad and simply don't run around in yet another E1-style replacement or things like that.

Please don't misunderstand me: I am not complaining about everyone of us, I am just describing what I am feeling - and I'd like to know what others are thinking, especially people who are there for the same time or even longer :)

Best regards,
Torm
User avatar
esselfortium
Posts: 3862
Joined: Tue Sep 19, 2006 8:43 pm

Re: Is the community out of ideas and motivation?

Post by esselfortium »

I don't think so... There have been plenty of projects in recent years pushing the boundaries and trying experimental or otherwise ambitious things. Lunatic, Adventures of Square, Stardate 20x6, Winter's Fury, and Putrefier come to mind, to name just a few.

When looking back on the past, we tend to gloss over the forgettable stuff and only remember the things that really stood out. I think in the past couple of years alone, though, there have been a lot of noteworthy projects that stand out just as much as the famous classics that have stood the test of time, though it might be harder for them to compete with the long-established recognition of some of the older releases.
User avatar
Shadelight
Posts: 5113
Joined: Fri May 20, 2005 11:16 am
Location: Labrynna

Re: Is the community out of ideas and motivation?

Post by Shadelight »

I agree with essel, I don't think the problem is ideas and motivation. I think it's time. It tends to kill a lot of huge projects like the ones you described.
User avatar
justin_see
Posts: 183
Joined: Tue Jul 30, 2013 7:49 pm

Re: Is the community out of ideas and motivation?

Post by justin_see »

Sometimes I think it boils down to time and money....maybe even lack of help. Add those three together and it is a great recipe to lose motivation. Maybe people forget that this is a hobby and they expect way more from the author than they should- as if the author is being compensated for producing something and their "labor of love" is harshly looked upon- this could help kill a project. Saying that, there is also a "new standard" in making these types of things, making Doom content takes way longer than it used to and the functions and stuff can be way more complicated. I am sitting on a fully complete resource for "Killian Reed" and I wouldn't ever release it for mappers anytime soon because I feel that it could be so much better in every way.
Last edited by justin_see on Fri Nov 01, 2013 2:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
ultimategamerxtreme
Posts: 17
Joined: Sun Sep 01, 2013 8:08 pm
Location: Hell

Re: Is the community out of ideas and motivation?

Post by ultimategamerxtreme »

justin_see wrote:Sometimes I think it boils down to time and money....maybe even lack of help. Add those three together and it is a great recipe to lose motivation. Maybe people forget that this is a hobby and they expect way more from the author than they should- as if the author is being compensated for producing something and their "labor of love" is harshly looked upon- and this could help kill an interesting project.
Probably that or everything goes Mordeth on the project...ya know, restarting development several times, people leaving, and the computer with a majority of the material for the mod being stolen...
User avatar
justin_see
Posts: 183
Joined: Tue Jul 30, 2013 7:49 pm

Re: Is the community out of ideas and motivation?

Post by justin_see »

ultimategamerxtreme wrote:...restarting development several times...
(I added a bit more to my post above)
Yeah, I think that one is the main culprit for me. Made harder especially if your "team" is just one person.
User avatar
TheMightyHeracross
Posts: 2100
Joined: Sun Aug 18, 2013 9:41 am
Location: Philadelphia, PA

Re: Is the community out of ideas and motivation?

Post by TheMightyHeracross »

I agree that there are no "How is that possible???" times, but this community is still full of "That's FREAKING AWESOME" moments.
I don't think we're going to run out of ideas anytime soon. :)
User avatar
Sgt. Shivers
Posts: 1743
Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2012 5:39 am

Re: Is the community out of ideas and motivation?

Post by Sgt. Shivers »

I wonder how that guy put mortal kombat in doom, that's freakin incredible.
User avatar
IMX
Posts: 791
Joined: Sat May 11, 2013 9:20 am
Location: Frogland, Mexico

Re: Is the community out of ideas and motivation?

Post by IMX »

Is the community out of ideas and motivation?
Here's a fact.
Spoiler:
Motivation? There's always motivation, the fact that what we want to do has never done before (or done poorly) is a motivating factor.

What we're lacking of is in the promoting aspect of our projects. There's some great ideas out there, the only thing that is left to do is to let people know about 'em
User avatar
Bitterman
Posts: 564
Joined: Mon Jun 25, 2012 12:06 pm
Location: Stranded on Lh'owon

Re: Is the community out of ideas and motivation?

Post by Bitterman »

This a very interesting topic. I agree there has been some stagnation in gameplay mods. People just add a couple of scripts and voila a mod is ready to release. I'm still debating on whether or not if I should release my mod, since most likely people don't want to play yet another gameplay mod by some kid, and instead should wait on something better. Of course there are good mods such as Accessories to Murder, the Trailblazer, Guncaster, and much more. I suppose more and more people are learning how to mod, and creates quality gaps in projects.
User avatar
twinkieman93
Posts: 1075
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2007 11:13 pm

Re: Is the community out of ideas and motivation?

Post by twinkieman93 »

Eh, I have plenty of ideas, and no motivation. I would dump my ideas in the mod ideas thread, but I'm pretty sure those never get used. Then again, I wouldn't know if they get used because ideas don't get credited when mods are made, or at least they aren't required to be.
User avatar
zrrion the insect
Posts: 2408
Joined: Thu Jun 25, 2009 1:58 pm
Location: Time Station 1: Moon of Glendale

Re: Is the community out of ideas and motivation?

Post by zrrion the insect »

I think some of the reason the old stuff was so awesome and "How is this still Doom?" was because a lot of it hadn't been done before. When people are making 1994 quality stuff, it's not hard to trump that. Now I can open up Doombuilder and do in an hour what would've taken me a week to do in DeapSea, so I'm less impressed by detail that I used to be (If I encountered Vrack2 today I wouldn't be quite as impressed with the detail as I remember being back then). There are still a bunch of things that I see done that surprise me though, Nash's weather system, the helicopter in AD2, pogostick, someone made a shump. But as I grow in my knowledge and mod-making ability, the "How is this still Doom?" feeling's been shifting more towards "I bet they did it this way. *peeks at code/map* Yes they did, cool."
User avatar
Nems
Posts: 674
Joined: Wed Jan 12, 2005 1:09 pm
Graphics Processor: nVidia with Vulkan support
Location: Your forum thread

Re: Is the community out of ideas and motivation?

Post by Nems »

twinkieman93 wrote:Eh, I have plenty of ideas, and no motivation. I would dump my ideas in the mod ideas thread, but I'm pretty sure those never get used. Then again, I wouldn't know if they get used because ideas don't get credited when mods are made, or at least they aren't required to be.
Pretty much my feelings on the matter.

I have ideas. However, a lack of motivation and crippling issues stemming from perfectionism pretty much stop me before I even start trying to mod/map. Most I've tried to do is make my own little randomizer WAD for personal use, but even then it's hard to get myself to do it, despite wanting to learn how to mod and map. I'll make a little progress, then my brain goes "Welp, this is shit" and I delete it.

Maybe I'll work up the nerve to try working on it again and maybe practice some more mapping one day. :\
User avatar
Nash
 
 
Posts: 17340
Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2003 12:07 am
Location: Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia

Re: Is the community out of ideas and motivation?

Post by Nash »

Out of ideas? No. Motivation? Maybe...

I haven't been putting much work on my ZDoom stuff for a very long time because I just don't feel like it. And I have other things (mostly music production related) going on too...

It sucks because I really want to clean up and polish my weather system and make it ready-to-use as an open resource but I just don't feel sitting down and going through the Bugs and Issues list to sort them all out... :/
User avatar
Tormentor667
Posts: 13470
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2003 3:52 am

Re: Is the community out of ideas and motivation?

Post by Tormentor667 »

BlazingPhoenix wrote:time
esselfortium wrote:time
[quote="justin_see""]longer[/quote]
ultimategamerxtreme wrote:Mordeth
Nash wrote:other things going on
Out of most of the posts (even though sometimes in a different context) the main issue seems to be time obviously and the complexity that Doom maps are now and have been in the past. I think justin_see has made a pretty good point towards this: Doom got way more complex.

Sure, a high level of detail is easier to be achieved with tools like (GZ)DB2 and enginewise we have much better possibilites. But I have the feeling that sometimes people do not try to pass these frontiers, to get things done which aren't possible as of now. The main question here is also "Where do people get their inspiration from?". Honestly, games these days are not very inspiring anymore (with a few exceptions) considering all the linearity, scripted stuff and other lame gameplay styles that we know from 3d shooters. That has been different in times of Duke Nukem 3D, Unreal or Dark Forces.

Return to “General”