EDGE 2.1.0 Discussion [RC-1 Released on 10.3.2018]

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Re: 3DGE 1.37 (Discussion, 60FPS, etc)

Postby chronoteeth » Sun Jul 13, 2014 8:30 pm

I just cant wait to be working in 60 fps finally. Thats the big one
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Re: 3DGE 1.37 (Discussion, 60FPS, etc)

Postby Coraline » Sun Jul 13, 2014 10:30 pm

VGA wrote:But I'm looking forward to 1.36F regardless. Why do you change the executable name with each revision, though? It messes with shortcuts, zdl etc. Maybe too late to change now, but please don't start with 1.37A :lol: :lol:


There will be only one version of 1.37. Starting with 1.4 I won't change the executable name.

zZaRDoZz wrote:I can't talk you into more than 4 action keys? Some new spells/magic items for heretic would be awesome.


Working on it. I can program as many action keys as you want, but I think it'd be nicer to have an actual inventory spindle. Working on that though.

chronoteeth wrote:I just cant wait to be working in 60 fps finally. Thats the big one


Yeah it'll be a game changer for sure. I'm really hoping the port sees at least a minor resurgence.
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Re: 3DGE 1.37 (Discussion, 60FPS, etc)

Postby wildweasel » Sun Jul 13, 2014 11:28 pm

Is the 60 FPS upgrade an actual change to the game tic rate that can be toggled, or is it camera interpolation a la ZDoom and prboom-plus? Either way, I almost wonder if I should do a mod for this for old times' sake, considering I haven't done an EDGE mod since...2003?
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Re: 3DGE 1.37 (Discussion, 60FPS, etc)

Postby chronoteeth » Mon Jul 14, 2014 12:19 am

u can sort of fake 60fps with weapon animations atm by adding a bunch of lines with zero time ticks in the animation, but it's not too efficient and it adds a lot of bad bulk to a weapons animations
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Re: 3DGE 1.37 (Discussion, 60FPS, etc)

Postby Coraline » Mon Jul 14, 2014 12:33 am

wildweasel wrote:Is the 60 FPS upgrade an actual change to the game tic rate that can be toggled, or is it camera interpolation a la ZDoom and prboom-plus? Either way, I almost wonder if I should do a mod for this for old times' sake, considering I haven't done an EDGE mod since...2003?



Framerate unlock is render-side interpolation, because anything more would affect the physics (Eular).

It'd be nice to see a new mod for this thing from you WW! :)
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Re: 3DGE 1.37 (Discussion, 60FPS, etc)

Postby VGA » Mon Jul 14, 2014 4:08 am

The 8mbgmpat patchset is as easy to make work as extracting the files in a folder. But I read people saying that EAWPATS is better, how can I try that one?

Things on my mind:
- Shouldn't the game show "Game successfully saved in slot x." when saving? It's weird not to get a message, I used to check the console to make sure.
- Maybe the screenshot button could make a little sound? I hate not getting feedback on actions.
- Someone should make a nice 3DGE screen with skulls as loading bar and get rid of that sissy fireworks intro, eheheh!!
- Loading icon should be off by default and enabled through console as an easter egg, not the other way around.
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Re: 3DGE 1.37 (Discussion, 60FPS, etc)

Postby Coraline » Mon Jul 14, 2014 4:34 am

1) Just extract EAWPATS into your 8MBGMPAT folder. It's pretty simple to set up, we just don't support SF2 soundfonts, keep that in mind.
2) I guess I can write a message to the screen saying Game Saved or something. Save System is seriously over-complex due to the introduction of the HUB system/etc., but I'll do that.
3) You don't like the intro? Guess I can make another one, I like the fireworks though - short, sweet, and unique! ^_^
4) I thought the original DOOM had the loading icon ON by default? Regardless, it's a small console command but I'll reverse it for the next release.
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Re: 3DGE 1.37 (Discussion, 60FPS, etc)

Postby zZaRDoZz » Tue Jul 15, 2014 7:05 am

*takes deep breath*

Okay, so you've answered this question from me a thousand times and I hope you'll pardon my altzheimers concerning your previous answers but....

Is there any chance of getting full glboom compatibility ? boom scrollers are the only boom feature that never worked with edge, and it would be suprising to learn that certain boom hacks weren't dependant on said features. Never wuite undrrstood why a port e
would stop at 95% compatibility.
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Re: 3DGE 1.37 (Discussion, 60FPS, etc)

Postby Coraline » Tue Jul 15, 2014 11:12 am

EDGE wasn't coded like other ports. Rather than develop code based on an existing codebase, they pretty much developed these scripts from scratch to replace much of the normal gamecode and line behaviors. For example, Dehacked gets converted to DDF, therefore losing compatibility. BOOM was pretty much cherry-picked into the engine and not developed from existing code. Things like Graf had mentioned earlier were converted to RTS just because that's what they wanted to do. In doing all of these things, rather than clean up and expand the original code, it broke a lot of compatibility. This is why I'm having trouble fixing these bugs that went unnoticed for as long as they did.

However, aside from a few bugs, EDGE is still able to play DOOM faithfully. At the time, it seemed like a good idea to replace these things with more advanced scripting languages (for their time, they were really out there, before Zdoom hit 2.0 of course). I doubt the original authors thought that these quirks and exploits would have lasted as long as they have.

But, the payoff there was that you can virtually mod the entire engine to your liking, in a very easy way. It's just that after 2006 or so the engine stopped keeping up.
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Re: 3DGE 1.37 (Discussion, 60FPS, etc)

Postby chronoteeth » Tue Jul 15, 2014 2:39 pm

Im just glad to see it still being pushed through. zdoom's decorate never clicked with me, an cuz of that every time i tried i just didnt feel "the groove" of modding like I do with edge. edge is prolly the only other port that, where you look at it from a coding angle, is comparable to decorate in a lot of ways. things that cant be done simply in edge can be done using rts and coal, and i'd like to see it utilized fully.

the only problem with edge is that its bane to a lot of cancelled mods. loads of tcs get announced and they never end up anywhere. without that a lot of modders get kinda turned away, because whats the point in making for a port that has 1-3 big actually finished mods, in comparison to zdooms hundreds. even other ports have more than these guys
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Re: 3DGE 1.37 (Discussion, 60FPS, etc)

Postby zZaRDoZz » Tue Jul 15, 2014 6:48 pm

@ chronoteeth

It's a little sad that edge has to adopt decorate but I understand the reasoning. Decorate has become a lingua franca of scripting within the doom mod scene, is the most mature of the doom scripts, and has more support than all other doom coding languages combined. I hope the edge team will leave out a good number of lumps for decorate though as they've been in development for years and using more than just the basics feels like cheating, even though the zdoom license doesn't forbid it.
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Re: 3DGE 1.37 (Discussion, 60FPS, etc)

Postby chronoteeth » Tue Jul 15, 2014 7:38 pm

I just hope that I can still use ddf to create mods. one of the big things is essentially "why.mod for edge now if it uses the same code? ill just use zdoom then". using things in conjunction are fine, but I learned ddf because the coding language interested me wholesale. I have no desire to use edge if I can't use ddf, because that's what attracted me to it
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Re: 3DGE 1.37 (Discussion, 60FPS, etc)

Postby Coraline » Wed Jul 16, 2014 12:08 am

DDF is staying for good. Chrono summed it up perfectly - its the only other real language comparable to Decorate - if you can read one you can read the other. DDF is only going to get better as time goes on, and the other scripts like RTS and COAL (also SPLINE when that gets finished) will also mature.

When i say a converter i mean literally that - a Decorate to DDF conversion program. Remember that Vavoom and others also work the same way. Cannot risk EDGE losing its GPL status for any reason.

Also, not sure if you guys have ever seen this. Uploaded last year (it's come a bit along since) - it's playing the Heretic IWAD:
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Re: 3DGE 1.37 (Discussion, 60FPS, etc)

Postby Gez » Wed Jul 16, 2014 4:14 am

ZDoom's own code is under the 3-point BSD license so taking code from it isn't a threat to GPL status; it's perfectly compatible. The only problems are: some Build code in the renderer (notably for voxels), the FMOD code in the audio renderer, the MAME OPL emulator, and the MUSLIB code. Everything else -- and that includes everything having to do with game logic -- is fair game, since it is either original Doom code (available under the GPL) or independent ZDoom code (and BSD). Randi has also been willing, in the past, to allow relicensing his code under the GPL.
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Re: 3DGE 1.37 (Discussion, 60FPS, etc)

Postby Coraline » Wed Jul 16, 2014 11:07 am

That is certainly good to know. Thanks Gez for clarifying! =)
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