Project Osiris - Alien Breed 3D for GZDoom (0.10 BETA)

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Re: Project Osiris - Alien Breed 3D for GZDoom (0.10 BETA)

Postby JohnnyTheWolf » Wed Jan 27, 2021 11:34 am

ArcturusDeluxe wrote:Thanks! Not played much Marathon myself, so I'm not sure I'm your man for that one!


I know, I was just highlighting the irony of porting a Doom killer to Doom; at this rate, it is only a matter of time before someone decides to redo the Marathon Trilogy too! :lol:

But to tell the truth, this total conversion does remind me of Marathon a lot, I am not really sure why. Maybe it is the level design, the dark environment or even some of the weapons?

Anyway, looking forward to 1.0! :D

Captain J wrote:And now i'm wondering, can we expect to see the new map pack? Like what if Alien Breed had some kind of expansion or community map pack?

Oh yes, please! A community map pack would be especially great, especially if it features better level design than the original game. :wub:

Either that or a side-mod that lets you play vanilla mapsets with Project Osiris' arsenal and bestiary!
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Re: Project Osiris - Alien Breed 3D for GZDoom (0.10 BETA)

Postby zxdunny » Wed Jan 27, 2021 1:39 pm

At the risk of sounding like a moaner (again) the changes to the levels are what's stopping me playing the latest update, so a map pack of the original levels would be lovely.
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Re: Project Osiris - Alien Breed 3D for GZDoom (0.10 BETA)

Postby ArcturusDeluxe » Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:46 pm

JohnnyTheWolf wrote:I know, I was just highlighting the irony of porting a Doom killer to Doom; at this rate, it is only a matter of time before someone decides to redo the Marathon Trilogy too! :lol:

But to tell the truth, this total conversion does remind me of Marathon a lot, I am not really sure why. Maybe it is the level design, the dark environment or even some of the weapons?

Anyway, looking forward to 1.0! :D

It's interesting that you call it a "Doom killer"? Do you just mean that was the intention or that it was actually better than Doom? If so I can't say I really agree with that myself. Though the engine was very clever considering the limitations and could do some things that Doom couldn't, and I do have a lot of nostalgic affection for AB3D, I gotta say I don't think it holds a candle to Doom in the end. Just my view of things though!

As far as the Marathon comparison goes, I can sort of see what you're saying. Especially since Osiris renders them at a resolution that you can compare them a bit more easily.
The simple lo-fi level designs and the slightly awkward hand-drawn sprites have a similar feel. (I don't even mean that negatively btw, it's charming!)

Captain J wrote:And now i'm wondering, can we expect to see the new map pack? Like what if Alien Breed had some kind of expansion or community map pack?

I've definitely thought of doing a map pack somewhere down the road, like a new 16 level set with more modern design. I'd want to get the demo maps out first though (will be working on those after 1.0) so that people have the extra enemy types and resources to work with. That said, I also want to work on some different projects at some point, so it might be some time before I get to making all-new maps. In the mean time people are always free to make mods and maps if they want to, I'd love to see that.

zxdunny wrote:At the risk of sounding like a moaner (again) the changes to the levels are what's stopping me playing the latest update, so a map pack of the original levels would be lovely.

At this point, I plan to put out the 'clean' maps as a separate download, but they'd be intended more as a resource, than a proper way to play the game. Even these maps will be slightly different as I made some changes during the recreation process (cleaned up what seemed like line misplacements, fixed some texture bugs etc) and certain differences between the engines had to be worked around, such as the way certain lift platforms work.

The thing is, the goal of this project was always to make a modernised AB3D with (what I hope are) improvements to the maps and gameplay, and I never meant it to be an exact clone of the original. The mere fact it's in GZDoom makes it a fundamentally different game, with different physics and so on. For a long time I was a bit torn as to whether to add a 'classic' mode with the original maps and old gameplay style, but making and maintaining a whole seperate balance that's slightly closer to the original doesn't seem worth it to me. It would be two broadly similar versions of the same thing, neither of which are exactly true to the original game anyway.

You don't sound like a moaner or anything, don't worry about that. Could I ask what exactly puts you off though? Is it that it's further from the original game, or something specific about the changes I made? I'd be interested to hear the feedback.
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Re: Project Osiris - Alien Breed 3D for GZDoom (0.10 BETA)

Postby JohnnyTheWolf » Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:54 pm

Sorry. What I meant is that Alien Breed 3D was meant to be a "Doom killer", as it was one of the Amiga's attempts at offering an alternative to Doom. Of course, it ultimately failed, so it is both nice and ironic that the game would find a second life on the engine of the very game it was meant to rival.
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Re: Project Osiris - Alien Breed 3D for GZDoom (0.10 BETA)

Postby aconike » Wed Feb 03, 2021 10:58 am

This game is unreal and FAMOUS. The atmosphere, super gameplay and atmosphere + is made up of the best person on the PC scene! Thank you!

ps. Take a look at my last PM and write to me in the PM if you could adjust the levels for me according to the photos I sent.

Thank you
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Re: Project Osiris - Alien Breed 3D for GZDoom (0.10 BETA)

Postby Sgt. Pepperoni » Tue Feb 16, 2021 1:55 pm

First off, I wanted to congratulate you for all your hard work ! I never had the chance playing the original back in the day, despite having an Amiga, but thanks to you I had the chance to, and it was a blast !

Have you figured how to implement the underwater effect you struggled to replicate, yet ? If not, have you considered using a rippling post-processing shader ? It might do the trick, I don't know much about GZDoom, but it might worth doing some digging.
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Re: Project Osiris - Alien Breed 3D for GZDoom (0.10 BETA)

Postby Cherno » Tue Feb 16, 2021 5:00 pm

It's not possible to recreate the rippling effect of Alien Breed 3D with a GZDoom shader, neither a post-processing nor a fragment one.
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Re: Project Osiris - Alien Breed 3D for GZDoom (0.10 BETA)

Postby ArcturusDeluxe » Fri Feb 19, 2021 7:21 pm

Sgt. Pepperoni wrote:Have you figured how to implement the underwater effect you struggled to replicate, yet ? If not, have you considered using a rippling post-processing shader ? It might do the trick, I don't know much about GZDoom, but it might worth doing some digging.

Yeah a shader would really be the only way to do it, but something about how GZDoom works at the moment means I'm unable to add a refraction effect. Something to do with shaders not being able to access what's behind it? Or something like that? I'm not really knowledgeable on the subject, but that's what I remember being told, and I haven't seen it implemented elsewhere. I really want to have it too, but it depends on what the devs of GZDoom do.
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Re: Project Osiris - Alien Breed 3D for GZDoom (0.10 BETA)

Postby Cherno » Fri Feb 19, 2021 8:18 pm

GZDoom's shader support does not include access to the depth buffer, so you only ever get access to a pixel of one specific surface (sprites are considered surfaces as well), and anything behind it off limits. Hence, the rippling effect is not possible.
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Re: Project Osiris - Alien Breed 3D for GZDoom (0.10 BETA)

Postby Gez » Sat Feb 20, 2021 2:13 pm

You could try things with the post-process shader, but then it'd apply to the entire screen -- not to a specific area of world geometry. One could imagine using chroma-keying techniques to solve that issue, but then it becomes really, really hacky and you can expect weird jank as a result.
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Re: Project Osiris - Alien Breed 3D for GZDoom (0.10 BETA)

Postby aconike » Fri Feb 26, 2021 1:01 pm

Hi,
I have a question
when will the new version be
Write some new info, what will be there, what you have improved, what you have done for good new things, how many secret rooms you have made and so on.

Please (if you want) if you would be willing to make some new bikes - something like a special section with suggestions, and we might add something to me and let me finish it.

Thank you
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Re: Project Osiris - Alien Breed 3D for GZDoom (0.10 BETA)

Postby zxdunny » Fri Mar 05, 2021 7:01 pm

ArcturusDeluxe wrote:You don't sound like a moaner or anything, don't worry about that. Could I ask what exactly puts you off though? Is it that it's further from the original game, or something specific about the changes I made? I'd be interested to hear the feedback.


Ok, sorry for the delay in replying. I have no excuse. Please don't take this as whining, I'm trying to be constructive :)

The lighting is fantastic, the gameplay is spot-on, I can live with those weird green and blue pickups if I absolutely have to (though would prefer to be able to go back to the original pickup graphics if possible an option like being able to use the original weapons). But what I really don't like are two things:

1) Drops to prevent backtracking. Level 2 has one at the entrance to the third room (which serves only to annoy if you accidentally fall down it - you then have to fight to get to the switch to raise the stairs... but if you've played it before then you just stand at the top and wait for the enemies to come to you and pick them off one by one as they can no longer get to you). Drops remove a gameplay style where you can inflict damage and then retreat to draw enemies out or catch your breath. AB3D has large arenas where it's packed with bad guys and you have to be more tactical than just running in guns blazing.

You corrected the drop at the end of level 2 nicely by raising stairs at the end of the fight. That was nice.

There is another drop in level 3, too, and this one then does force you into a large area with no retreat possible. Also annoying.

2) Removed (in Level 3 again) a large area (the one with a secret and the lift to the teleporter) an large area filled with bad guys and replaced it with a corridor shooting section. You can quite simply walk through that one and just kill everything as it appears, whereas previously you had to be more careful.

I'm sorry to say I didn't bother to play beyond level 3, and dug out an earlier version. Which is a shame as you've done such an amazing job. Having the original levels as an optional level pack, or an option in the Osiris settings would be just wonderful.

Anyway, I'll stop now, and continue to watch this thread with interest. And give my heartfelt thanks for what you've done so far, even if it's not quite what it was.
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