Mirror Problem

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Mirror Problem

Postby Deathzone » Wed Jul 01, 2009 9:44 pm

There is a problem with the mirrors I make. They don't reflect right. they show like weird stuff. I don't have screen shots but if you need them I can get some.

I believe this is the problem : Note that the line must have enough void space behind it to fit all of the reflected geometry

but I don't know what to do to give it enough void space. Please help.
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Re: Mirror Problem

Postby Kappes Buur » Wed Jul 01, 2009 10:41 pm

As a general RoT ( rule of thumb ), the distance behind the mirror, the void, should be as large as, or better much larger, the distance in front of the mirror, from the mirror to the wall directly opposite

Sorry, I don't have a program with which I can include arrows in the picture.
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Re: Mirror Problem

Postby Kate » Wed Jul 01, 2009 11:19 pm

Another thing you should avoid is constructs exactly like the last post - you see, anything that's behind the mirror will be shown in front of it as well, which can cause strange artifacts when you look into it. General rule is, you should have an empty space behind the mirror that is as big as the area in front of the mirror. Treat it in the same way as if you were flipping and copypasting the entire room behind the mirror line, joining it to the mirror. That is exactly what ZDoom does in the game when you look into the mirror.

GZDoom seems to be a bit more tolerable about this. It's still a bad idea, though.
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Re: Mirror Problem

Postby HotWax » Wed Jul 01, 2009 11:25 pm

Yeah, Kappes, your example only really works when you're viewing the mirror directly from the front. If you were at a 45-degree angle to it and there was an imp in the hallway behind the mirror (from your new POV), he would be rendered inside the reflection.
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Re: Mirror Problem

Postby Deathzone » Thu Jul 02, 2009 12:24 am

Another problem: I have the mirror effect and the sector behind it large enough but it doesn't actually use the mirror effect it just looks like a room is there. Like if you opened a door and it stayed open.
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Re: Mirror Problem

Postby HotWax » Thu Jul 02, 2009 1:11 am

You shouldn't have a sector behind it. You should have void, which is an absense of sector geometry. See how Kappes' example has empty space in the middle?
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Re: Mirror Problem

Postby XutaWoo » Thu Jul 02, 2009 1:35 am

Hm, does the "render stuff behind it" only work in situations like Kappes? Because otherwise I can think of some pretty interesting things to use with that.
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Re: Mirror Problem

Postby Deathzone » Thu Jul 02, 2009 1:41 am

Ohhhhh... thanks a lot lol I thought that was a sector.
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Re: Mirror Problem

Postby HotWax » Thu Jul 02, 2009 4:35 pm

XutaWoo wrote:Hm, does the "render stuff behind it" only work in situations like Kappes? Because otherwise I can think of some pretty interesting things to use with that.

Pink's description is accurate. Imagine that at the mirror line, the entire level in front of it is flipped to the opposite side of the line. Assuming there are no walls to block your view, anything and everything on the back of the line will be visible through the mirror.

It's easiest to think of ZDoom mirrors as a highly reflective window rather than a true mirror. You'll see everything on the other side as well as the things on your side of the mirror.

I'm not 100% sure if the BSP tree will muck with things though. If you stuck an imp in an isolated sector behind a mirror with the intention of him being visible (as if the mirror was reflecting something that's not there), it might not work because the BSP tree will have occluded that sector from ever being drawn unless you're in it.

[edit] Oh holy crap.

So I was curious and decided to investigate this myself, and my previous description is... lacking.

What the mirror seems to do is flip the entire map around the line, meaning that what is behind it will actually be rendered, backwards, in front of it. I tried putting an isolated sector with a Baron in it behind my mirror, and I end up with a baron standing in front of the mirror, facing away from me and the front wall of his sector behind him (so he's facing it). When I pass by (or through) the baron, he disappears, and then I can pass through the wall to see the actual mirror, rendering an unblemished reflection of the room I'm standing in behind me.

Very, very odd.
Attachments
funwithmirrors.zip
Trippy...
(769 Bytes) Downloaded 20 times
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Re: Mirror Problem

Postby XutaWoo » Thu Jul 02, 2009 5:04 pm

And it also gives me a huges HOM in GZDoom. :\
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