Aliens: Colonial Marines TC - FINISHED

[Inglorious]

I think I'm towards the end of this and just wow. Even with Doom-levels of graphics there's still a lot of attention to detail and the Alien sprites -while primitive- are effective and the author(s) were able to achieve something with the A.I. I didn't think was possible in a Doom Source Port. I played through all of the FPS Alien games and beaten all of them but Resurrection and Jaguar AVP (neither game held my attention and using a controller for an FPS blows) and barring Resurrection this game got the A.I. right. Aliens walk on walls and seemingly dodge and most importantly do not get stuck on corners. This feels like a remake/sequel to Rebellion's Marine campaign in both Jaguar AVP and AVP Classic 2000. Genuinely intense and scary from more than just ambushes and "boo" scares -though, there have been a few here and there- it just totally delivers. Of all the Alien FPS games I've played this would definitely be the best one despite missing a few key details such as the motion tracker. Great survival horror game too. For most of my run my health has barely gone above 50 and ammo is not plentiful. I feel lucky every time I find a clip or a few shotty shells.

Top 5 best TC's ever material.

[ObsessedWithMODs]

By no means am I against the idea of nerfing the xenos for gameplay purposes, but from my experience with ACM, their blood is almost, if not completely harmless. No-one's asking for full-blown acid destructo-physics, but a little splash damage would have been sufficient. AvP 2010 nailed this aspect.

The strongest acid damage system I've ever seen would have to be the one implemented for AvP 1999/Gold Edition/Classic 2000.

If you ever played it you would recall that after killing an Alien if you walk into it's corpse before it fully disappeared your health (and armor) would tremendously drain away quickly.

Therefore the utilizing minimum splash kills are strongly advised, such as primarily through head shots, or shooting off their limbs.

Maybe Gearbox could try duplicating that concept in a future patch, although it's highly unlikely, and I am only assuming they haven't done so by now in the current updates.

I don't ever recall taking any acid damage from walking over recently killed Aliens in ACM, therefore I never needed to hop over them or avoid them.

As for making it a tactical squad-based FPS, personally I couldn't think of anything worse. ACM needed to go in the opposite direction - it needed more sections where the player was alone and outnumbered, relying on their motion tracker and their wits rather than invulnerable, dim-witted NPC's who spent more time getting in the way than actually helping out. And fewer Wey-Yu merc sections. A good idea, but implemented way too soon in the game. It's Aliens, not CoD.

I get what you mean, you enjoy suspense in games like these. So do I, but if a game goes for realism then it should stick with it. And the "One Man Army" concept used throughout an entire game like an Aliens game has virtually No realism.

Suspense can work even if it was squad tactical because it will entirely depend on how the game was designed around that "suspense" concept.

I could already think of a few already:

Allow motion trackers and flashlights (shoulder lamps) to malfunction; if these two always worked and worked perfectly then suspense only works so much because then you could always use them to consistently counteract a hidden Alien in the dark, etc.,...

Give significantly less ammo at certain times; such as forcing players to think strategically on when and where to deploy sentry units and which doors they must weld shut (the game was much too linear and scripted on this matter so that ruins suspense immediately because it virtually spoon feeds the player(s) exactly where and what to do without requiring them really think or implement any real plans or strategy.)

After all you should be using short controlled bursts and not spraying full auto constantly. Thanks to large amounts of ammo readily available in ACM SCBs didn't really make a huge difference.

Allowing guns to jam or malfunction. This was somewhat implemented for the original AvP games on PC btw.

Other things I can think of that could add suspense are to give significantly less opportunities to heal and recover health and armor or make them more difficult and very situational opportunities.

In Gearbox's ACM there was way too much running and gunning and I don't ever even recall coming close to running dry on any ammo because they gave shit loads of them pretty much every where. Even health and armor was too easy to recover quickly. the worst part is the Modern FPS's concept of "automatic healing", although it was segment-based energy bars. So that's another thing I believed greatly ruined suspense if you asked me. A portable healing concept such as a portable medikit would have been preferred at least IMHO.

Besides if a designer was going for "realism" when they design an Aliens game, then there really should not be a constant situation throughout the entire game where the player is a "One Man Army".

Besides, Colonial Marines were meant work together as squads and units in order to survive.

It just makes very little to no sense for them to fight off dozens to hundreds of Aliens entirely by themselves.

And if you remember 2 squads of Marines were sent in to investigate what happened on LV426, otherwise if possible then why didn't they just simply send One Individual that is a Marine?

I get what you mean regarding indestructible "friendly" NPCs in Single Player (and stupidly for Co-Op) modes. They did get in the way more than actually help much. Seriously, the designers and developers of the game should have changed Co-Op in the update patches to allow players to replace the roles of some of those friendly NPCs. It would have made things much more interesting in Co-Op, but again not much they could really do anymore because the game was too scripted and linear to begin with.

Basically anything that actually makes the squad of marines commanded by actual players to work together in order to make it out alive in the game. Requiring players to stick together to increase their odds of actually being able to survive and complete the level and ditch entire COD-ish concepts of being over scripted and linear with constant running and gunning.

The recent 4GB update makes the game a lot tougher, but only in terms of the speed and strength of the xenos, rather than their AI (and their blood), which is a missed oppurtunity IMO.

I'm not going to lie, though. For all of the game's faults, I enjoyed ACM. I just wish that it had fewer SGWW trappings and more oldschool action and suspense.

I got ACM on my PS3 so I don't have the opportunity to experience the graphical aspects of the updates, but I think the AI modifications are more or less the same for both console and PC editions. I have yet to check them out. I don't really play network online games so updating was not forced nor required, still on the regular unpatched factory version of the game.

I enjoyed ACM also despite it's many flaws, but my expectations were really low after what happened with AvP 2010 any way

And because I knew they weren't going to make this into another "one man army" styled Aliens game .

[scalliano]

I have both of the oldskool PC AvP's. AvP Gold has more in common with classic Quake IMO (no bad thing in itself) and AvP2 for my money is much closer to what an Aliens game should be - you're constantly on your guard because those things are fast. It also chucks in a few of its own ideas (ALICE has to be my favourite ).

I get what you're saying about squad-based gameplay, and I agree. I was more referring to having the odd scenario in the game where you are separated from your team for whatever reason. Of course you wouldn't want a one-man army scenario all the way through, but you wouldn't want it to be Rainbow Six: LV-426, either.

Really didn't mean to derail the thread this much :/

[Inglorious]

AVP2 was good but had terrible weapon balance in multiplayer.

[Valherran]

AVP2 was good but had terrible weapon balance in multiplayer.

*COUGH* Sniper Rifle *COUGH*, plus a few others. lol

Predators were fodder in multiplayer, I killed them with little effort, and the only other OP thing in that game was the Runner Alien.

[Inglorious]

Marines were so OP in AVP 2 multiplayer. If you played Predator you had to spam the Disc just to stand a chance. The Alien dash was OP too. A shame that the source code never got out.

[Inglorious]

Okay, I beat it. Man does that Queen sprite from Trilogy not hold up well. Overall I liked it. 2nd to last level had too many ambushes for my taste and having to fall back down to the Hive after getting the yellow key was pretty cheap (Only time I used IDCLIP in the entire run). First Queen fight was fun. 2nd one wasn't so much. I thought it was like the end of AVP Classic 2000 where you had to set up the air lock and blast her out but nope. I liked the placement of the egg though.

My only complaint would be a weak final boss fight and the Queen sprite looking so wretched. I personally would have just copied how Classic 2000 did it. I'd give it a 9/10 as a game. 10/10 as Doom mod.

*Edit: is it even possible to rip the sprites from the Jaguar AVP game? Because those sprites could look really good in this mod.

[ObsessedWithMODs]

Okay, I beat it. Man does that Queen sprite from Trilogy not hold up well. Overall I liked it. 2nd to last level had too many ambushes for my taste and having to fall back down to the Hive after getting the yellow key was pretty cheap (Only time I used IDCLIP in the entire run). First Queen fight was fun. 2nd one wasn't so much. I thought it was like the end of AVP Classic 2000 where you had to set up the air lock and blast her out but nope. I liked the placement of the egg though.

Actually the Alien Queen sprite used in Deimos's MOD is a custom one so it was Not ripped directly from Alien Trilogy.

If you open the PK3 file via SLADE or XWE you can get more info on it.

Actually, if you download DrDoctor's E3M1 Alien Host Ship level you may be able to get more information regarding the current Alien Queen sprites by using XWE or SLADE.

All I know is that it is a new and different one and it is better than Justin Fisher's motion capture version of the Kenner action figure, but it still has flaws. It just looks much closer to the way the Queen appeared in the film than a toy.

My only complaint would be a weak final boss fight and the Queen sprite looking so wretched. I personally would have just copied how Classic 2000 did it. I'd give it a 9/10 as a game. 10/10 as Doom mod.

I thought the way to beat the Queen with the Marine in Classic 200 was too short easy and scripted. Besides you are limited and restricted to killing her with using Only the Airlock.

It's just not very flexible, and too linear is how I look at it. Its quite easy once you have the timings of everything right, but still harder compared to how easy the Queen can be beaten on the last level of GearBox's official game.

The only exception to the limitations and restrictions mentioned above is if you use the debug commands to "cheat" and give yourself the SADAR or Minigun.

As those are the "Only" weapons that are adequate in inflicting lethal damage for you to kill her and end the mission.

Personally I would still prefer using the Power Loader to fight and destroy the Queen like how Ripley did, even if it means grabbing her with it and dropping her down an airlock. So far this has only been implemented like once in all of Aliens video games history (see Konami's Aliens arcade game).

I know many have tried to duplicate that feeling from gameplay mechanics but it's quite hard. The Power Loader implemented in the earliest TCs and Mods for Doom was just a modified set of sprites and slightly modified gameplay mechanics of the Doom's Chainsaw weapon.

Don't know if it's possible to try and duplicate the effect of how Ripley grabs the Queen with the Loader, lifting her up and dropping her into the Airlock. All of that into a set of modified gameplay mechanics.

Of course the Queen still counteracted this by grabbing onto the legs of the Loader.... though that doesn't really have to be duplicated. But if possible, I would like to see that, highly unlikely for a Doom Source Port.

Other than that, blasting her with various Colonial Marine weaponry and flanking repeatedly as a Full (or Small) Squad of Marines is the only other scenario I would prefer to have.

*Edit: is it even possible to rip the sprites from the Jaguar AVP game? Because those sprites could look really good in this mod.

I could have sworn I saw sprite rips of the Predator's weapons from Rebellion's Jaguar AvP game in this thread: Aliens Doom TC: Special Edition

So yea, I don't think it's impossible. I also saw sprite rips of the Marine's weapons somewhere on this board although it was only an archived compressed file.

[NostalgicAlgorithms]

Despite its crude technology and OP leveling system for Marines, Aliens Online was the only tactical Aliens themed game that succeeded in feeling like the movie. The Devs can try and explain their way out of every fault or mistake with ACM, but it doesn't change the fact it didn't live up to what many long time fans wanted. They teased us with a tasty banana split desert and only gave us vanilla ice cream with some sprinkles.

[Inglorious]

Valve needs to make an AVP game.

[NostalgicAlgorithms]

The AVP sprites are not as good as you think. While they look fantastic on a old CRT tv when playing on the JAG they have very few frames of animation. The marine was actually a employee who had an entire USCM costume. He was digitized and imposed into the game. Anyone else own a full suit? I got a digital camera! We can make this happen...

I actually vote for Firaxis to make the next Aliens game. It may take forever and is perhaps out of their realm of experience but hear me out. They did manage to successfully reboot the Xcom series which is a masterful achievement in its own right. At this point the torch needs to be handed off to someone else.

[hornfluffy]

Really fantastic Aliens Mod, better than that piece of crap Aliens colonial Marines that just came out. However there are a few major annoyance that almost ruined the entire mod.Things you should consider fixing to make it fun and enjoyable.

-The maps are really, really, really dark, almost too dark. I found myself loosing my way multiple times or not being able to see whats attacking me because it was so dark. So either fix the shoulder mounted flashlight or at least make the flares unlimited, and possible different colors like red or green.
-Level confusion, layout- you have to make it easier to navigate, you can't expect players to automatically no where to go. Especially when there huge really dark dimly lit maps like this. Give hints, like signs that give directions every once and a while, doors that are unlocked are lit up a little more than the others, arrows on the walls, things like that.also consider making some of the area a bit lighter, the whole level is just a big black hole.
-I don't know how you'd do it but a working motion tracker would be nice.
-Some how make it so you can read your objectives again, since the text comes and goes too damn fast.
-I know its survival horror but you have to make it playable, either make the enemies slightly weaker or make ammo and health much more available
-The predators are way too over powered
-The predator map is very hard to navigate, consider making some trails at least, all the trees look the same and its confusing to see where your going.
-pulse rifle should have a grenade launcher feature, even the old aliens tc had that.
-using music from the original films would be AWESOME, it would add a whole new level of immersion, or you can look for a composer for your mod I know on newgrounds people are always willing to make music for free.
-I found the limited burst of the smart gun annoying
-whats up with the face hugger? you cant get it off! either have it kill you or give the option to kill it.
-if you really want to add a whole new level of immersion add some ambient background noises like steam and pipes clanging to keep the player on edge, and of you wanted to create the greatest mod of all time you could add audio logs like in bioshock by using voice actors, again newgrounds has loads of good voice actors willing to work for free.

[ObsessedWithMODs]

Really fantastic Aliens Mod, better than that piece of crap Aliens colonial Marines that just came out. However there are a few major annoyance that almost ruined the entire mod.Things you should consider fixing to make it fun and enjoyable.

-The maps are really, really, really dark, almost too dark. I found myself loosing my way multiple times or not being able to see whats attacking me because it was so dark. So either fix the shoulder mounted flashlight or at least make the flares unlimited, and possible different colors like red or green.

I've been mentioning it a few times about this myself regarding implementing a shoulder lamp in a future revision although one important thing I want everyone to keep in mind is that Deimos is only a mapper and not a coder.

Implementing a shoulder lamp requires coding work and adjustments. So if any one out there knows ACS scripting or whatever is required to implement a shoulder lamp is reading this, mind trying to see if you could help by editing this mod and implementing a usable Shoulder lamp please? We could really use a helping hand here, of course it would be best to ask for permission from Deimos first, just in case if there would be any disputes, etc.

I know I'd really appreciate it. Thanks

-Level confusion, layout- you have to make it easier to navigate, you can't expect players to automatically no where to go. Especially when there huge really dark dimly lit maps like this. Give hints, like signs that give directions every once and a while, doors that are unlocked are lit up a little more than the others, arrows on the walls, things like that.also consider making some of the area a bit lighter, the whole level is just a big black hole.

I think implementing "marking" flares could help. I remember how Ripley used them to help her back track her way back to the main Elevators after rescuing Newt to return to the platform where the Dropship had landed and standing by.

-I don't know how you'd do it but a working motion tracker would be nice.

Somebody did code a version of it for the Foxtrot Uniform mod but it's awfully unstable. This is a really tough one to get right without the game constantly crashing I suppose. Well, once again if anyone out there really experienced at coding, we could really use your help on this also.

-Some how make it so you can read your objectives again, since the text comes and goes too damn fast.

Have you tried bringing up the Console and see if the text is visible there?

-I know its survival horror but you have to make it playable, either make the enemies slightly weaker or make ammo and health much more available

Or more like make it less "One Marine Army" throughout the ENTIRE game.

Change it up somewhat to maybe just the first 2 Maps you are all alone, but by the 3rd map you are allowed to regroup with your Marine Squad that are well Coded AI. After all Marines weren't suppose to really be able to survive fighting large numbers of Aliens, so that's why they have Squads and Units of Marines. That's why they send in 2 Squads of marines in the movie and even then 2 Squads was nearly wiped out immediately when they walked into an ambush and did not realize it until it was too late. So there you have it, if 2 Squads would be killed off fairly quickly by large numbers of Xenomorphs it's even more unbelievable for a Lone Marine to survive against that same large number of hostiles, realistically (regardless of an abundance supply of Health and Ammo recovery pickups).

-The predators are way too over powered

That's why I would prefer to have Terminators in a future AvP game all just to CRUSH Predators (but then they'd probably Crush the Humans and Aliens just as easily too).

But well this is ACM and not AvPvTerminator/SkyNet, but I'm sure the Predators here were only there for the Bonus Episode Missions.

And isn't it almost always that the Preds are way TOO DAMN POWERFUL in almost every AvP game out there???!!! The only exception was AvP2, since many of their abilities and attributes had been nerf'd.

Still, I would love to see Preds get their asses handed to them by SkyNet's forces, then maybe the Predators would stop getting so much unnecessary attention and be in the spotlight almost every darn AvP game.

-The predator map is very hard to navigate, consider making some trails at least, all the trees look the same and its confusing to see where your going.

I heard about it earlier from an earlier reply. Maybe someone should just edit that map already and re-optimize it somehow.

-pulse rifle should have a grenade launcher feature, even the old aliens tc had that.

You need to configure the secondary fire button for this one. Which is great, no more switching between a rocket launcher replacement which is what it actually was in the original Aliens TC.

-using music from the original films would be AWESOME, it would add a whole new level of immersion, or you can look for a composer for your mod I know on newgrounds people are always willing to make music for free.

That's already done. It was in Virtue's Aliens TC Special Edition here: viewtopic.php?f=19&t=29122

-I found the limited burst of the smart gun annoying

My only problem with it is that you cannot move when firing it and that the ammo it uses is "shared" between the Pulse Rifle's and the Pistol which is largely inaccurate. So maybe if someone is reading this can try and fix it.

-whats up with the face hugger? you cant get it off! either have it kill you or give the option to kill it.

Not sure what you meant by this, can you be more specific? If you cheat with IDKFA or IDFA you could get penalized with a Facehugged mode when your current weapon runs out of ammo.

-if you really want to add a whole new level of immersion add some ambient background noises like steam and pipes clanging to keep the player on edge, and of you wanted to create the greatest mod of all time you could add audio logs like in bioshock by using voice actors, again newgrounds has loads of good voice actors willing to work for free.

Great advice here and very interesting for letting me know where I can try and outsource voice actors for projects like this one.

[NostalgicAlgorithms]

but you wouldn't want it to be Rainbow Six: LV-426, either.

Now that sounds interesting. It couldn't think of a more tense scenario than reliving the experience at LV426 with a 2 fire teams and a APC at my disposal. Just cut out Burke and Ripley and let us be the Marines!

[hornfluffy]

Hmmm I think I know how you can fix up your predator jungle map to make it more navigable, You could have very tall spaced out tree trunks to simulate trees. That way the player can move throughout the map without getting lost and be able to at least know where the predators attacks are coming from. If you've ever played ghouls forest 3 that's exactly what i'm talking about. Essentially just making tall cylinder shapes covered in a bark texture to simulate trees. Then dot the floor with small ferns and foliage. You could also make the existing tree sprites taller,having the stumps long at the bottom and have all the leaves at the top. By the way I'm pretty good with sound design if you need any ambient background noises to help add immersion to you mod \I'll be glad to help you out.