[Retail-ation mod]: Christmas Release!

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Which Retail-ation mod should be released next?

Ultimate Doom - next release, somehow improved
12
26%
Doom 2
20
43%
Heretic
5
11%
Hexen
7
15%
I don't care about such mods.
1
2%
I was disappointed with the first release of it. I care no longer.
1
2%
 
Total votes : 46

Re: Retail-ation mod series

Postby Zaero » Mon Jun 25, 2012 9:26 am

Lava Grunt wrote:Yeah, Essel did come off kind of rude. But oh well. What's done is done.

Looking forward to this. After all, the screenshots are a WiP, so whatever the final product looks like is anyone's guess. (though I think I have a decent mental image of what it will look like.)


Well the project needs testing that's for sure. This part takes a lot more time than the actual modding.

I'm pretty close to fix the "infinitely tall switches" bug (solution is actually a part of ZDoom engine itself). All I need is a list of levels in which this bug shouldn't be fixed. So do you know of any maps in which switches are otherwise unreachable? Please list the names in: "iwad", "map", "place descryption" order.

List the levels from all ID games based on Doom Engine.
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Re: Retail-ation mod series

Postby XutaWoo » Mon Jun 25, 2012 3:28 pm

Such a pleasant way to respond to criticism!

Zaero wrote:Both gunsprites and hi-res textures pack are NOT the part of the mod, so g*t off - I use what I like (and clean your pants probably wet after screaming about the "one texture!").


For one, you shouldn't show screenshots of your mods while other mods are loaded. It's fine for weapon mods to be loaded with map sets, but with something like this where the scope is pretty broad, it's best to load only the mod. It could very well alter the gun sprites and add hi-res textures since, y'know, this is to make the DOOM games as if they were made years later. Which would affect more than the level progression and the fact that you're walking through pea soup.

Also...self-censoring a non-swear word? What?

Zaero wrote:As for the fog, yes, it's a part of the mod, but you're the one saying it's "nuclear". Did you breathe it?


I say it's pretty unsafe looking, too. But not in the scary way, it just looks like unclean air. Especially in screenshot 2.

Zaero wrote:Is there something wrong with using the custom mapinfo as a mod? Is it forbidden? By whom? Where can I see the codex?


Keyword is 'just'. Anyone can just whip up something that does stuff like this easily. Effortlessly, even; the only thing only there is tedium and considering it's just fog, changing the next map of the M8s, and removing some text, there's not a lot of it.

And while people do do this...they tend not to release it. For reasons that should be obvious.

Also,

Zaero wrote:Well the project needs testing that's for sure.


What.
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Re: Retail-ation mod series

Postby Zaero » Wed Jun 27, 2012 6:42 am

XutaWoo wrote:Such a pleasant way to respond to criticism!


Non-constructive criticism only.

For one, you shouldn't show screenshots of your mods while other mods are loaded. It's fine for weapon mods to be loaded with map sets, but with something like this where the scope is pretty broad, it's best to load only the mod. It could very well alter the gun sprites and add hi-res textures since, y'know, this is to make the DOOM games as if they were made years later. Which would affect more than the level progression and the fact that you're walking through pea soup.


"the scope is pretty broad" - arguable.
"it's best to load only the mod" - probably. There is a list of mod's features anyway, so I really don't know how dumb the reader must be to not know what is included in the mod and what isn't, since it's clearly stated.

Also...self-censoring a non-swear word? What?


I was considering some other word (matching the level of rudeness), but left the idea.

I say it's pretty unsafe looking, too. But not in the scary way, it just looks like unclean air. Especially in screenshot 2.


Well, the Shore of Hell is pretty unsafe place, don't you think? After almost 20 years since it's release it's hard to make Doom scary again.
I agree with the "unclean air" look, its like a sand/dust storm or something and IMHO matches the episode's theme.

Keyword is 'just'. Anyone can just whip up something that does stuff like this easily.


But not everyone does. I've seen the posts here asking for episode merge of UDoom, or asking for help with mapinfo. Not many of them are really answered, so I think there are in fact 2 factions:
1. The ones thinking is very easy (can't say it's untrue), but not releasing their work for some reason, even to others which asks for it.
2. The ones who don't have an idea how to past the first lines of zdoom wiki describing the mapinfo. This group is often asking for help and/or releases but are rarely heard.

Effortlessly, even; the only thing only there is tedium and considering it's just fog, changing the next map of the M8s, and removing some text, there's not a lot of it.


There are a few more things to do it really good, but yeah, nothing big really. Never said otherwise.

And while people do do this...they tend not to release it. For reasons that should be obvious.


Which are..? Cuz everyone is able to? I don't do statistics but have seen the proof that it's untrue.

Zaero wrote:Well the project needs testing that's for sure.


What.


Testing. I'm pretty sure you're familiar with the word. You think its obsolete in a mod like this? You're "almost" right. Keyword is "almost". :P
The reason if the fake-fog effect. There are 2 ways to apply it without touching the map files:
1. applies it globally (to the whole level)
2. applies it to exteriors (sectors with sky ceiling)

For each map, one of this methods is better. It's not easy to tell which unless the "outside" sectors are seen. See below what may happen:

Anyway, if you're modding anything without proper testing, then what can I say? "Oh, well.." only.
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Re: Retail-ation mod series

Postby Crudux Cruo » Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:35 am

The guy is making a contiguous I-wad conversion with enhanced effects, for those of you that didn't read the post. If you aren't gonna play it, or give constructive criticism, get off his ass and let him do his thing please.

that being said, i have always hated the episodic flow of doom, heretic, ect, and i cant wait to use this with your classic weapons mod (please release it soon!), and i look foward to seing just what this mod will do once its released.
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Re: Retail-ation mod series

Postby Zaero » Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:47 am

doomer1 wrote:that being said, i have always hated the episodic flow of doom, heretic, ect, and i cant wait to use this with your classic weapons mod (please release it soon!)


As you wish: http://www.mediafire.com/?u89qkj4a0akxkoo :wink:
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Re: Retail-ation mod series

Postby Crudux Cruo » Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:54 am

yay!
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Re: Retail-ation mod series

Postby Zaero » Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:59 am

doomer1 wrote:yay!

I know you're in hurry to test it :D
Just share the other opinions as well later! :lol:
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Re: Retail-ation mod series

Postby Crudux Cruo » Wed Jun 27, 2012 2:05 pm

Well i tested it out after doing some bike browsing and... its a skin pack. Im a little disappointed because i thought you were going to do classic style weapons, like no reloads, different graphics, ect.

it also is not a complete conversion in the case of the rifle, and the mp40 is a little jerky so... 2.5/5 its ok. worth a look.
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Re: Retail-ation mod series

Postby Zaero » Wed Jun 27, 2012 2:30 pm

doomer1 wrote:Well i tested it out after doing some bike browsing and... its a skin pack. Im a little disappointed because i thought you were going to do classic style weapons, like no reloads, different graphics, ect.

it also is not a complete conversion in the case of the rifle, and the mp40 is a little jerky so... 2.5/5 its ok. worth a look.


Thanks for giving it a try.
This mod alters graphics only, yes. For a few reasons which I'll share with you:
1. First of all, its much easier to maintain the compability with feature releases of BD this way. If I'll touch the scripts:
-there is a huge probability I'll have to do it for each new BD release (which comes out quite often)
-the risk of bug will be much greater (now its simply zero)
-users will have to track the new BD releases as well as updates to Classic Weapons Pack
2. Sarge Mark takes a good care in balancing the BD. If I'll start to mess with weapon properties I'll screw the balance and made this mod less playable/enjoyable
3. There is really no point for me in reverting the game back to pure vanilla weapons with no reload etc, since there is Brutal Doom Lite already available for players seeking this.
4. It would be strange to make a mod for BD then altering weapons to go away from the BD's concept. Something like buying a van then tuning/turning it into sportscar.

As for the rifle I'm not sure what you think saying about "not a complete conversion". As far as I know, all the vanilla frames of this weapons are used (Alpha Doom does not have reload frames if that's what you're thinking). As for MP40.. if you refer to firing animation it's meant to be that way. You see weapon pickup for this weapon is so small, it's obvious the whole weapon is small as well (something like Tec-9). So the gun's kickback is quite strong, yet not counterbalanced like in the other weapons - that's why the weapon "shakes" so much.

I'm a bit suprised you didn't know what content the mod will have, especially that you wasn't aware of reloading animations, which can be seen on screenshots.
Anyway, sorry to disappoint you. :?
Last edited by Zaero on Sun Jul 08, 2012 1:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Retail-ation mod series

Postby Zaero » Sun Jul 08, 2012 1:00 pm

8.7.2012 Progress update:

Ultimate Doom:
-Fog effects to all levels applied (still needs testing)
-Additional map, played after "Fortress of Mystery". The title is "The Mystery Revealed" - the map is simply XBox's "Sewers" level with some additional, weird features (altered gravity among other things).

Doom 2:
-Revised concept: now there'll be 2 additional episodes, both optional (some will be unavailable for users which don't have certain addons, "Master Levels" for ex.). Each episode will contain 20 levels + some secret, and a simple story fitting the Doom universe.
-Users with no additional levels can still play the mod, without the "new" episodes
-episode 2 will contain mostly Playstation/Xbox/360 exclusive levels
-episode 3 will constain all the Master Levels
-new skies added to episode 2 and 3
-fog effects for episodes 2 and 3 still needs to be done

Heretic:
-Merged all the levels of H:SotSR into a single campaign
-Added 3 hidden official levels as additional secret levels in episodes 3, 4 and 5.
-new, moving sky added to episode 2, 4 and 5
-some graphics altered (not sure if this will be part of the mod)
-Fog added to the levels but needs testing
EDIT:
-player can keep his/hers inventory between the levels (amount not reduced to 1, but Fly artifacts still taken away)
-Fly artifacts has infinite use in the current level (just like in Hexen)
-Some features of "Mapinfo Patch" (see my post below) included

I would be glad to hear from guys interested in those projects, so I would know if anybody cares or not.
Last edited by Zaero on Tue Jul 10, 2012 2:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Retail-ation mod series

Postby insightguy » Mon Jul 09, 2012 8:18 am

getting it when it's released. looks very interesting
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Re: Retail-ation mod series

Postby Zaero » Tue Jul 10, 2012 9:21 am

insightguy wrote:getting it when it's released. looks very interesting


Ok, since there is interest, it's time for the first release:

The mod for Ultimate Doom entered it's final stage of development which is public testing. So the file is here to grab:
http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?cj5srw56d1cv3x4

If I'll receive no bug reports, this may be considered final release.
Note: Read the ReadMe.txt first, since this release depends on some external files which are not included for legal reasons.

Also as a bonus, I would like to introduce and release "Mapinfo Patch" I use. This alters some game settings to (IMHO) improve the gameplay.
The file can be used with any Doom IWAD and some pwads as well! For details, read the included ReadMe file.

Download: http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?lhyp9c43vuf4qsm
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Re: Retail-ation mod series

Postby Zaero » Thu Oct 25, 2012 6:19 am

25.10.12 Progress Update:

It's been some time since there was any progress in here, due to a few facts:
1. I've got no support from community, no opinions, bugreports etc. This leaves me with no clues about directions these mods should follow.
2. I've came over a few legal limits (trying to contact some level authors to no avail) which slows down the development a little
3. Currently I play no vanilla levels but mostly custom megawads so I have really no time to test the mods

Anyway, I have revised the concept of the mod a little to bypass the legal/no clues limits, and here are the conclusions:
1. The mods will allow BOTH episodic AND continuous gameplay (CG). So EACH Doom game will be separated into 4 episodes to select, but the player will be transfered to the next episode with all his items when the previous episode ends. For example Doom 2 episodes will be:
-map 01: Hell on Earth
-map 07: Base Instinct
-map 12: Armed Assault
-map 21: To Hell and Back?
So the guys complaining about CG being too easy may play the game as usual, and guys wanting CG may also play it the way they want. Win-Win situation for all! :D
2. I plan to improve all 4 Doom IWADs (with Ultimate Doom and Doom 2 wads already finished - RC1 version) and TNT, Plutonia wads pending modification.
3. I plan to improve Heretic: SotSR (RC1 version already finished, awaiting more testing) with both episode selection and CG + extended with re-enabled hidden SotSR levels (3 extra maps, 2 already present in heretic.wad, 1 altered to be finishable in SP)
4. Hexen mod development halted for now.
5. Final/Doom/1/2 mods will contain no additional maps if I'll be unable to contact their authors for a long time. In this case the mods will include/tweak only vanilla levels.
6. For now on, development speed will be effected by amount of support I receive - no interest, no updates, no release. If no one cares it would be a waste of time for me to post progress updates and care about legal issues. I already have the files for my personal use anyway.
But if you DO care about the mods, please express it! Your opinion is the greatest guide and motivator for a developer.

Cheers!
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Re: [Retail-ation mod]: Christmas Release!

Postby Zaero » Sun Jan 27, 2013 12:12 pm

I decided to BUMP the topic, since the last Christmas update may come unnoticed to some of you.
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Re: [Retail-ation mod]: Christmas Release!

Postby Freaklore1 » Mon May 30, 2016 12:28 am

Nevander added a custom Mapinfo wad for Ultimate Doom to turn it into a non episodic format in the Doom 64 weapons only wad because it was neccesary for the Unmaker weapon and it's upgrades.

And yet no one went into that thread to post a negative comment about it,so i dont understand what's the problem here.
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